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    (Original post by Rakas21)
    Directly i agree however it speaks to the fact that this sense of ambition, ability to stand alone and wish for self rule pervades our culture even today.

    Your point about the empire is somewhat irrelevant since most people don't feel shame and nor should they.
    It isn't shame I'm recommending, but an honest evaluation of what it meant and did - something that parts of the Tory Right now want to gloss over as it does not meet their reactionary 'go back to the 50s' agenda, of which Leave is a part.
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    (Original post by Fullofsurprises)
    It isn't shame I'm recommending, but an honest evaluation of what it meant and did - something that parts of the Tory Right now want to gloss over as it does not meet their reactionary 'go back to the 50s' agenda, of which Leave is a part.
    We do evaluate what it meant and did school. If anything there's not enough focus on what we lost and why that is a bad thing.

    The UK's second biggest crime is disbanding the empire in my view. It should have been allowed to evolve into an Imperial federation, that would have cemented British power for centuries.
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    (Original post by Rakas21)
    We do evaluate what it meant and did school. If anything there's not enough focus on what we lost and why that is a bad thing.

    The UK's second biggest crime is disbanding the empire in my view. It should have been allowed to evolve into an Imperial federation, that would have cemented British power for centuries.
    There was huge opposition in many of the countries to continued British rule and the concept of an 'imperial federation' would have been anathema with its continued implication of central imperial power. The fact that so many came in voluntarily to the Commonwealth is a testament to the continued good name of Britain in many of those places, but they would never have accepted continued rule, even if dressed up in a friendly sounding package.
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    (Original post by Fullofsurprises)
    It isn't shame I'm recommending, but an honest evaluation of what it meant and did - something that parts of the Tory Right now want to gloss over as it does not meet their reactionary 'go back to the 50s' agenda, of which Leave is a part.
    So we establish that it was bad (even though it wasn't nearly as bad as SJWs make it out to be)....then what? Besides, Raskas is correct: it is shame that's being promoted here. Look at all this stuff like the Rhodes Must Fall *******s. I bet you were all over that like a dog and chips

    You think Arabs think this way after running the most brutal slave trade in world history? You think Turks beat themselves up because the Ottomans spent hundreds of years killing, enslaving and raping everything they saw? Of course they don't because they're not weirdos.

    Besides, how is (admittedly mistakingly) attempting to emulate Norway and Switzerland going back to this agenda? How is trying to get a better deal for your workers by not having them continuously undercut doing that? How is attempting to gain more control over your own laws doing that? How is wishing to have more freedom to trade more easily with non-European entities doing that? How is attempting to create a colour-blind immigration system over the racist EU immigration doing that? I don't agree that leaving the EU will achieve these things but how dare you accuse people who do as having the agenda you're saying they have? You're out if line.

    How do you square your dim-witted assertion with the Labour Leave campaign, which is based on worker's interests and put forward by elements of the party still committed to the workers instead of self-loathing middle-class SJW retardation? Going to accuse them of being Tories because they don't agree with you? If you haven't read their material, I suggest you check it out. You might learn something about the workers for the first time in your life.

    Even as a Remainer myself I've got to tell you that you're talking out your arse as usual. You have absolutely no clue what the workers want, what's good for them or anything else about them. Nor do you seem interested in that other than superficial posturing to hide the fact that you plainly despise them as shown in nearly every thread you post in. It wouldn't even be so bad if you weren't so closed-minded and condescending about it all. You're the modern Labour Party in a nut shell. You need to realise that most people don't go in for this Owen Jonesesque SJW nonsense because they're normal and not weird.
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    (Original post by KimKallstrom)
    You think Arabs think this way after running the most brutal slave trade in world history? You think Turks beat themselves up because the Ottomans spent hundreds of years killing, enslaving and raping everything they saw? Of course they don't because they're not weirdos.
    Nor does the left stop to examine the plank in its own eye. Places like Vietnam were "decolonised" in the sense that power was passed from a relatively non-interventionist French oligarchy to a totalitarian leftist oligarchy. They did not raise a finger against this, did not raise their voices to object to it, and in fact worked tirelessly to bring it about.

    The left does not reject authoritarian government nor does it reject some people with certain ideas dominating others with other ideas. It simply wants to be in power and not be a subject.

    If the case for decolonisation is that the new tyrants tend to have a more similar skin colour to their subjects than the old tyrants I consider that too weak to be taken seriously. If on the other hand we are to judge, say, British Southern Rhodesia vs Mugabe's Zimbabwe purely in terms of quality of government, justice of the law, and living standards of the population, there is no case for decolonisation, and decolonisation should be seen as an insane outbreak of terrifying barbarism.
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    The OP needs to read more economics.

    The UK will fall further in the global table since it's about not just size but development. China is developing, most of the world is. China is also innovating, world's greatest infrastructure projects are in China now. world's longest bridges, and world's tallest buildings are/will be cHINESE soon. Plus they have Huawei/Lenovo, there is no UK-based smartphone maker or PC maker.

    What makes a country wealthy is economic stability, political stability, well-educated population, good infrastructure, and not much regulation. So China's global economic dominance is inevitable, and the UK, USA, Germany, and other Western countries will get relatively smaller, it's how it will be, even if people who suck the EMpire's **** don't like it..
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    and why isn't UK 5th biggest economy in the world? just drive or walk around, and you'll see a lot of economic activity, to say because we don't manufacture stuff (which in GDP calculation is irrelevant..) or it's some conspiracy to make the UK look better (loooolol.) then no. And the USA has no rich people, right?
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    (Original post by limitzsurpassed)
    and why isn't UK 5th biggest economy in the world? just drive or walk around, and you'll see a lot of economic activity, to say because we don't manufacture stuff (which in GDP calculation is irrelevant..) or it's some conspiracy to make the UK look better (loooolol.) then no. And the USA has no rich people, right?
    In the past two weeks I've chatted with 3 forum members from the Cayman Islands. 3 of them were very polite, cordial and helpful with many of my queries that I had. It is a huge contrast to what I normally have to deal with although they've been some exceptions here and there (especially the nice people whom I'm 'followers' of on this forum.

    Anyhow, the private discussions then bordered on politics and the situation in UK. All 3 said they would not want to be a part of UK or have anything to do with it. And I asked why and they shared with me so many of their country's policies which makes perfect sense and I asked myself why it isn't being replicated in the UK.

    Cayman Islands has a population of just under 60,000. It is a British Overseas Territory. It's annual GDP hovers around the $3 billion range. Now here's where it gets interesting and I'm quoting from wikipedia under the 'Labour' section.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cayman_Islands

    To work in the Cayman Islands as a non-citizen, a work permit is required. This involves passing a police background check and a health check. A prospective immigrant worker will not be granted a permit unless certain medical conditions are present which include testing negative for syphilis or HIV.

    A permit may be granted to individuals on special work.A foreigner must first have a job to move to the Cayman Islands. The employer applies and pays for the work permit. Work permits are not granted to foreigners who are in the Cayman Islands (unless it is a renewal). The Cayman Islands Immigration Department requires foreigners to remain out of the country until their work permit has been approved.

    I'm going to pitch a tent here while I wait for any of the Remainians on here, who can conjure up a reply to this.
 
 
 
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