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    (Original post by Tiger Rag)
    Source?
    'The “abortion as contraception” claim appears to be an interpretation of the data provided by campaign groups and abortion legislation critics. Also, the data suggest that only a tiny fraction of abortions were in women who have had seven or more previous abortions – 85 procedures out of the 189,574 performed in 2010.'

    'According to the Department of Health’s abortion statistics report, in 2010 there were 189,574 abortions in England and Wales (data are available on residents of England and Wales only). Approximately 64,445 (34%) of these were repeat abortions'
    http://www.nhs.uk/news/2012/05may/Pa...tatistics.aspx

    Critics said figures revealed yesterday show thousands of women are using the procedure as a form of contraception.It is not unknown for some women to have seven, eight or even nine terminations in their lifetime.
    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...raceptive.html
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    (Original post by nexttime)
    How much do you think supporting a mother through pregnancy and labour costs? How much do you think 18 years of child tax credit is?

    The economic argument for providing abortions is solid. Very solid.



    So you're arguing that women who are not yet responsible enough to use contraception... should be forced to look after a baby?! Do you not see the problem there?
    Who said anything about forcing them to look after a baby? When you go to the doctor and they give you a prescription, don't you have to pay for it? As it's not free, would you decide not to pay for the prescription and let your condition worsen? Now, having a UTI or some other infection isn't your fault yet you still have to pay for the treatment. Pregnancy is 100% preventable. You can't keep making the same 'mistake' and expect other people to pay. If it came from your own pocket, perhaps you'd behave more safely

    If a woman really wanted to have an abortion, she wouldn't hesitate to pay up a portion of the amount I.e £30 as opposed to funding an unwanted child for 18yrs.
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    (Original post by Anonymous)
    In 2015, 98% of abortions were funded by the NHS. 38% of them were to women who had already had one or more abortions. Repeat abortions costs £1m a week.

    Just 2% were carried out under the grounds that the child would be seriously handicapped.

    It is estimated that each abortion costs £680. This figure rises if terminations occur in the 2nd trimester.

    http://www.nhs.uk/news/2012/05may/Pa...tatistics.aspx

    Should the taxpayer continue to fund other people's mistakes?
    Are women using abortion as a contraceptive? Should there be tighter restrictions?
    If the women goes through with birth, on average the delivery and immediate post-delivery care costs NHS £1067 with cheapest, home birth option, costs rise substantially for delivery in other settings. From an economic stand point on average every abortion saves NHS atleast £387; not to include atleast 18 years of passive care to that child while they're largely economically inactive.
    Should NHS therefore stop funding maternity yards saving it quite a significant chunk of money, while supporting and encouraging abortion with at minimum free abortions?
    Or is your opposition based on act of abortion, and desire to interfere with another person's body rather than actual economics?
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    If abortions cost, then more of these pregnancies may be continued- leading to children being raised by parents who did not feel they were ready for it/ could cope, or being put up for adoption. It disproportionately hits the poorer families who may have felt they weren't economically able to cope with a child.
    Yes, these people should have used contraception, and yes we should encourage this more. But that does not mean that we stop offering abortions on the NHS. This would be counter productive to our population size and structure.
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    I'm pretty impressed abortions are so cheap, it seems like great value to me. What might save money is not offering hundreds of thousands of pounds of life lengthening surgery to people in their 80s and 90s, that is what will cripple the nhs as there are so many of them now.
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    (Original post by swanderfeild)
    If the women goes through with birth, on average the delivery and immediate post-delivery care costs NHS £1067 with cheapest, home birth option, costs rise substantially for delivery in other settings. From an economic stand point on average every abortion saves NHS atleast £387; not to include atleast 18 years of passive care to that child while they're largely economically inactive.
    Should NHS therefore stop funding maternity yards saving it quite a significant chunk of money, while supporting and encouraging abortion with at minimum free abortions?
    Or is your opposition based on act of abortion, and desire to interfere with another person's body rather than actual economics?
    Refer to above post
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    (Original post by AngryRedhead)
    Seriously disabled individuals can be brought up to live happy, healthy and normal lives. It's not just a case of 'oh no, my child has got downs syndrome their lives are hopeless.'

    It's very very unlikely though isn't it? Let's be real here, the vast majority of pregnancies occur because people are too drunk or stupid to think about the consequences and they can't be bothered getting contraception because they know the NHS will pick up the slack. If people were financially responsible for their own abortions there would be a lot less irresponsibility because people would know they would have to pay upwards of £700. It's an expensive mistake and my guess is that abortion rates would go down dramatically because people would be more careful
    True, people with disabilities can still have happy and supported lives - but parents must have a lot more focus on the child, and pay for a lot more care. Not all prospective parents are able to do this. In an ideal world, sure, but if they cannot take time out from their jobs, or if they have no other family help - it becomes very difficult. It's not just black and white.

