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    Snuck the 3rd seed in our league, wrecked it after yet another ****ty start. Roll on the playoffs.
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    I'm our 4th seed yet have the best points average. I feel quite hard done by but I suppose I'm in the mixer for the Championship anyway. I'll take 2 leagues, 2 playoff appearances in my rookie season.
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    (Original post by Wattsy)
    I'm our 4th seed yet have the best points average. I feel quite hard done by but I suppose I'm in the mixer for the Championship anyway. I'll take 2 leagues, 2 playoff appearances in my rookie season.
    Not happy about having to play you this week. I blame the divisions.
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    I kind of backed into the playoffs. I've been in the mix, but have made some questionable personnel decisions...I just can't trust my players to perform well from one week to the next. It's so infuriating. TE has been a mess, Peyton's had a tricky spell...Bradshaw's on IR, Foster's been injured...I've lost Brandon Marshall now....at least I managed to get CJ Anderson...but it's an annoying situation.
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    (Original post by shunter7634)
    Not happy about having to play you this week. I blame the divisions.
    You've won the previous two times! You lost your one game by 0.04 of a point. You think I'm happy about playing you either!?

    I'll be praying every pass Rodgers completes goes to Jordy Nelson! You'll be praying you get the same treatment to Antonio Brown because as it stands I'm starting Roethlisberger. We've got DT vs Sanders in the Denver WR stakes and DT hasn't been fully fit the past 2 weeks. I'm playing the Rams Defense too so we've got a Defensive showdown. It's got all the makings of an epic, not the kind of easy ride to the Championship game we were hoping for though. It'll be fun! if I go 0-3 against you, you have to come back and play again next year so I can prove that this was a fluke.
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    Richard Sherman hasn't allowed a completion in the last three weeks. The kid is freaking ridiculous
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    (Original post by cant_think_of_name)
    Richard Sherman hasn't allowed a completion in the last three weeks. The kid is freaking ridiculous
    Bryon Maxwell isn't exactly bad either....

    One corner who does deserve a bit more respect is Chris Harris Jr. How is he not top ten in pro bowl ranking...I don't know. Only Sherman and Revis can make the case that they are better, in my humble opinion.
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    (Original post by Wattsy)
    You've won the previous two times! You lost your one game by 0.04 of a point. You think I'm happy about playing you either!?

    I'll be praying every pass Rodgers completes goes to Jordy Nelson! You'll be praying you get the same treatment to Antonio Brown because as it stands I'm starting Roethlisberger. We've got DT vs Sanders in the Denver WR stakes and DT hasn't been fully fit the past 2 weeks. I'm playing the Rams Defense too so we've got a Defensive showdown. It's got all the makings of an epic, not the kind of easy ride to the Championship game we were hoping for though. It'll be fun! if I go 0-3 against you, you have to come back and play again next year so I can prove that this was a fluke.
    I was just flicking through the results over the weeks. That win was probably the most enjoyable fantasy moment of my 3 years playing. 0.04. Thats 1 single passing yard. Unreal.

    I have such good match ups this weekend. I just hope it doesn't snow in chi city.
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    Supposedly Cleveland's secondary is rated the best and it's not even close. I can see it myself. The offense has played really poorly for a few games now and they've been kept in it and kind of made Indy's offense look bad for a good portion of the game. I'm not convinced that Manziel is a great long term answer at QB, but his high variance style across a low number of games, coupled with that defense, gives him a great chance of leading the Browns to the playoffs this season IMO.
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    Any other Eagles fans in this thread?

    Looking forward to the Cowboys game :woo:
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    Is it just me that doesn't rate the Browns at all? If you look at their wins there is pretty well two impressive wins there and that was when Andy Dalton **** the bed and the Pittsburgh game where Ben Tate went off. Losses to Jacksonville, Houston and Buffalo as well as near misses against Tennessee, Atlanta and Tampa Bay....

    That said, the secondary is nasty with Whitner and Haden and Manziel coming in combined with Josh Gordon's return means that I can see them winning this game at least. But the Steelers and Ravens have the easier run-ins (the Ravens in particular) so I don't think they'll make the playoffs.
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    (Original post by cant_think_of_name)
    Is it just me that doesn't rate the Browns at all? If you look at their wins there is pretty well two impressive wins there and that was when Andy Dalton **** the bed and the Pittsburgh game where Ben Tate went off. Losses to Jacksonville, Houston and Buffalo as well as near misses against Tennessee, Atlanta and Tampa Bay....

