Poor Uni, High Grade Watch

joe_t_87
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#81
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#81
(Original post by chocolat321)
By the way, are you attempting to get into FO?
I'd like to get into S&T because i've spent the last 7 years trading profitably out of my own account. Believe it or not i'm not that bad, I self fund my studies, trading is my only income and I drive a £40k car (trust me, I need to be at least a semi-decent investor just to pay for the fuel, 11mpg :eek: ) I also un-officially (for legal reasons) manage a few pension accounts for family friends.

I have plenty of UCAS points, 10 A-Cs at GCSE, but I understand my choice of Uni will not get me in to FO so i'm aiming for operations. I went to an Ops workshop at GS back in november, there was 45 of us there and one of the senior staff spoke with everyone personally and only took my name down because out of everyone in the room, I was the only person who understood the business.

I'm not worried about getting a job, i'm worried about getting through the auto-filters. IF i can manage to land an interview, I know I will be ok.
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Einheri
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#82
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#82
(Original post by chocolat321)
No, I'm not. But I get irritated by the elitist attitude on here (TSR).
I don't see why. Would you be offended if someone said a gourmet meal cooked by Gordon Ramsey is better than a slice of cold month-old pizza? No, you wouldn't, and the comparison between those two meals is pretty much the same in terms of difference in quality between UEL and, for example, UCL.
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joe_t_87
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#83
it's probably because you have gone to the extreme and said that a degree from UEL is more harmful on your CV than not putting a degree at all!

It's still a university.

Also the reason why barclays come to the uni is because UEL is one of, if not, the most ethnically diverse universities in the country. They seek to take on students who have mixed with cultures from every corner of the world.

Places like oxford and cambridge are full of stuck up little white kids who live in their own worlds. They may think they have lived because they have been on the cliche Spa Travel package to thailand and south america but they've always had daddy to bail them out.

The world is changing, power is shifting from the West and towards these emerging economies. Degree or no degree, an arrogant oxbridge child may no longer be as useful to a bank as somewhen who has been immersed in a class of 45 students, all from a different nation.
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chocolat321
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#84
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#84
(Original post by joe_t_87)
I'd like to get into S&T because i've spent the last 7 years trading profitably out of my own account. Believe it or not i'm not that bad, I self fund my studies, trading is my only income and I drive a £40k car (trust me, I need to be at least a semi-decent investor just to pay for the fuel, 11mpg :eek: ) I also un-officially (for legal reasons) manage a few pension accounts for family friends.

I have plenty of UCAS points, 10 A-Cs at GCSE, but I understand my choice of Uni will not get me in to FO so i'm aiming for operations. I went to an Ops workshop at GS back in november, there was 45 of us there and one of the senior staff spoke with everyone personally and only took my name down because out of everyone in the room, I was the only person who understood the business.

I'm not worried about getting a job, i'm worried about getting through the auto-filters. IF i can manage to land an interview, I know I will be ok.
I suppose you have reasonable goals, in that case.
It would be ideal if you do a Masters at a top university though, especially since you seem suited to a FO position.
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chocolat321
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#85
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#85
(Original post by Einheri)
I don't see why. Would you be offended if someone said a gourmet meal cooked by Gordon Ramsey is better than a slice of cold month-old pizza? No, you wouldn't, and the comparison between those two meals is pretty much the same in terms of difference in quality between UEL and, for example, UCL.
As I said before, I don't think any degree can be worthless. I was simply commenting on that. I already said that I agree that it's not exactly the best university around.
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joe_t_87
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#86
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#86
I spoke to a top 10 uni the other day and they said that having a 2:1 from UEL should be no problem for me to get on to a masters course.
Thanks for your advice chocolat321. I just needed some opinions and your words have been constructive. It's a shame some people join this forum simply to be rude. Unfortunatley there is no place for arrogance in IB and i'm sure their characters won't last long in this industry.
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invictus_veritas
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#87
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(Original post by ArcaneAnna)
Agreed with the above. Masters from a more 'prestigeous' uni would benifit you.

