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    (Original post by JamesR12)
    Nah, I like feeling younger, I feel as if I've lived 2 or 3 years too many. I was overworked as a kid. I'll have conversations with girls which most could class as immature but I'd enjoy them a lot.

    Well I'm not looking to settle down immediately either - I want the girl to be driven and intelligent, but your assertion that essentially 'being driven at 16 is meaningless' isn't one I agree with.
    Fair enough I suppose, I ain't judging. Don't you feel like there's a point you want something more though, someone to share your aspirations with and just talk about, to bluntly put it, more grown up things? I sometimes feel that I think deeper than those my own age.

    It's a stereotype sure but we both know it's usually true. Not to say meaningless but on a different spectrum to that of a 21 year old who knows themselves and their limitations more. It's not even criticising, heck the way i imagined life at 16 is way different to how it is now and I'm only 3 years older than that.


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    (Original post by The.Joker)
    Since you've been talking for only 4 days she might feel like it's progressing too quickly and she probably wants to find out more about you and if your 'Mr Right' for her. Talking with her on FB is a good start since she obviously seems keen on you for wanting to carry on chatting. I say give it a bit more time and let her feel more comfortable talking to you and then set up a date. Also, she might be worried about your intentions for wanting to see her so soon i.e. you only want to have sex with her. It's going to take a little bit of time and you don't want to rush into a relationship just for the sake of it. Good luck Eb, I hope things work out for you.
    Thanks for this Joker, interesting to hear the girls perspective. Yeah, I understand that some folks wouldn't be comfortable meeting someone online they met four days ago...not sure I would tbh. It was just, previously was chatting to a lady for about two weeks, and a friend said I'd left it too long, so this time I figured just go for it. Yeah, I'm not just trying to get sex tbh, that's easy enough at uni, I'm thinking she might be worth the longer game. Thanks again.

    (Original post by Tom_Ford)
    I absolutely disagree, change the state of play. Women are afraid of being rejected by high value men and especially high value men they like. Hell, read the relationship forum threads from young women here, full of angst. With that mind, I am not a betting man, but I bet that if you built up a rapport/banter with her and then ****ed off for a few days... that would definitely **** with her mind. It's all a play.

    There's several facets to this thing.
    1. What you bring to the table. Do you have aspects of yourself that trumps her value? Can you bring it to light without having so much arrogance that turns her away too soon?

    The main "power" of women you speak of in their 20's is that they have choice. If they obviously have this power, take away this power, put yourself into centre stage in her mind. You do this by also having choice in your life and being clever about it without burning the bridges you have built.

    2. Chemistry. I believe this can be created by men who are naturally smooth with it or are experienced after a lot of trial and error. Imo if she is not a slut, you need the chemistry and sometimes the fear of losing you/losing you to a rival for your affection.

    3. Be bold. Men who ponce around get put in the friend zone as they don't have the bravery, it communicates the wrong qualities. It's like being a striker, you don't score if you are not brave. If you miss? Play it down and be unaffected to her face. Call it mistake if you must and move on to other girls whilst keeping her on the backburner.

    These three facets btw are what the stereotypical complaining "nice guy" tend to miss. They have no qualities usually except from being nice. But they were 'nice' right and she should date them because of that? :lol:
    I should have come to the master of dating before hand, cheers Tom. I understand that mind games are required early on. You need to become the Fergie or Mourinho. My record is a bit hit and miss really, perhaps you'd call me the Danny Welbeck of dating. I've had times where I've hit the back of the net (dating) and I've had times where I've hit row z (friendzone). Hopefully this time will be like Wayne Rooney today.

    Yeah man, generally I'm not into that nice guy crap. In first year at uni when I got friendzoned I just ended the friendship despite her pleas and never spoke to her again, I like to be a bit ruthless like that. Generally I prefer my female friends to be ugly/non suitable personalities, just works best for me. What would you do in this scenario? Would you allow a facebook convo? My initial thoughts was leave it a few days and return with a cheeky banterous message joking that she's playing hard to get...but honestly Mr Ford, I'm unsure at this one, not really an expert on online dating. Cheers man.
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    (Original post by Eboracum)
    Thanks for this Joker, interesting to hear the girls perspective. Yeah, I understand that some folks wouldn't be comfortable meeting someone online they met four days ago...not sure I would tbh. It was just, previously was chatting to a lady for about two weeks, and a friend said I'd left it too long, so this time I figured just go for it. Yeah, I'm not just trying to get sex tbh, that's easy enough at uni, I'm thinking she might be worth the longer game. Thanks again.