    That said, the secondary is nasty with Whitner and Haden and Manziel coming in combined with Josh Gordon's return means that I can see them winning this game at least. But the Steelers and Ravens have the easier run-ins (the Ravens in particular) so I don't think they'll make the playoffs.
    No. I don't rate the Browns. They have a great secondary...and I see them with Whitner and Tashaun Gibson having the best saftey-partnership outside Seattle. Buffalo are good team...I can buy into them...but the Browns I can't...because they make decisions like the Oakland Raiders do....dropping Hoyer for example. Manziel's ball security against Buffalo was horrible; he was holding it like a briefcase or something....down near his waist. It was only a matter of time before he fumbled...and it's only a matter of time before he fumbles again.

    If you haven't seen the love-in that the media have with Johnny Manziel....look no further than Dave Dameshek's "Reality Shek"...you would think that he's like the second coming of Johnny Unitas or something...Ugh....Hoyer gave them the best chance to win, and the Browns completely undermined his confidence...smh...

    I expect the Bengals to win. In nothing else, they will take great pride in winning the Battle of Ohio and extinguishing Cleveland's playoff hopes. Write it down...the Bengals are back.
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    The one thing I didn't like about the Browns was maybe their playcalling (but it's hard to distinguish between that and decision making TBH) and their decision to take JF in the first and particularly over Bridgewater. It's not just their secondary that looks good, their front put pressure on Luck and has been solid against the run.

    Dropping Hoyer is the right thing to do and it's not even close - even the most blinded JF hater/Hoyer lover should be able to see that. When you have great receivers, a decent line, a great defense that played LIGHTS OUT for a significant portion of the game and you lose because your QB had a comp % in the 40s, with 2 INTs, and that's his third or fourth bad performance in a row, AND you have a QB sitting on the bench that you drafted in the first, just what the hell are you supposed to do????

    Just how well does the defense have to play for Hoyer's "chance to win" to manifest itself in an ACTUAL win?? If they need to play better than they did against the Colts, that just isn't going to happen on a consistent basis. Whichever way you look at it, they need to see what they have in the young QB and you would probably make that call even if it were a guy like Gabbert or Weeden. It seriously boggles my mind that anyone would think otherwise. And no I didn't think Manziel was a first round talent coming out, but that doesn't matter now.
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    (Original post by SmashConcept)
    The one thing I didn't like about the Browns was maybe their playcalling (but it's hard to distinguish between that and decision making TBH) and their decision to take JF in the first and particularly over Bridgewater. It's not just their secondary that looks good, their front put pressure on Luck and has been solid against the run.

    Dropping Hoyer is the right thing to do and it's not even close - even the most blinded JF hater/Hoyer lover should be able to see that. When you have great receivers, a decent line, a great defense that played LIGHTS OUT for a significant portion of the game and you lose because your QB had a comp % in the 40s, with 2 INTs, and that's his third or fourth bad performance in a row, AND you have a QB sitting on the bench that you drafted in the first, just what the hell are you supposed to do????

    Just how well does the defense have to play for Hoyer's "chance to win" to manifest itself in an ACTUAL win?? If they need to play better than they did against the Colts, that just isn't going to happen on a consistent basis. Whichever way you look at it, they need to see what they have in the young QB and you would probably make that call even if it were a guy like Gabbert or Weeden. It seriously boggles my mind that anyone would think otherwise. And no I didn't think Manziel was a first round talent coming out, but that doesn't matter now.
    Rather than getting behind their quarterback, and suggesting that 'he was the guy' for the rest of the season, they did it on a week to week basis, which helped no-one. It totally undermined Hoyer's confidence. Hoyer was good until Cleveland lost its starting center. Their running game also seems to lack a little bit of pop compared to how good it was in the first few weeks. Atlanta, Buffalo and Indianapolis have very underrated secondaries. It looks bad, but in the win against Atlanta, he made plays when the team needed them, and he got them into field goal range. Even when Hoyer gets them into field goal range...at least Billy Cundiff is c l u t c h and can t o t a l l y be trusted to make them, right? also, in just reviewing the Buffalo game...the offense undid themselves with a bunch of penalties. I'm just not convince Johnny "I can't hold the football properly" Manziel gives them a better chance to win...
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    Pro Bowl leaders are announced...

