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    (Original post by JoJo9)
    Yep I remember going to a T20 game at The Oval in 2014 and he really impressed me not only hitting domestic bowlers out the ground but also Mitchell McClenaghan. Was able to create the kind of buzz around the ground that mostly comes with the best T20 players and/or innings.

    I'll say it in hush tones but if England keep struggling to find opening partner for Cook in Tests could Roy be England's David Warner in the future? Come about in limited overs and eventually become quick scoring, successful Test batsmen
    Thing is, Warner has struggled in the T20 game since his ascension in Test cricket. He was seen as a white-ball specialist, but he's only played six T20s from the beginning of 2014. That has seen his standard in the format plummet, and he barely shone at this World Twenty20 tournament as a result. He should be spearheading Australia to the semi-finals, or even final.

    Can England afford to do that to Roy?

    (Original post by moment of truth)
    On pitches that don't offer any turn Jadeja is pretty substandard. He is good when he gets a bit of turn cause he varies his pace well and bowls good lines, but he is too one-dimensional when the pitch offers nothing. What you say is true, but as Ashwin is the premier bowler, I would have still preferred him to bowl more. The dew was obviously a factor, too.

    Completely agree.
    In truth, the Indian philosophy on T20 is too reserved. They are seen as the benchmark for the other nations, due to the IPL, but they assess and gauge the conditions too much. They score too slowly - 2s instead of boundaries - which is fine for 9 out of 10 innings against the likes of SL, Bangladesh, Pakistan, because those batting orders are inferior.

    When India come up against a special side, though, like the Windies (or even England when Roy/Root/Buttler/Stokes fire, or Australia/NZ/SA at their absolute optimum) they need to be scoring 200+.

    Too often, they settle for scores of around 180.

    I've already spoken about their low scoring and why it's such an issue, but I think they are probably guilty of picking the wrong players too. They give too many rewards to players who have performed with the red ball, or in the Test/ODI arena. It's similar to England between 2011 and 2015. They are picking the wrong men in their squads and teams.
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    (Original post by Mackay)
    In truth, the Indian philosophy on T20 is too reserved. They are seen as the benchmark for the other nations, due to the IPL, but they assess and gauge the conditions too much. They score too slowly - 2s instead of boundaries - which is fine for 9 out of 10 innings against the likes of SL, Bangladesh, Pakistan, because those batting orders are inferior.

    When India come up against a special side, though, like the Windies (or even England when Roy/Root/Buttler/Stokes fire, or Australia/NZ/SA at their absolute optimum) they need to be scoring 200+.

    Too often, they settle for scores of around 180.

    I've already spoken about their low scoring and why it's such an issue, but I think they are probably guilty of picking the wrong players too. They give too many rewards to players who have performed with the red ball, or in the Test/ODI arena. It's similar to England between 2011 and 2015. They are picking the wrong men in their squads and teams.
    Completely agree, once again. We have 'big hitters' in Raina, Yuvi, Dhoni and Pandya (don't count Jadeja as he has never performed well with the bat), but they often come in too late or are too conservative, especially Yuvi. A top 3 of Sharma, Dhawan and Kohli isn't the most explosive top order. Yeah, Sharma on his day can be as destructive as anyone, but too often he uses up too many deliveries in the first 6 overs and then gets out. Dhawan's record in T20I is not that exciting, to be honest, and we would benefit from having a player like Virender Sehwag again in the top 3.
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    (Original post by Mackay)
    Thing is, Warner has struggled in the T20 game since his ascension in Test cricket. He was seen as a white-ball specialist, but he's only played six T20s from the beginning of 2014. That has seen his standard in the format plummet, and he barely shone at this World Twenty20 tournament as a result. He should be spearheading Australia to the semi-finals, or even final.

    Can England afford to do that with Roy
    That's a very interesting point you make about Warner which I hadn't considered .

    Admittedly England's early-season Test series will overlap with IPL potentially denying Roy useful T20 experience but hopefully Big Bash, English T20 Blast and T20Is will allow Roy to still get enough exposure to T20 to not lag behind

    Also Australia have seemed unsure where there players best positions in T20s are which certainly wouldn't have helped Warner be settled during the World T20. I think the IPL and Big Bash are of a high enough quality to ensure Warner has exposure to enough competitive T20.

