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    (Original post by leinad2012)
    Was talking to my friend yesterday in the pub about this. We aren't close to top 8 in Europe anymore so it's hardly surprising we lose in the r16 every season. Teams like Monaco, Sevilla, Dortmund, well, in Europe, they're at our level and its about time your average arsenal fan stopped being so high and mighty and accepted that.
    Tbh the only way we'll break the cycle of scraping second then losing in r16 (which we possibly won't even manage this season) is by winning the league and getting put in pot 1 and even then I wouldn't be optimistic.
    You were in pot 1 for donkeys years though and still struggled. If anything it's worse now that you can get teams like Real Madrid in pot two

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    (Original post by sr90)
    You were in pot 1 for donkeys years though and still struggled. If anything it's worse now that you can get teams like Real Madrid in pot two

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    Yes very true, but Real Madrid are the only excellent side in pot 2, in pot 1 there's Bayern,Barca, PSG etc. Different gravy mate to the Dortmunds, Napolis etc (who'd still top any group with if in anyway).
    Chelsea's group is infinitely better than ours and City's because they were in pot 1.

    Tbh the thought of 3rd worries me, so much so I'd almost rather we have up and let Zagreb beat us so we don't get 3rd.

    I mean do what if we lose a couple mill, we'd only play 2 games whether in Europa or CL you'd hope.
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    United came last in their group 10 seasons ago. But on the last group game they still had a chance to go through. It most likely won't be the case with us.
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    (Original post by shawn_o1)
    United came last in their group 10 seasons ago. But on the last group game they still had a chance to go through. It most likely won't be the case with us.
    It can't happen.
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    Can anyone see Wenger telling his team to lose on purpose and finish 4th in the group though?

    Tough call since you play Dynamo Kiev next so you have to beat them for any hopes of finishing 2nd (and hope Olympiakos lose) but if you beat them then you're guaranteed to finish 3rd.
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    (Original post by Zerforax)
    Can anyone see Wenger telling his team to lose on purpose and finish 4th in the group though?

    Tough call since you play Dynamo Kiev next so you have to beat them for any hopes of finishing 2nd (and hope Olympiakos lose) but if you beat them then you're guaranteed to finish 3rd.
    You mean Dinamo Zagreb? Kiev already have a different London club in their group, which they played twice.
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    (Original post by shawn_o1)
    You mean Dinamo Zagreb? Kiev already have a different London club in their group, which they played twice.
    Yea sure that one
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    Wenger's decision to start Campbell wasn't vindicated in the end. Could he have started Flamini? Fair enough, the latter is nowhere near his prime, but you'd imagine his combatant nature and physical edge may have led you to exerting some sort of control.
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    (Original post by Zerforax)
    Can anyone see Wenger telling his team to lose on purpose and finish 4th in the group though?

    Tough call since you play Dynamo Kiev next so you have to beat them for any hopes of finishing 2nd (and hope Olympiakos lose) but if you beat them then you're guaranteed to finish 3rd.
    Can see it now, beat Zagreb, go to Olympiakos... Win 2-1, go out on away goals. Coq gets injured. No Jan signing to replace him. Europa league and injuries ruin title hopes. Banter ensues Wouldn't even be mad, would laugh almost as hard as when Flam went final form vs Spurs with that volley. Didn't celebrate, just burst out laughing at the hilarity of the situation.
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    Super Sayan Flamini has to be the best moment in our history.
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    (Original post by Zerforax)
    Can anyone see Wenger telling his team to lose on purpose and finish 4th in the group though?

    Tough call since you play Dynamo Kiev next so you have to beat them for any hopes of finishing 2nd (and hope Olympiakos lose) but if you beat them then you're guaranteed to finish 3rd.
    I'd say that if Wenger genuinely wanted to finish 4th, he'd play a very weak team - something similar to the side that faced Sheffield Wednesday, where we're almost certain to lose.

    Us winning with a weak team would be such an Arsenal thing to do :lol:
    But I guess Wenger would continue to play that side in the Europa then..