    I should have come to the master of dating before hand, cheers Tom. I understand that mind games are required early on. You need to become the Fergie or Mourinho. My record is a bit hit and miss really, perhaps you'd call me the Danny Welbeck of dating. I've had times where I've hit the back of the net (dating) and I've had times where I've hit row z (friendzone). Hopefully this time will be like Wayne Rooney today.

    Yeah man, generally I'm not into that nice guy crap. In first year at uni when I got friendzoned I just ended the friendship despite her pleas and never spoke to her again, I like to be a bit ruthless like that. Generally I prefer my female friends to be ugly/non suitable personalities, just works best for me. What would you do in this scenario? Would you allow a facebook convo? My initial thoughts was leave it a few days and return with a cheeky banterous message joking that she's playing hard to get...but honestly Mr Ford, I'm unsure at this one, not really an expert on online dating. Cheers man.
    Yup I like that. And I am not a master of dating lol, I just have some common sense about it.

    Never be too serious, be bold, but never too serious to show you really care. I have my reasons for this but cba to go into the psychology of it. Oh, and never let her dictate the environment too much, sets a bad precedent.

    Re Facebook messaging: "leave it a few days and return with a cheeky banterous message joking that she's playing hard to get" Nah. Don't joke that she's playing hard to get, the only times you should be remotely serious with her is when you are making a move. Keep it light and flirt with her, then when the temperature heats up and she is showing interest and investing more... move away for a few days. Push, pull, push, pull = tension = the closer you get to making a successful move.
    So, the whole point of FB is to create that tension and excitement from her side of things.
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    (Original post by IceJJFish(II))
    Fair enough I suppose, I ain't judging. Don't you feel like there's a point you want something more though, someone to share your aspirations with and just talk about, to bluntly put it, more grown up things? I sometimes feel that I think deeper than those my own age.

    It's a stereotype sure but we both know it's usually true. Not to say meaningless but on a different spectrum to that of a 21 year old who knows themselves and their limitations more. It's not even criticising, heck the way i imagined life at 16 is way different to how it is now and I'm only 3 years older than that.
    I think there's huge maturity in people younger than myself, you just have to find it haha. If you remember the kik debate that we had on approaching girls who have boyfriends, I've had the same debate with two 16 year old girls (the same ones who rated you haha) and it was much less one sided than it was with Luke that day. By the time girls, especially, reach A level age they're not too different from uni goers, only sometimes in worldly knowledge I guess.

    I think being older helps set a natural, friendly kind of dominance/maturity and that probably helps me hide my insecurities as well.
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    (Original post by The.Joker)
    Maybe I can play for the Bangladesh team then haha
    I thought you were the strict hijabi type.

    No competing with men


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    Tbh, I don't give a damn about girls/dating. To me at this point in my life, they are competition and I will **** them over if I need to in order to get ahead.
    I play the game to win. I want the prestige of getting to the most elite companies and positions. And that Oxford MBA postgraduate degree, which is basically like the C.L. trophy to me, it's my dream and means so much more to me than dating. I promised my best mate (who is not here anymore unfortunately) that I will make it and go to Oxford, preferably to his old college. Seeing the emotions that elite footballers go through when they achieve their dreams, I want that, to stand at the top echelons doing things of amazing scale.
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    (Original post by JamesR12)

    I think being older helps set a natural, friendly kind of dominance/maturity and that probably helps me hide my insecurities as well.
    No offence but think it stems down to your last point.