    The biggest problem for Warner apart from Aussies unsettled batting order is that they have had a large focus on Test Cricket vs us and New Zealand. Yes, they had some Limited Overs action v India and SA but was it enough to make transition from test cricket to t20 cricket which relies on a slightly different skillset.
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    (Original post by Aky786UK)
    Sharjeel was a positive and in the opening role in T2Os, his scores will help provide a platform for the rest of his batting comrades to truly f it up. Besides Amir, Sarfaraz, Sharjeel, Shah (when he returns), it's difficult to see positives for Pakistani cricket atm.
    The international suffocation of the likes of Babar Azam and Fawad Alam etc is pathetic. Keep going back to tried, tested and failed batsmen.

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    (Original post by moment of truth)
    Completely agree, once again. We have 'big hitters' in Raina, Yuvi, Dhoni and Pandya (don't count Jadeja as he has never performed well with the bat), but they often come in too late or are too conservative, especially Yuvi. A top 3 of Sharma, Dhawan and Kohli isn't the most explosive top order. Yeah, Sharma on his day can be as destructive as anyone, but too often he uses up too many deliveries in the first 6 overs and then gets out. Dhawan's record in T20I is not that exciting, to be honest, and we would benefit from having a player like Virender Sehwag again in the top 3.
    The issue with Raina, I feel, is that I feel the selectors are burdened with putting up with him because they feel they don't have a ready made replacement. The same is true with Yuvraj, to some extent.

    The former was dropped from the ODI setup - and if he's not firing in that format, why is he still included in T20s when he hasn't hit a substantial knock? His high score was 30 - and that came against Bangadesh ffs. Yuvraj seems to be in the XI based on past history, and he is now in the setup after spending two years - TWO years - in the wilderness after being dropped in 2014.

    That suggests a haphazard approach to selection. Why is that the case when the IPL is so good, and so well thought of? India need to be blooding the youngsters proving themselves in the IPL. It's the only way forward.

    Forget reputation, pick the team on potential and form. See what can be achieved by looking at the likes of England and NZ.
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    (Original post by JoJo9)
    Also Australia have seemed unsure where there players best positions in T20s are which certainly wouldn't have helped Warner be settled during the World T20. I think the IPL and Big Bash are of a high enough quality to ensure Warner has exposure to enough competitive T20.

    The biggest problem for Warner apart from Aussies unsettled batting order is that they have had a large focus on Test Cricket vs us and New Zealand. Yes, they had some Limited Overs action v India and SA but was it enough to make transition from test cricket to t20 cricket which relies on a slightly different skillset.
    Australia's preparation has been nothing short of farcical, in truth.

    They put T20s on the backburner last year, when they should have been giving them emphasis ahead of this year's tournament. They don't know their best XI, either.

    Finch should never have been dropped, Khawaja should have come in much earlier but probably at three, and John Hastings should have been given much more of a chance.

    The problems with Australia in the World Twenty20 have been so, so evident. They prepared shoddily an duly got exposed by better outfits, who have better selection policies and setups.
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    (Original post by Mackay)
    The issue with Raina, I feel, is that I feel the selectors are burdened with putting up with him because they feel they don't have a ready made replacement. The same is true with Yuvraj, to some extent.

    The former was dropped from the ODI setup - and if he's not firing in that format, why is he still included in T20s when he hasn't hit a substantial knock? His high score was 30 - and that came against Bangadesh ffs. Yuvraj seems to be in the XI based on past history, and he is now in the setup after spending two years - TWO years - in the wilderness after being dropped in 2014.

    That suggests a haphazard approach to selection. Why is that the case when the IPL is so good, and so well thought of? India need to be blooding the youngsters proving themselves in the IPL. It's the only way forward.

    Forget reputation, pick the team on potential and form. See what can be achieved by looking at the likes of England and NZ.
    Raina is seen as an impact player, for sure. He is the kind of player that can change the game within a couple of overs etc, cause he bats at such a fast rate and can clear the boundary easily. He hasn't been in the greatest of forms recently, and like you said, is playing on reputation. Raina still struggles with the short ball and on pitches that offer something to the bowlers, he doesn't really have the temperament to stick it out. I am still a fan of his though :lol:

    I feel like Yuvraj was picked for his experience, which is important in the World Cup. He didn't score a substantial knock, but he played a few important innings, noticeably against Pakistan and Australia (while injured). He has seemed to lose some of his big hitting ability though.

