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TSR MHoC General Election March 2013 Watch

  • View Poll Results: TSR MHoC General election. Cast your vote:
    TSR Conservative and Unionist Party
    110
    18.09%
    TSR Green Party
    77
    12.66%
    TSR Labour Party
    131
    21.55%
    TSR Liberal Party
    53
    8.72%
    TSR Libertarian Party
    46
    7.57%
    TSR Socialist Party
    69
    11.35%
    tehFrance
    36
    5.92%
    TSR UKIP
    69
    11.35%
    Spoilt Ballot
    17
    2.80%

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    (Original post by The Mad Dog)
    If that is the case this going to end up a bit like a by-election where only those involved in those actually bother with it. Could be an interesting test for Rakas's theory of abolishing the mass PM to see how much of the turnout is after it.
    The mass PM went out late at the last election, sadly it was still enough to bump the turnout from about 200 to 700.
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    (Original post by Tactical Nuclear Penguin)
    As it's Easter weekend I'm guessing not until Tuesday.
    Thats a good point, forgot about that
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    (Original post by Tactical Nuclear Penguin)
    As it's Easter weekend I'm guessing not until Tuesday.
    Outrageous, we must correct this at once!

    A vote for tehFrance is a vote for getting things done with an iron fist! :fuhrer:

    Vote tehFrance, Very Inefficient but Better than a Horse!
    Question Everything :fuhrer:

    (This is getting very tiring and wasn't nearly as much fun as I thought ).
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    The admins have been informed about the PM a few times, most recently just moments after this thread was posted so they now have the link too. The ball is now in their court. We should hopefully see the mass PM reasonaby soon but as I've said it's no longer in my control. We just have to let them do it when they get the time.
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    I've only just seen this! :eek: I do like the sound of a spoilt ballot! Though I will vote for a party, rather than scribbling over the ballot.
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    I still haven't got an answer from Labour regarding the mysterious "triple-dip recession" that never happened. Anyone care to enlighten the rest of us?
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    Ehh, this term's manifestos are refreshingly not full of lies, I think we can give them one.
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    (Original post by Birchington)
    I still haven't got an answer from Labour regarding the mysterious "triple-dip recession" that never happened. Anyone care to enlighten the rest of us?
    I'd love to know when Liberals started forcing people to do things. Or is this a reflection of your party now that you've dropped the nod towards democratic values?

    Triple-dip recession - yes, it's when you poke your head outside of London and realise how **** the country actually is thanks to the Liberal Democrats and the Tories.

    Indignance, it's a terrible thing.
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    Thanks, mystery rep benefactors.
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    (Original post by Thunder and Jazz)
    Thanks, mystery rep benefactors.
    I so pressed the wrong button
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    (Original post by obi_adorno_kenobi)
    I'd love to know when Liberals started forcing people to do things. Or is this a reflection of your party now that you've dropped the nod towards democratic values?

    Triple-dip recession - yes, it's when you poke your head outside of London and realise how **** the country actually is thanks to the Liberal Democrats and the Tories.

    Indignance, it's a terrible thing.
    I haven't 'forced' anyone, I'm just intrigued why Labour have made up the existence of a recession here. If they don't reply, it's their loss, but it would be nice if they had the courtesy to respond.

    A triple-dip recession hasn't happened in RL either, and various forecasts suggest we're not going to have one. Also, it's too easy to place the blame for our economic depression on the current government alone - all parties have had their share in decades of fiscal mismanagement and a failure to maintain wealth generating parts of our economy. Failure has occurred on the left and the right of politics and no side should attempt to take any moral highground.

    Finally, we're not the Liberal Democrats and we don't speak for them here or agree completely with their policies.
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    (Original post by Birchington)
    I haven't 'forced' anyone, I'm just intrigued why Labour have made up the existence of a recession here. If they don't reply, it's their loss, but it would be nice if they had the courtesy to respond.

    A triple-dip recession hasn't happened in RL either, and various forecasts suggest we're not going to have one. Also, it's too easy to place the blame for our economic depression on the current government alone - all parties have had their share in decades of fiscal mismanagement and a failure to maintain wealth generating parts of our economy. Failure has occurred on the left and the right of politics.

    Finally, we're not the Liberal Democrats and we don't speak for them here or agree completely with their policies.
    So you made a post complaining about a party not answering your question and then completely failed to answer the question I asked of you. Hilarious.

    Your party wishes to "force" (your words) banks to lend; to force energy firms to subsidise bills; to end exploitation by pay day loans companies (presumably again by some kind of enforcement). Those three instances of the use of force - legislative rather than physical - is what I was asking you to address.
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    (Original post by obi_adorno_kenobi)
    So you made a post complaining about a party not answering your question and then completely failed to answer the question I asked of you. Hilarious.
    Your question: "I'd love to know when Liberals started forcing people to do things. Or is this a reflection of your party now that you've dropped the nod towards democratic values? "

    My response: "I haven't 'forced' anyone".

    I answered your question - I haven't "forced people to do things" simply by politely asking for a reply from Labour in the spirit of this election Q&A thread.
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    (Original post by Birchington)
    Your question: "I'd love to know when Liberals started forcing people to do things. Or is this a reflection of your party now that you've dropped the nod towards democratic values? "

    My response: "I haven't 'forced' anyone".