    Not having a go at you here it's an issue in general. It's when girls marry guys old enough to be their father (and vice versa with the whole "toyboy" culture. When people are at different stages in life it doesn't work. Not to say I find an relationship, say, a 25 year old girl with a 45 year old man IF they are at the same stage in life. Problem is, this rarely happens and I just don't see how it is compatible. It's the same with 21 year olds and 16 year olds. On the whole, the average 21 year old is a graduate/final year uni student whilst a 16 year old is either GCSE's or AS Level. It's different stages in life, and in a way they need to be seperate. It makes no difference once in a working environment, to an extent, but in younger years it seems nonsensical to me to date someone out of your stage of life category. Feels like people either need to grow up or value themselves more, usually the latter. Now the common response to this is girls are more mature than guys their own age, it's something that's been drilled into me from society really. I really don't see it- like everything else it is on a situational basis. It's probably come across as a rant and/or bitterness and it probably is to an extent. What I was trying to say anyway that dating someone in a different stage of life to yourself is unwise, and only in theory does it make sense.


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    (Original post by IceJJFish(II))
    No offence but think it stems down to your last point.

    Not having a go at you here it's an issue in general. It's when girls marry guys old enough to be their father (and vice versa with the whole "toyboy" culture. When people are at different stages in life it doesn't work. Not to say I find an relationship, say, a 25 year old girl with a 45 year old man IF they are at the same stage in life. Problem is, this rarely happens and I just don't see how it is compatible. It's the same with 21 year olds and 16 year olds. On the whole, the average 21 year old is a graduate/final year uni student whilst a 16 year old is either GCSE's or AS Level. It's different stages in life, and in a way they need to be seperate. It makes no difference once in a working environment, to an extent, but in younger years it seems nonsensical to me to date someone out of your stage of life category. Feels like people either need to grow up or value themselves more, usually the latter. Now the common response to this is girls are more mature than guys their own age, it's something that's been drilled into me from society really. I really don't see it- like everything else it is on a situational basis. It's probably come across as a rant and/or bitterness and it probably is to an extent. What I was trying to say anyway that dating someone in a different stage of life to yourself is unwise, and only in theory does it make sense.


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    Mainly you just repeated a lot that 'you don't see it working' and you don't give it much explanation? Why can't it work? What are your reasons for it?

    And, well, in general, younger girls are much more mature than guys their age. It's pretty much fact.

    And for me personally, as I've said I'm on the immature/wannabe-youthful side of things and girls in general.
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    (Original post by IceJJFish(II))
    No offence but think it stems down to your last point.

    Not having a go at you here it's an issue in general. It's when girls marry guys old enough to be their father (and vice versa with the whole "toyboy" culture. When people are at different stages in life it doesn't work. Not to say I find an relationship, say, a 25 year old girl with a 45 year old man IF they are at the same stage in life. Problem is, this rarely happens and I just don't see how it is compatible. It's the same with 21 year olds and 16 year olds. On the whole, the average 21 year old is a graduate/final year uni student whilst a 16 year old is either GCSE's or AS Level. It's different stages in life, and in a way they need to be seperate. It makes no difference once in a working environment, to an extent, but in younger years it seems nonsensical to me to date someone out of your stage of life category. Feels like people either need to grow up or value themselves more, usually the latter. Now the common response to this is girls are more mature than guys their own age, it's something that's been drilled into me from society really. I really don't see it- like everything else it is on a situational basis. It's probably come across as a rant and/or bitterness and it probably is to an extent. What I was trying to say anyway that dating someone in a different stage of life to yourself is unwise, and only in theory does it make sense.


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    ^ That is part of the reason why I don't date in the relationship sense of the word. I cba to explain myself and be judged by society for my sexual preferences (women, in case anyone is wondering about the real life me).

    If we are talking about the most accepted widespread conservative dating arrangement it would go like:
    Same race (impractical for me, i am mixed), same (or round about same) age, same religion, same nationality, same education, same socio-economic status.

    But hey, that would make life bloody boring and robotic... not my cup of tea but I am not judging anyone who would try and fit these standards.