    A lot of it is down to MS Dhoni. MS has always been a huge fan of both Yuvi and Raina and throughout his captaincy, he has often backed the experienced players rather than play a really young team.

    I feel like now the WC is over, there might be some changes in personnel. Jadeja is another one, yeah he bowls well at times, but he is in the team as an all rounder and he has never played a substantial knock with the bat. But again, MS loves him.

    Let's hope they make some changes and bring in some youth.
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    (Original post by moment of truth)
    I feel like Yuvraj was picked for his experience, which is important in the World Cup. He didn't score a substantial knock, but he played a few important innings, noticeably against Pakistan and Australia (while injured). He has seemed to lose some of his big hitting ability though.

    A lot of it is down to MS Dhoni. MS has always been a huge fan of both Yuvi and Raina and throughout his captaincy, he has often backed the experienced players rather than play a really young team.

    I feel like now the WC is over, there might be some changes in personnel. Jadeja is another one, yeah he bowls well at times, but he is in the team as an all rounder and he has never played a substantial knock with the bat. But again, MS loves him.

    Let's hope they make some changes and bring in some youth.
    I think changes are inevitable - and most notably with Dhoni. Surely we won't see him as captain for that much longer? We've seen him have a good tournament in terms of batting, but I'd argue he hasn't contributed well in terms of his decision making and bowling selection. Giving the ball to Kohli for that final over against the Windies, for instance.

    You look at that, and the impact Sammy/Morgan have had for their respective sides. Neither Sammy or Morgan has had a good tournament. The latter hasn't contributed in terms of a knock, while Sammy doesn't bat or bowl particularly well. And yet, they are captaining sides in the final. They have made big calls - and made them correctly. They inspire their team-mates, and create a healthy working environment and atmosphere for WI/England respectively.
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    (Original post by Mackay)
    I think changes are inevitable - and most notably with Dhoni. Surely we won't see him as captain for that much longer? We've seen him have a good tournament in terms of batting, but I'd argue he hasn't contributed well in terms of his decision making and bowling selection. Giving the ball to Kohli for that final over against the Windies, for instance.

    You look at that, and the impact Sammy/Morgan have had for their respective sides. Neither Sammy or Morgan has had a good tournament. The latter hasn't contributed in terms of a knock, while Sammy doesn't bat or bowl particularly well. And yet, they are captaining sides in the final. They have made big calls - and made them correctly. They inspire their team-mates, and create a healthy working environment and atmosphere for WI/England respectively.
    I don't think he has had such a bad tournament as captain though, yeah the decision to give Kohli the last over was stupid, and I honestly can't see any acceptable reason for it, but apart from that he hasn't been that bad. The bangladesh game comes to mind, I know that the Bangladeshis lost the game in the last over with their shot selection, but Dhoni's presence of mind to run to the stumps on the last ball and deciding where Pandya should bowl (if that is true) were good decisions. I called Dhoni a genius earlier in the tournament, and am going to stick with that.

    His decision to give Ashwin only 2 overs against WI and Australia were strange as well, so he hasn't had the best tournament as captain, but I have seen him captain much worse in the past.

    It's true, both Sammy and Morgan have been pedestrian, at best. Morgan has inspired England to play attacking fearless cricket over the last year or so and should take a lot of credit for the way they play, though.
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    All india need to do is dump raina and shikhar, let rahane/utthapa open on the grounds that they bat through the innings whilst all other partners fire and replace raina with pandey/iyer. yuvraj should get another go perhaps in odi rather than t20 and if he fails then replace him with someone like negi/axar/vohra/rayudu.

    it is a shame as india are chasers similar to NZ preffering to bowl 2nd meaning it doesn't matter so much about the bowling in the first innings ie if ashwin is expensive but still want spin, Yuvi or raina can bowl as part time spinners - what dhoni likes. Instead, they should get the bowlers to improve their bowling and strengthen the batting to set scores not just chase them - meaning specialists can play their roles. Jadeja and negi should be the only all rounders i think but providing pandya can actually bowl decently, then he should also be included.
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    (Original post by moment of truth)
    I don't think he has had such a bad tournament as captain though, yeah the decision to give Kohli the last over was stupid, and I honestly can't see any acceptable reason for it, but apart from that he hasn't been that bad. The bangladesh game comes to mind, I know that the Bangladeshis lost the game in the last over with their shot selection, but Dhoni's presence of mind to run to the stumps on the last ball and deciding where Pandya should bowl (if that is true) were good decisions. I called Dhoni a genius earlier in the tournament, and am going to stick with that.

