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    (Original post by TheonlyMrsHolmes)
    But then again a lot of people feel as though women are more or less equal here in the west, and that we should be looking towards the east/middle-east if we're really serious about feminism/equal rights.
    Sorry to say but actually women and men can never be entirely equal in this world. But we are equal I believe in front of God when it comes to judgment/deeds etc.
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    (Original post by joecphillips;[url="tel:64356373")
    64356373[/url]]I know that people who start calling out something as islamophobic before anything truly islamophobic has been said is stifling the discussion, if you want a discussion over something don't start by saying this is islamophobic otherwise only people who are truly islamophobic will post as people will not want to be associated with it.
    You've literally ignored what I said in each of my posts. It's like speaking to a brick wall. Noone's stifling discussion! I've seen OP post islamophobic comments before so what makes you think that all of a sudden he becomes intruiged by "the development of the muslim world"? That picture is falsely misleading propaganda. Fact.

    For the third time, I am now asking you to reread my first three posts on this thread. You completely ignored my last paragraph in my previous reply to you. Why's that? Because it pokes a hole in your logic?
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    (Original post by h333)
    Sorry to say but actually women and men can never be entirely equal in this world. But we are equal I believe in front of God when it comes to judgment/deeds etc.
    Why can't they be equal?
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    (Original post by Khaar)
    Then you agree that the (hijab niqab burkha) Afghan people in the OP are intelligent because they did a great job in challenging the ideas which were enforced upon them and their families by communist regime.
    Most of the fully-clothed women in the OP are too young to have lived under the Afghan communist regime, and even if they had, they could have dressed as they wanted in that time. Nowadays, it's dangerous and almost impossible for a woman not to be covered because of what skydaddy supposedly said.

    (Original post by Khaar)
    You could but we aren't debating whether God exists or not. You're attempting to conflate other issues into the discussion because you can't defend that you have low standards of what it means to be intelligent. I applaud you for the attempted red herring non the less though :congrats:
    I have different standards. You judge them low.

    (Original post by Khaar)
    We can certainly prove that the Prophet (pbuh) and his companions took certain verses to mean that they should cover up. Since we're talking about Muslim countries and what Islam requires of them, that should be sufficient a conversation with a fellow muslim such as serine soul.
    Prove it please. The only verse in the Koran that you can find about it just says that women should cover their breasts.

    (Original post by Khaar)
    Show me where I've called other people to help me to debate you?
    Do you see any tags or ...?
    You cannot tag them because they don't exist.

    (Original post by Khaar)
    I'm implying that your implication that Muslims can't be intelligent is wrong because I know several Muslims who are very intelligent and probably more intelligent than you.
    Unless I can see these people I won't believe you. You're saying something that is impossible to verify - again.

    (Original post by Khaar)
    I am intelligent but I know Muslims who are more intelligent, some of them have over 5 A*s in very demanding A levels. I'd rather use them in my comparison because they're better than me and therefore the likelihood of my statement being wrong is lower.
    You're measuring intelligence with A-level grades? lol

    (Original post by Khaar)
    I just remember the pathetic attempts that you people made to steal users from TSR. It was quite amusing how it seemed to be full of people whose heads were up their own behind.
    Insults, I see.
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    (Original post by TheonlyMrsHolmes)
    Why can't they be equal?
    Bukhari (48:826)- The Prophet said, "Isn't the witness of a woman equal to half of that of a man?" The women said, "Yes." He said, "This is because of the deficiency of a woman's mind."
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    (Original post by TheonlyMrsHolmes;[url="tel:64357423")
    64357423[/url]]5%? lol you just made that up XD

    As I said, I like modesty but I see that as extreme, it's not a judgement it is an observation. All the women in the picture didn't choose to dress like that.
    Of course I made it up but being a Muslim my whole life and living in the two densent Muslim populations in the UK ... I think I can provide a pretty good estimate. Islamic fundamentals prevent someone being forced to do something. God loves piety and piety cannot be forced; it must be attained.
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    (Original post by Hirsty97)
    I bet that one of Iran is *******s. Most Muslim girls there seem to don a hijab which shows their hair slightly, it's more of a fashion statement.

    As for Afghanistan, everything went sour after the Saur Revolution and the ensuing civil war, where the Soviets invaded on behalf of the communists, and the US backed the Afghan-Mujahiden (which would become the Taliban), of course the US could afford to give more aid to the Islamists and with the help of the governments in Pakistan and Saudi Arabia, the Soviets were forced to retreat, which meant the extremists won.
    Your calling the mujahideens extremists...majority Afghans including me
    ...called the soviets extremists. (Trust me the afghans present at that time who witnessed what the soviets were trying to do should have more of a say).
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    (Original post by Erebor)
    Bukhari (48:826)- The Prophet said, "Isn't the witness of a woman equal to half of that of a man?" The women said, "Yes." He said, "This is because of the deficiency of a woman's mind."
    I see...

    Awful!
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    (Original post by TheonlyMrsHolmes)
    Why can't they be equal?
    So your saying a woman will be able to do everything a man does and vice versa.
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    (Original post by Butternuts96)
    Of course I made it up but being a Muslim my whole life and living in the two densent Muslim populations in the UK ... I think I can provide a pretty good estimate. Islamic fundamentals prevent someone being forced to do something. God loves piety and piety cannot be forced; it must be attained.
    No you can't, you are one person. The world has over 1.5 billion muslims, you cannot make up a random figure like 5%. That is the stupidest thing I've ever heard, it's like me saying: "I've been a girl all my life, I've been surrounded by girls I think 5% of girls hate balloons".