    There's 4 obvious locks at QB and they take the top 4 (Manning, Rodgers, Brady, Luck). Then the other 2 places are still up for grabs with Big Ben and Tony Romo sitting up there. Personally think that Philip Rivers (at 7) should be up there instead of Romo, but I'm not too unhappy with it.

    6 RBs get chosen and as long as Murray, Bell, Lynch, Charles and Foster make it then I'll be happy, the other person in there atm is Forte which is fair enough, though you could make cases for Forsett and Lacy too I think.

    8 WRs... only person missing out that I'd argue with is Julio Jones but then who do you replace him with in the top 8? Crazy that the Packers (Nelson, Cobb) and Broncos (Thomas, Sanders) both have 2 in that top 8 (Maclin, Bryant, Hilton, Brown filling it out).

    I won't even talk about tight end because it's been such a hopeless position this year beyond Gronk and JT. I don't think Graham should make it by name alone though. Mainly because the last two weeks he's been **** for my fantasy team

    O-Linemen... the ENTIRE Cowboys and Packers O-Lines have been voted in. Then you have Joe Thomas, Joel Bitonio, Marshall Yanda, Max Unger, Ryan Clady and Maurkice Pouncey finishing it up.


    Can't be bothered to look at defense but think Ziggy Ansah deserves higher than 7th (over Desmond Bryant who is 6th) and surprised that Haden is higher than Sherman and Revis. Beyond that not too much to say but Cleveland and Seattle dominate the safety category.

    And for some strange reason, Billy Cundiff is ahead of the likes of Tucker, Hauschka, Parkey, Catanzaro and Carpenter?! ok
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    Hahaha, Pro Bowl voting is bull**** again. The only Jag playing like a Pro Bowler doesn't make the list because of small fanbase and low viewership of their games. The defensive votes are just a car crash all around. If there has been nobody outstanding at the position this season the winner is a Cleveland Brown
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    Devin McCourty should definitely be up there but as usual he doesn't get the pro bowl recognition :lol:

    Graham shouldn't make it
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    (Original post by jammy4041)
    Rather than getting behind their quarterback, and suggesting that 'he was the guy' for the rest of the season, they did it on a week to week basis, which helped no-one. It totally undermined Hoyer's confidence. Hoyer was good until Cleveland lost its starting center. Their running game also seems to lack a little bit of pop compared to how good it was in the first few weeks. Atlanta, Buffalo and Indianapolis have very underrated secondaries. It looks bad, but in the win against Atlanta, he made plays when the team needed them, and he got them into field goal range. Even when Hoyer gets them into field goal range...at least Billy Cundiff is c l u t c h and can t o t a l l y be trusted to make them, right? also, in just reviewing the Buffalo game...the offense undid themselves with a bunch of penalties. I'm just not convince Johnny "I can't hold the football properly" Manziel gives them a better chance to win...
    Come on, everyone knows the situation when you draft a QB in the first. At some point, he's meant to play.

    Underrated basically means good but not great. If you want to make the playoffs you can't allow yourself to be totally dominated by good but not great secondaries. And he was bad against Atlanta, that's why he needed to be "clutch" because they had no offense in the second half before the 2 minute warning.