    His decision to give Ashwin only 2 overs against WI and Australia were strange as well, so he hasn't had the best tournament as captain, but I have seen him captain much worse in the past.

    It's true, both Sammy and Morgan have been pedestrian, at best. Morgan has inspired England to play attacking fearless cricket over the last year or so and should take a lot of credit for the way they play, though.
    Oh, I've definitely seen Dhoni worse. You're right, there.

    (Original post by tazza ma razza)
    All india need to do is dump raina and shikhar, let rahane/utthapa open on the grounds that they bat through the innings whilst all other partners fire and replace raina with pandey/iyer. yuvraj should get another go perhaps in odi rather than t20 and if he fails then replace him with someone like negi/axar/vohra/rayudu.

    it is a shame as india are chasers similar to NZ preffering to bowl 2nd meaning it doesn't matter so much about the bowling in the first innings ie if ashwin is expensive but still want spin, Yuvi or raina can bowl as part time spinners - what dhoni likes. Instead, they should get the bowlers to improve their bowling and strengthen the batting to set scores not just chase them - meaning specialists can play their roles. Jadeja and negi should be the only all rounders i think but providing pandya can actually bowl decently, then he should also be included.
    I think India can definitely feel the most disappointed out of all the sides at the World Twenty20, to be honest.

    Sure, Australia, SA and Pakistan all let themselves down, but India went in as such heavy favourites and not one player has performed, bar Kohli and Dhoni.

    They shouldn't have beaten Bangladesh and were absolutely bailed out in that game, by Bangladesh bottling it. Kohli dragged them - kicking and screaming - into the final four, and I think India can look back at this tournament (in home conditions, no less) as a big chance wasted.
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    Out of interest, what's the reaction been like in India to the team's semi final exit? I remember Dhoni getting hammered when they went out of the 50 over WC and he very cleverly, used levity, to brush away retirement questions with that reporter but not as an Indian fan, still have admiration for the guy. Been captain for nearly ten years IIRC, played non-stop cricket without moaning like others do.
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    (Original post by Aky786UK)
    Out of interest, what's the reaction been like in India to the team's semi final exit? I remember Dhoni getting hammered when they went out of the 50 over WC and he very cleverly, used levity, to brush away retirement questions with that reporter but not as an Indian fan, still have admiration for the guy. Been captain for nearly ten years IIRC, played non-stop cricket without moaning like others do.
    I think the tragedy in Kolkata has gone some to masking the semi-final exit, to be honest. Cricket pales in comparison, but there's no doubt the natives are disappointed.

    I personally loved Dhoni's interaction with the journalist, it was earnest and refreshing and was the mark of a good-natured guy.
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    Not long left :ahee:

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    Worth remembering how much Eoin Morgan and Windies coach Phil Simmons will want to outdo the other and get one over on the other today.

    Simmons was coach of Ireland during that notorious bust-up with Morgan.

    By all accounts, Morgan was a bit of a self-indulgent arse during his younger years. He made no bones about the fact he harboured England aspirations upon his call-up to Ireland, and according to reports, the whole team had to tailor their schedule around Morgan and meetings with his agent/people etc.

    Still, today is about England and the Windies and not two blokes. I think Bayliss' knowledge of Eden Gardens could come into play, but it's clear Badree/Benn are key for WI. England played Tahir safely, Jeffrey Vandersay for SL, and the NZ tio of Santner, Sodhi and McCullum. But can they do it again? Rashid Khan caused them issues for Afghanistan, after all.

    Badree's economy rate is 5.68 runs an over, Benn's is 5.78. Remember how well the former performed in 2012, too? It makes for a great spectacle.
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    big game todayyy
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    Both teams should remain unchanged, I imagine. I can't wait.
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    Chuffed for the West Indies Women :ahee:

    Great performance against the seemingly impenetrable Aussies
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    The WI team will be really inspired from the women's team, you would imagine. The team who wins the toss will have a big advantage.

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    I would be so happy if the men and women won.

    But I do think England is more deserving.
 
 
 
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