    Even in Islam, they have guidance for how men should conduct themselves in regards to multiple wives (e.g. older men marrying younger women in addition to their wives) and I was informed about this by a Muslim mate of mine. The caveat being that you have to provide for her every bit as equally as the other wife/s.
    I would be absolutely fine with this so I find the western ideal of marrying someone of the same "widespread conservative dating arrangement" in a monogamous manner even more constrictive than the Islamic rules. Ironic is it not?
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    (Original post by JamesR12)
    Mainly you just repeated a lot that 'you don't see it working' and you don't give it much explanation? Why can't it work? What are your reasons for it?

    And, well, in general, younger girls are much more mature than guys their age. It's pretty much fact.

    And for me personally, as I've said I'm on the immature/wannabe-youthful side of things and girls in general.
    Again comes to the different stage of life thing. Usually a lack of security in said persons home life, or a deep-rooted insecurity. I find it similar to a mid-life crisis.

    Like I said, I don't see that at all. Obviously, like everyone else, i can only go off the sample size I know but it's absolutely untrue that girls are more mature to such a great extent they find men the same age of them undateable. I imagine this point is moot for most people here as intellectuals who are career motivated as well, maybe it's an adage which holds true to those with less direction in life.


    EDIT: Think Tom essentially put, albeit far more bluntly, a key concept of what I was trying to get across. Like he said I am also bitter about this.

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    (Original post by JamesR12)
    Mainly you just repeated a lot that 'you don't see it working' and you don't give it much explanation? Why can't it work? What are your reasons for it?

    And, well, in general, younger girls are much more mature than guys their age. It's pretty much fact.

    And for me personally, as I've said I'm on the immature/wannabe-youthful side of things and girls in general.

    I don't believe they are, the only thing they are often more mature about is knowing how to suck an older guys ****. It's a facade and these older guys confirm as such. E.g. The silver circle law firm partner I was talking to who was going out with a younger girl.

    And yes, that is partly my bitterness shining through regarding my frustration in my younger days with them and the older guys.
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    (Original post by Tom_Ford)
    x
    That's fair enough. I admit I'm a conservative prick at times though. I have a very idealistic image of my world which I adhere to and, perhaps unfairly, expect those around me to as well. Not to say I'll judge a person quite so shallowly like that, but the principles are the same.


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    (Original post by IceJJFish(II))
    That's fair enough. I admit I'm a conservative prick at times though. I have a very idealistic image of my world which I adhere to and, perhaps unfairly, expect those around me to as well. Not to say I'll judge a person quite so shallowly like that, but the principles are the same.


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    Read my PM, some things cannot be said on a public forum.
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    (Original post by Tom_Ford)
    Read my PM, some things cannot be said on a public forum.
    Cool man, waiting on it.


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    Can't be arsed to reply but Tom you're a top poster.

    I'm a bit pissed. Taxi driver trying to charge me £12 for about two miles ffs

    Walked back and just got in. Some bloke bought me a drink then tried to start a fight on me. I left.
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    Finally going to give that Run The Jewels 2 album a go. Lot of hype to live up to.


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    (Original post by Fizzel)
    Finally going to give that Run The Jewels 2 album a go. Lot of hype to live up to.
    Let us know what you think. Album of the year for me (with Godflesh's new album).

    Why's it taken so long anyway?
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    Want to add some very important additions to the "Chemistry" paragraph section of what I wrote there that ties the whole thing together. The whole point of keeping it non serious has to be added with the intention to create strong feelings from her side. I.e. Don't make her think, make her feel... make her laugh, cry, and dream. If it is a girlfriend you want, this is pretty important. Everyone has a different style of doing this, and it depends on your personality, personally I like a mixture of banter (laughing) , crying and dreaming. So all of it.
    Don't want to write down any examples of interactions because imo the best way people learn is to develop their own style and not be robots.
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    Ffs I'm starting to get gray hairs. Shows up more because my hair is dark too. Anyone else have this? Tempted to just snip them off because there's only around 4 strands, and they're all towards the front of my head.


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    (Original post by Isometrix)
    Ffs I'm starting to get gray hairs. Shows up more because my hair is dark too. Anyone else have this? Tempted to just snip them off because there's only around 4 strands, and they're all towards the front of my head.


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    You are gonna be RvP crew and all grey hair at 29


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