    The one weakness you keep talking about with Manziel is pretty correctable, and there's a fairly good chance that with 2 weeks of focus he will take better care of the ball. It's not exactly hard to hold it with 2 hands instead of one. Manziel is very good when he gets to put air under the ball, which suits and offense that just got one of the best playmaking receivers in the league back (oh yeah, that's another reason you're supposed to be able to play successful offense vs Indy and Buffalo). He can run, which stretches a defense further, and he is probably about as good as Hoyer on shorter throws, at least from a clean pocket. The Browns do a fairly good job of keeping the pocket clean, but Hoyer feels phantom pressure at this point in his regression anyway.
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    On the pro bowl I can kind of see why Julio isn't on there. He is a better player than a few on there like Maclin and Hilton, but he hasn't had his best season. Yanda has been awesome and I think Osemele should have made it too, but OL is always kind of a crapshoot when it comes to getting accolades. If Graham doesn't get in, who goes instead? Like you say, it hasn't been a great year for TEs receiving, and everyone knows they're not going to get in by blocking. Haden has had a better year overall than Sherman, who had a few down-games when the Seahawks were suffering from injuries and he had to play a more island type role. I haven't watched Revis enough to know where he fits in.
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    (Original post by SmashConcept)
    Come on, everyone knows the situation when you draft a QB in the first. At some point, he's meant to play.
    I agree that if you draft a QB in the first, that at some point, he's meant to play, but sitting him, allowing him to learn the playbook, allowing him to get a rapport in training with the wideouts etc, would have been a better course of action. It is dissappointing that the Browns never really got behind their QB, from the day Manziel got drafted. The Browns created a QB controversy, when there really wasn't one to be had. Even when they were winning, and doing well...it was put down to a fluke...and that it was only a matter of time before Johnny Manziel would be playing. Hoyer was always one bad game before the pressure to start Johnny Manziel started to build, and I really think he did not have a fair shake at things....

    Underrated basically means good but not great. If you want to make the playoffs you can't allow yourself to be totally dominated by good but not great secondaries. And he was bad against Atlanta, that's why he needed to be "clutch" because they had no offense in the second half before the 2 minute warning.
    Buffalo have one of the best front sevens in the league. Their secondary is underrated compared to their front seven. In any case, Buffalo have the ability to bring pressure. The Colts have a good secondary, even considering their leading pass rusher is out. Mike Adams is missed in Denver. Hard hitting, and the ability to get picks. Vontae Davis is only just getting the recognition he deserves as one of the best press-corners out there. Atlanta have a okay secondary, but one with the ability to soon be elite. They are a good free-safety away, I think. In anycase, since they have no pass rush at all, and one of the worst front sevens in the league, they don't get the credit they deserve. Desmond Trufant is going to be an absolute stud of a cornerback. William Moore is a big, hard hitting, 'enforcer', of a strong safety.

    My point was that the kicker was not a clutch kicker, and that a lot of the times, Hoyer had managed to get the Browns into FG range (Three points are better than zero, although seven is preferable to both), only to have Cundiff miss it, give the team a short field, and then have them march down the field.

    The one weakness you keep talking about with Manziel is pretty correctable, and there's a fairly good chance that with 2 weeks of focus he will take better care of the ball. It's not exactly hard to hold it with 2 hands instead of one. Manziel is very good when he gets to put air under the ball, which suits and offense that just got one of the best playmaking receivers in the league back (oh yeah, that's another reason you're supposed to be able to play successful offense vs Indy and Buffalo). He can run, which stretches a defense further, and he is probably about as good as Hoyer on shorter throws, at least from a clean pocket. The Browns do a fairly good job of keeping the pocket clean, but Hoyer feels phantom pressure at this point in his regression anyway.

    Hoyer had a rapport with the starting center, and that o-line hasn't been the same since. The Browns are struggling to run the ball with the same pop they did earlier. Buffalo has an excellent rush defense, but their is still no real excuse for 29 yards on 17 attempts, at 1.7 yards a tote. That doesn't help the pass game, when they are consistently faced with third and long all the time. The Browns have had injuries...mostly to the starters who Hoyer has a rapport with already. Jordan Cameron being shut down was a big loss in itself. Against the Colts, both West and Crowell were held to under 4 yards a pop.

    Manziel had a lot of help with an excellent o-line, and a big bodied wide-out in Mike Evans. If he has showed progression with his reads since that bama game last year, then the Browns have a chance. Reads are much harder to correct than ball security, yes...but if an NFL level QB still hasn't worked out that he needs to hold the ball properly...then well...there's probably not too much hope of him working in out anytime soon, to be honest. He's slightly undersized as a QB, but as a scrambling QB, I'd worry about his durability at the next level, as well. RG3 is bigger, and faster, had his knee blown out against the Seahawks and hasn't been the same since.

    If the Browns expect Manziel to be their saviour, he won't be...especially with the run game. If they think he will lead them to the playoffs, they are misguided. In any case, Manziel is getting too much media attention, when he has done jack to deserve it.
 
 
 
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