But does is matter if you get an A in a subject in a state school that ranks at the bottom of the list or in the most expensive public school? No. It's still the same qualification.
The only difference, and the only reason the 'better' uni's have a higher acceptancy rate in firms is because they have the correct 'circle of friends'.
People have become somewhat naive, thinking that they can get through life simply on good qualifications. Knowing the right people is still the main path to good careers.


However.....you can just not mention that you've been to uni and just list all your experiences and skills.
As long as you know what you're doing, are confident that you do it well.....insist on an interview where you can show 1st hand just how good you are (if you are, that is.)
I speak from personal experience (somewhat...) a family friend of ours owns a very substancial bank in Russia, and he never went to school past the age or 16.
##]]

no a 2:1 is not equivalent across universities. Some 2:1s are much harder to gain than others.

We sit exams set by the university we're at. Standards vary significantly across universities otherwise nobody would bother attempting to get into any university that wasn't their local one unless they particularly hated their parents.

a person who got a first in accounting would I think possibly not even be able to get a pass at one of the elite universities which offers finance related degrees e.g. LSE/ Warwick etc.

Why?

Because the standards are so much higher, it's like comparing apples and oranges.

He's done very well at a much easier course and the questions just aren't comparable because the standard is so inferior.

It's practically worthless for the kind of career in IB he wants to pursue.

It is a degree and he can do some very good jobs with it, but just not ones in IB because ultimately he stands no chance against all the people with 500+ points at A level and a 2:1 in a seriously difficult degree.

Anyone on the LSE's finance course could go to UEL and get an 80% average with the bare minimum of effort.

How do I know this?

A while ago I compared (with a few friends) returned exam scripts from several universities which included Manchester and the LSE as well as a few others and like Manchester's exams are a joke. They have multiple choice questions for compulsory economics/ maths modules which are ridiculously easy in comparison to LSE.

Manchester is ranked far, far above UEL so it makes me shudder to think how poor the standards must be there if Manchester's are considered fairly high for a university.

It's not his fault, it's the lack of information available that encourages people to take **** courses at **** universities which land them jobless with a whole load of debt.
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invictus_veritas
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#88
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#88
(Original post by joe_t_87)
I spoke to a top 10 uni the other day and they said that having a 2:1 from UEL should be no problem for me to get on to a masters course.
Thanks for your advice chocolat321. I just needed some opinions and your words have been constructive. It's a shame some people join this forum simply to be rude. Unfortunatley there is no place for arrogance in IB and i'm sure their characters won't last long in this industry.
yes a masters course, that's far different to getting into an IB where you need a strong track record of intellectual achievement. A track record you simply don't have with your BTEC and going to UEL.

These are completely different things, to be a good academic you need to be good at working in an academic environment, which you obviously are extremely good at doing. However academic intelligence isn't the intelligence you need for IB and your course doesn't demonstrate that kind of intelligence, which ultimately you may have, but you haven't obtained the signal needed by doing your course there.

If you do an Msc in finance at somewhere like the LSE or Warwick and do well then you stand as good a chance as someone who's come from there having done an undergrad, possibly better however UEL definitely doesn't prepare you for the rigour of those courses and a lot of people go to these universities for masters from universities like UEL and completely fail. They are happy to take you in and take your money though.
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invictus_veritas
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#89
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(Original post by joe_t_87)
it's probably because you have gone to the extreme and said that a degree from UEL is more harmful on your CV than not putting a degree at all!

It's still a university.

Also the reason why barclays come to the uni is because UEL is one of, if not, the most ethnically diverse universities in the country. They seek to take on students who have mixed with cultures from every corner of the world.

Places like oxford and cambridge are full of stuck up little white kids who live in their own worlds. They may think they have lived because they have been on the cliche Spa Travel package to thailand and south america but they've always had daddy to bail them out.

The world is changing, power is shifting from the West and towards these emerging economies. Degree or no degree, an arrogant oxbridge child may no longer be as useful to a bank as somewhen who has been immersed in a class of 45 students, all from a different nation.
This demonstrates that you're far too ignorant to ever get into IB.

If you truly believe these things that you're saying then you'll fail an interview which likely will be by someone who graduated with a first from Oxbridge/ LSE/ Warwick/ UCL, probably went to a private school and miraculously didn't reject you straight out maybe because HR misread your CV.