    Like how does that even make sense?
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    (Original post by h333)
    So your saying a woman will be able to do everything a man does and vice versa.
    What does a man do?

    Apart from the difference in genitals, I don't see how men and women are different.
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    (Original post by TheonlyMrsHolmes;[url="tel:64357437")
    64357437[/url]]There was no ill intentioned paragraphs, it was one sentence and sounded like OP was genuinely curious.
    You've quite a few gems so you've been here long. You know how the deal works. Something immigrant/muslim/brown people related gets posted. Few decent people reply defending something. Islamophobes jump in from all corners. 7 pages later and a war has escalated.

    Posting something like this is obviously gonna lead to spreading hatred of Islam. Anyone who's been on TSR for long enough knows this for a fact.

    Also, that picture is incredibly misleading propaganda. Fact. Hijabi and non hijabi women exist in "islamic" and "non islamic" countries in all time periods because not everyone is religious. Taking pics of some non hijabis from the past and comparing them to hijabis now and asking "what happened?" is a great way to start one of these wars.
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    (Original post by TheonlyMrsHolmes)
    But then again a lot of people feel as though women are more or less equal here in the west, and that we should be looking towards the east/middle-east if we're really serious about feminism/equal rights.
    I've seen this thread posted before, with the same pictures. It always focuses on Islam bashing and not about how to possibly enhance these women's rights, or a serious discussion into why this change happened. (Granted this time, this thread has been more constructive in parts thankfully)

    And I'm sure some women who choose to dress islamically would feel insulted to have their choice of dressing to be called "uncivilised" and "extreme"
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    (Original post by Butternuts96)
    You've quite a few gems so you've been here long. You know how the deal works. Something immigrant/muslim/brown people related gets posted. Few decent people reply defending something. Islamophobes jump in from all corners. 7 pages later and a war has escalated.

    Posting something like this is obviously gonna lead to spreading hatred of Islam. Anyone who's been on TSR for long enough knows this for a fact.

    Also, that picture is incredibly misleading propaganda. Fact. Hijabi and non hijabi women exist in "islamic" and "non islamic" countries in all time periods because not everyone is religious. Taking pics of some non hijabis from the past and comparing them to hijabis now and asking "what happened?" is a great way to start one of these wars.
    I don't visit islam based threads often, I know they are fuelled by hatred which is why I always address religious issues respectfully.

    You see he did have a point, I gave him my answer. I didn't critique islam at all. I don't think it's islamaphobic. Maybe he is, but the thread topic isn't.
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    (Original post by Lord Samosa)
    I've seen this thread posted before, with the same pictures. It always focuses on Islam bashing and not about how to possibly enhance these women's rights, or a serious discussion into why this change happened. (Granted this time, this thread has been more constructive in parts thankfully)

    And I'm sure some women who choose to dress islamically would feel insulted to have their choice of dressing to be called "uncivilised" and "extreme"
    As I stated above, I personally wouldn't try to attack islam and be disrespectful purposefully. It is extreme, it is. How can you say it isn't? not all the women in the pictures chose that. I'm aware even the present day middle-east there are parts where women dress normally and are not pressed into dressing in a certain way, but in those pictures it is extreme. It's not an insult, it's an observation.
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    (Original post by TheonlyMrsHolmes)
    I see...

    Awful!
    What's even more sad is that muslim women think this way too, but I guess this is what happens when you've been indoctrinated from the second you're born and on top of that you live in fear of consequences from your family and community . It's disheartening reading all these threads on here with kids wanting to leave islam but being petrified to do it. They live in the UK but at the same time they are stuck in their parallel universe which is quite surreal in a 21st century modern democracy.
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    (Original post by Peroxidation)
    I'd be happy to go over the rise of the Islamic empire if you want? I should warn you though it's long and very graphic. I mean multiple genocides, sexual slavery and the slaughter of children kind of graphic...
    Thats sounds pretty islamophobic to me. That part of history should not be allowed to be recalled because its islamophobic
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    (Original post by Erebor)
    What's even more sad is that muslim women think this way too, but I guess this is what happens when you've been indoctrinated from the second you're born and on top of that you live in fear of consequences from your family and community . It's disheartening reading all these threads on here with kids wanting to leave islam but being petrified to do it. They live in the UK but at the same time they are stuck in their parallel universe which is quite surreal in a 21st century modern democracy.
    Yes as I said a few pages back anything is possible when you have the "word of God" on your side. Any type of oppressive behaviour, anything is possible if people believe it's coming from a purer source such as God. That is why muslim women believe the same, then ofcourse fear.
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    (Original post by TheonlyMrsHolmes)
    As I stated above, I personally wouldn't try to attack islam and be disrespectful purposefully. It is extreme, it is. How can you say it isn't? not all the women in the pictures chose that. I'm aware even the present day middle-east there are parts where women dress normally and are not pressed into dressing in a certain way, but in those pictures it is extreme. It's not an insult, it's an observation.
    I was talking about women who choose to dress like that, some do and people still insult it. The issue here is the regime of these countries dictating how they can dress, they're being oppressed by not being given the choice to wear what they want. The issue isn't what they're wearing.

    I'm not accusing you of attacking anybody btw
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    (Original post by h333)
    So your saying a woman will be able to do everything a man does and vice versa.
    Of course not, as the prophet clearly stated, women are mentally deficient.
 
 
 
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