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    (Original post by SA-1)
    I'd say that if Wenger genuinely wanted to finish 4th, he'd play a very weak team - something similar to the side that faced Sheffield Wednesday, where we're almost certain to lose.

    Us winning with a weak team would be such an Arsenal thing to do :lol:
    But I guess Wenger would continue to play that side in the Europa then..

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    I just don't see Wenger doing it.

    He's too much of a optimist and has too much integrity in my opinion. He won't give up CL until it is mathematically impossible to qualify (Bayern should batter Zagreb).

    Having success in the Europa League has helped quite a few Spanish sides in recent years. Not sure why English fans are so arrogant about the competition.
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    Would this be the first time Ar5ena1 will have failed to qualify out the group stages under Wenger?

    I wouldn't turn your nose too much at the Europa League, considering the lack of trophies Arsenal have had over recent years plus I think it carries a bit more weight to it now.
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    (Original post by Mackay)
    Wenger's decision to start Campbell wasn't vindicated in the end. Could he have started Flamini? Fair enough, the latter is nowhere near his prime, but you'd imagine his combatant nature and physical edge may have led you to exerting some sort of control.
    FFS I know Flamini scored twice against the Spuds but he is absolutely, diabolically ****. Where has this sudden narrative come from that he is some amazing, B2B beast who controls the midfield? We needed to play Campbell on the right wing because Debuchy would've been crucified on his own, and even with Flamini, we would've been murdered. All his physical edge would have done is get him a red card.
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    (Original post by Zerforax)
    I just don't see Wenger doing it.

    He's too much of a optimist and has too much integrity in my opinion. He won't give up CL until it is mathematically impossible to qualify (Bayern should batter Zagreb).

    Having success in the Europa League has helped quite a few Spanish sides in recent years. Not sure why English fans are so arrogant about the competition.
    I don't get it either.

    It gets almost as many coefficient points ad the CL would.

    The winners are guaranteed a place in the CL so if Spurs or Liverpool actually took it seriously we could potentially have 5 teams in the CL.

    & it adds to the mentality. Athletico won it & went on the reach the CL finals the following season.. Chelsea won it & reached semi's the following season

    We're literally the only nation who doesn't give a **** about it for some reason

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    (Original post by SA-1)
    I don't get it either.

    It gets almost as many coefficient points ad the CL would.

    The winners are guaranteed a place in the CL so if Spurs or Liverpool actually took it seriously we could potentially have 5 teams in the CL.

    & it adds to the mentality. Athletico won it & went on the reach the CL finals the following season.. Chelsea won it & reached semi's the following season

    We're literally the only nation who doesn't give a **** about it for some reason

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    I think England don't care about it because the top has been slightly more fluid in recent years. If we still had the old "Sky four" of Man Utd, Chelsea, Arsenal and Liverpool who always finished top 4, then the likes of Spurs/Everton etc would have taken EL more seriously.

    However Man City gatecrashed the "Sky four" so Liverpool dropped out. You had Everton and Spurs finish 4th as a one-off too so suddenly everyone thinks they have a chance to finish top 4 and are happy to sacrifice EL to potentially improve their top 4 chances.
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    (Original post by Mackay)
    Wenger's decision to start Campbell wasn't vindicated in the end. Could he have started Flamini? Fair enough, the latter is nowhere near his prime, but you'd imagine his combatant nature and physical edge may have led you to exerting some sort of control.
    where the **** did you pull this thought out from?

    Cazorla and Coq were our 2 CDM partners, why would we put Flamini on the RW?
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    (Original post by Nichrome)
    Would this be the first time Ar5ena1 will have failed to qualify out the group stages under Wenger?

    I wouldn't turn your nose too much at the Europa League, considering the lack of trophies Arsenal have had over recent years plus I think it carries a bit more weight to it now.
    Nope, it happened 16 years ago. In between, City Utd Liverpool and yes Chelsea all did the same
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    Soul II Soul back to life

    Too many people thought a result would happen. Bayern and oly draw next time round and it's over. Can start to dream of ties in the stans.
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    in hindsight we should be glad Benzema didn't come here
 
 
 
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