Top firms come to your university for the same reason that Harvard spends millions going into inner cities on outreach programmes. It's to be politically correct so politicians stop bothering them. If you actually find some statistics for UEL alumni who made it into the higher echelons, or even the lower echelons of banking you'll find virtually none and ultimately it's for a reason. There will undoubtedly be some in yesterday's world, so people who are in their thirties/ forties now, but the world is becoming far more competitive and with it a degree from UEL more useless. You used to be able to go to UEL and stand a very good chance of getting into any bank but that has changed now so many people go to university and it's ranked so low.

It's not your fault granted - IMHO standards should be the same across universities and people should just fail if they can't make the grade, but instead they get false hopes like you have.

Hell maybe you are bright enough, so if you think you are then to maximise your chances do a masters in finance at a top university like LSE/ Warwick/ Cambridge/ Oxford (if any of them accept you) and if you don't fail you stand a very good chance and are probably bright enough.

So here's my challenge: prove us wrong and enhance your chances significantly at the same time.
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chocolat321
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#90
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#90
(Original post by joe_t_87)
I spoke to a top 10 uni the other day and they said that having a 2:1 from UEL should be no problem for me to get on to a masters course.
Thanks for your advice chocolat321. I just needed some opinions and your words have been constructive. It's a shame some people join this forum simply to be rude. Unfortunatley there is no place for arrogance in IB and i'm sure their characters won't last long in this industry.
That's good then. Try and get into a good postgraduate programme. Best of luck!
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JordanLloyd
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#91
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Places like oxford and cambridge are full of stuck up little white kids who live in their own worlds. They may think they have lived because they have been on the cliche Spa Travel package to thailand and south america but they've always had daddy to bail them...

OP This seems overly controversial, regardless of education Oxbridge graduates pass through the filter you're having trouble with..
In terms of more constructive advice could you reapply to Southampton (not sure where it ranks in terms of course) as you seem keen on it or do you want/need to be in London? Your marks seem to warrant a less troublesome university and if you're experienced in terms of work then this can only be a plus whilst you still have the option to do so.
Ps I have some knowledge of the system from a friend considering this kind of career.
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Milch
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#92
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(Original post by joe_t_87)
I spoke to a top 10 uni the other day and they said that having a 2:1 from UEL should be no problem for me to get on to a masters course.
Thanks for your advice chocolat321. I just needed some opinions and your words have been constructive. It's a shame some people join this forum simply to be rude. Unfortunatley there is no place for arrogance in IB and i'm sure their characters won't last long in this industry.
You need to read 'Damn it feels good to be a banker'. :cool:
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WokSz
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#93
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(Original post by joe_t_87)
Unfortunatley there is no place for arrogance in IB and i'm sure their characters won't last long in this industry.
I'm not sure what Finance you're talking about, but the one I've seen and experienced is full of it. Whether it's right or wrong is not really the point here. If one wants to get into this world, one needs to learn to either play by the rules or get thrown out. Granted, there is no place for absolute idiots, but in order to make it you have to have a hard head and be somewhat of a t*at.
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Zweihander
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#94
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(Original post by joe_t_87)
Places like oxford and cambridge are full of stuck up little white kids who live in their own worlds. They may think they have lived because they have been on the cliche Spa Travel package to thailand and south america but they've always had daddy to bail them out.

The world is changing, power is shifting from the West and towards these emerging economies. Degree or no degree, an arrogant oxbridge child may no longer be as useful to a bank as somewhen who has been immersed in a class of 45 students, all from a different nation.
You think you're better than a Oxbridge student just because your class is more ethnically diverse :facepalm2:
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Johan C
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#95
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(Original post by invictus_veritas)
##]]

no a 2:1 is not equivalent across universities. Some 2:1s are much harder to gain than others.

We sit exams set by the university we're at. Standards vary significantly across universities otherwise nobody would bother attempting to get into any university that wasn't their local one unless they particularly hated their parents.

a person who got a first in accounting would I think possibly not even be able to get a pass at one of the elite universities which offers finance related degrees e.g. LSE/ Warwick etc.

Why?

Because the standards are so much higher, it's like comparing apples and oranges.