    I answered your question - I haven't "forced people to do things" simply by politely asking for a reply from Labour in the spirit of this election Q&A thread.
    You've not answered the question since that wasn't what the question was aimed at. My question was aimed at the three instances in your rather annoying poster that insists on the use of force against external bodies - banks, pay day loans companies, and energy companies. You seem to think I'm interested in your petty attempt at getting one over on the Labour Party. I'm not. I'm actually interested in learning the origins of the Liberal Party's abandonment of laissez faire. I wondered whether it was when you abandoned democracy in your name and was seeking clarification from you. That is, after all, the purpose of this thread...is it not?
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    (Original post by obi_adorno_kenobi)
    Your party wishes to "force" (your words) banks to lend; to force energy firms to subsidise bills; to end exploitation by pay day loans companies (presumably again by some kind of enforcement). Those three instances of the use of force - legislative rather than physical - is what I was asking you to address.
    Having now seen this, I misunderstood your question about us "forcing" people do do things - I thought it was in reference to my request for a Labour reply as your original question did not mention our policies. Apologies.

    We're opposed to the oppression and coercion of individual citizens, but the behaviour of pay day loan companies and some banks for example, creates oppressive conditions and destroys individual freedom. Therefore, we plan to legislate to prevent conditions of oppression for citizens. Creating large scale social, individual freedom is our goal but when this is damaged by unscrupulous corporate practices or behaviour, it's important we step in.

    Hope that answers your question
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    (Original post by Birchington)
    We're opposed to the oppression and coercion of individual citizens, but the behaviour of pay day loan companies and some banks for example, creates oppressive conditions and destroys individual freedom. Therefore, we plan to legislate to prevent conditions of oppression for citizens.
    Of course, that is typically viewing the problem from the arse end. The reason pay day loan companies exist and are able to prey on the vulnerable is because people's living standards haven't kept up with both real demands on their wage packets - energy, food, transportation, rent - and implied demands such as a desire for the latest technology.

    Yes a loan company offering a package with a representative APR of 1709% (like the Money Shop ads) is exploitative but you don't tackle their existence by legislating for APR rates to be a bit lower. You tackle their existence by improving living standards and ensuring that wages keep up with the actual costs of living.

    The behaviour of banks and loan sharks reflects, frankly, the Liberal society that New Labour, the Lib Dems and Tories have worked so hard to bring about over the last generation. A bit of loin-cloth-esque legislation on your part ain't going to solve the issue of exploitation, it'll just cover up your guilt-ridden modesty a bit.
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    (Original post by obi_adorno_kenobi)
    Of course, that is typically viewing the problem from the arse end. The reason pay day loan companies exist and are able to prey on the vulnerable is because people's living standards haven't kept up with both real demands on their wage packets - energy, food, transportation, rent - and implied demands such as a desire for the latest technology.

    Yes a loan company offering a package with a representative APR of 1709% (like the Money Shop ads) is exploitative but you don't tackle their existence by legislating for APR rates to be a bit lower. You tackle their existence by improving living standards and ensuring that wages keep up with the actual costs of living.

    The behaviour of banks and loan sharks reflects, frankly, the Liberal society that New Labour, the Lib Dems and Tories have worked so hard to bring about over the last generation. A bit of loin-cloth-esque legislation on your part ain't going to solve the issue of exploitation, it'll just cover up your guilt-ridden modesty a bit.
    Don't pretend your party cares all it wants to do is borrow more money for your spending pushing the problem further down the road. You can't rely on the theory of indefinite growth forever.
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    (Original post by obi_adorno_kenobi)
    Of course, that is typically viewing the problem from the arse end. The reason pay day loan companies exist and are able to prey on the vulnerable is because people's living standards haven't kept up with both real demands on their wage packets - energy, food, transportation, rent - and implied demands such as a desire for the latest technology. You tackle their existence by improving living standards and ensuring that wages keep up with the actual costs of living.
    I can see your point, and I would support the creation of a national living wage that reflects regional differences in living costs. Beyond that, it's not for the state to subsidise people's desire to buy the latest technology. The state should absolutely ensure we all have good housing, access to affordable nutrition and quality education. However, taxpayers should not foot the bill for someone's new iPad.

    A bit of loin-cloth-esque legislation on your part ain't going to solve the issue of exploitation, it'll just cover up your guilt-ridden modesty a bit.
    I haven't got anything to be guilty about - making our society fairer will take many years but it seems futile to oppose legislation that really will benefit the poor, exploited and vulnerable.
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    (Original post by politixx)
    Don't pretend your party cares all it wants to do is borrow more money for your spending pushing the problem further down the road. You can't rely on the theory of indefinite growth forever.
    I'm not participating here as a representative of a political party, so what I say is what I say and nothing more.

    Now, isn't capitalism supposed to rely upon indefinite growth, upon the never-ending march of progress from poverty and backwardness to richesse and modernity? If that model is somehow broken - we socialists knew that anyway, even got t-shirts and badges made up to demonstrate our foresight - then what exactly are you right-wingers bothering to be in politics for?
 
 
 
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