He's done very well at a much easier course and the questions just aren't comparable because the standard is so inferior.

It's practically worthless for the kind of career in IB he wants to pursue.

It is a degree and he can do some very good jobs with it, but just not ones in IB because ultimately he stands no chance against all the people with 500+ points at A level and a 2:1 in a seriously difficult degree.

Anyone on the LSE's finance course could go to UEL and get an 80% average with the bare minimum of effort.

How do I know this?

A while ago I compared (with a few friends) returned exam scripts from several universities which included Manchester and the LSE as well as a few others and like Manchester's exams are a joke. They have multiple choice questions for compulsory economics/ maths modules which are ridiculously easy in comparison to LSE.

Manchester is ranked far, far above UEL so it makes me shudder to think how poor the standards must be there if Manchester's are considered fairly high for a university.

It's not his fault, it's the lack of information available that encourages people to take **** courses at **** universities which land them jobless with a whole load of debt.
I agree with much of what you say, but you exaggerate things massively. I know for a fact - if only from Drogue's comparison of econ papers from LSE/Oxbrdige with those from other unis, where he said students in top institutions cover in first year exams what others do in second year - that standards vary widely ; but a first from UEL would definitely not just pass at a top 4 (Oxbridge/LSE/Imperial) institution. Also, most people in finance - including those the OP will meet - do not have a first class degree.
Finally yes, most people in this industry have masive egos. You need to at least pretend to be like them to avoid being an outcast.
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ArcaneAnna
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#96
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#96
(Original post by joe_t_87)
it's probably because you have gone to the extreme and said that a degree from UEL is more harmful on your CV than not putting a degree at all!

It's still a university.

Also the reason why barclays come to the uni is because UEL is one of, if not, the most ethnically diverse universities in the country. They seek to take on students who have mixed with cultures from every corner of the world.

Places like oxford and cambridge are full of stuck up little white kids who live in their own worlds. They may think they have lived because they have been on the cliche Spa Travel package to thailand and south america but they've always had daddy to bail them out.

The world is changing, power is shifting from the West and towards these emerging economies. Degree or no degree, an arrogant oxbridge child may no longer be as useful to a bank as somewhen who has been immersed in a class of 45 students, all from a different nation.
I'm sure there is no-one naive enough to actually believe that there is such a thing as racial-equality?

As invictus_veritas has already pointed out, that is literally just to keep the goverment off their backs.

Although, I strongly believe that top jobs and top universities don't give two flying effs about what your background is or what colour you are - all they want it someone with the right grades/qualifications for their course/vacancy.


And places like Oxford and Cambridge aren't just full of 'stuck up little white kids', all uni's have a certain % of those.
I happen to know a canny few people from oxbridge, along with other top unis - and I can tell you that they're from a massive range of different backgrounds.
One of my mates, who's at Cambridge, is actually from a council house in ******* penshaw, sunderland - which is considered one of the worst areas in britain.
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lol_wut
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#97
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pretty sure this is flame. pretty well done though and a very good backstory
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joe_t_87
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#98
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#98
everyone seems to of missed the point about the whole ethnic diversity

it has nothing to do with being p.c to please the government.

it's to do with the banks client base, more and more people and corporations from emerging economies are becoming increasingly important to IB revenues. thats why the banks are interested in interpersonal skills with ethnicities

nothing to do with the goverment. period.
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Zweihander
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#99
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#99
(Original post by joe_t_87)
everyone seems to of missed the point about the whole ethnic diversity

it has nothing to do with being p.c to please the government.

it's to do with the banks client base, more and more people and corporations from emerging economies are becoming increasingly important to IB revenues. thats why the banks are interested in interpersonal skills with ethnicities

nothing to do with the goverment. period.
Did they teach you that in your Econ class at UEL?
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Milch
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#100
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#100
(Original post by joe_t_87)
everyone seems to of missed the point about the whole ethnic diversity

it has nothing to do with being p.c to please the government.

it's to do with the banks client base, more and more people and corporations from emerging economies are becoming increasingly important to IB revenues. thats why the banks are interested in interpersonal skills with ethnicities

nothing to do with the goverment. period.
lol
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