    If someone is drunk or 'in the moment' I'd doubt that the risk of £700 would be that much of a disincentive. It's more like a punishment afterwards in these cases. Equally, if someone is wealthy enough, then they wouldn't care so much - so this is hitting the poor far more.
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    (Original post by Anonymous)
    Refer to above post
    That doesn't address my post in slightest; given abortions are £387 cheaper than delivery and immediate post-delivery care compared to your quoted figure for abortion, why from an economical standpoint shouldn't NHS be promoting abortion - say by keeping abortion free while say charging £30 for delivery; if someone really wants a baby they'll pay £30 as opposed to getting an abortion.
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    Should the NHS pay for heart attacks caused by lack of exercise anda poor diet? Many cancers are caused by a crappy lifestyle etc etc. There's a huge flaw in your argument.
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    (Original post by YaliaV)
    Should the NHS pay for heart attacks caused by lack of exercise anda poor diet? Many cancers are caused by a crappy lifestyle etc etc. There's a huge flaw in your argument.
    would you rather your taxes go toward people who have had heart attacks/cancer sufferers or women who have multiple abortions?
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    (Original post by swanderfeild)
    That doesn't address my post in slightest; given abortions are £387 cheaper than delivery and immediate post-delivery care compared to your quoted figure for abortion, why from an economical standpoint shouldn't NHS be promoting abortion - say by keeping abortion free while say charging £30 for delivery; if someone really wants a baby they'll pay £30 as opposed to getting an abortion.
    Sorry, I have no idea what you're talking about
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    What if its a rape outcome? That should be free 100% and should be handled with the chain of evidence via NHS
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    (Original post by Anonymous)
    would you rather your taxes go toward people who have had heart attacks/cancer sufferers or women who have multiple abortions?
    Cancer caused by drinking too much or eating crap is surely much the same as a pregnancy caused by a deliberate action?

    If the women go on to have the abortions, they may get all sorts of benefits and the child would be a huge burden to the tax payer down the road anyway.
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    No.

    Given that i desire an increased native birth rate i'm of the opinion that the vast majority of abortions should not be funded by the NHS.
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    (Original post by Anonymous)
    Sorry, I have no idea what you're talking about
    Let me make it clearer then:
    1. You claimed abortions should not be free since they cost NHS £680 per procedure.
    2. Not having an abortion costs NHS at least £1067 per delivery.
    3. NHS should therefore promote abortion over delivery, yes or no.
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    (Original post by YaliaV)
    Cancer caused by drinking too much or eating crap is surely much the same as a pregnancy caused by a deliberate action?

    If the women go on to have the abortions, they may get all sorts of benefits and the child would be a huge burden to the tax payer down the road anyway.
    Except that one is a life or death situation. If a woman would risk dying because she can't afford an abortion then I would say it should remain free
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    (Original post by swanderfeild)
    Let me make it clearer then:
    1. You claimed abortions should not be free since they cost NHS £680 per procedure.
    2. Not having an abortion costs NHS at least £1067 per delivery.
    3. NHS should therefore promote abortion over delivery, yes or no.
    What do you mean by delivery?
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    (Original post by Anonymous)
    What do you mean by delivery?
    Labor and giving birth to the child.
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    I think it should be dependent. If you're aborting because otherwise it'll genuinely affect your mental well-being or the baby's general well-being, or you know for like a 100% understandable reason, then yeah, if they can't afford it, it could be free. But if it's because they're just lazy or just don't want it yet or it's just a result of irresponsibility, then no.
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    Yes, abortion should remain free. I am forever grateful that I managed to get an abortion for free on NHS as I dread to think the lengths I would have went to to obtain an abortion as there was no way I could afford one privately. I took Microgynon like clockwork and pregnancy was and still is the last thing I ever want so I took that pill religiously and even though you know no form of contraception is 100% effective, you always think you will be safe and you will never be one of those girl you hear about it failing with but lo and behold, I was. I got it on the grounds of my mental and physical health as I know we aren't allowed to go into too much detail on here, lets just say I was in a bad place and if I hadn't been able to get that abortion for free on NHS, then I dread to think what I might have done. My story wasn't a case of sleeping around with multiple guys or using no protection like a lot of people seem to think is the reason for causing unwanted pregnancies. I was in the same long term relationship as I am now and it all came down to a pill failure. 4 years on, I am on a new pill and touch wood I haven't had any more failures with it but I don't take the effectiveness of the pill for granted.

    I do agree that abortion shouldn't be used as contraception with the whole mindset of "its ok not to take the pill, use a condom etc, I'll just nip off and get an abortion next month". That does put a strain on the NHS clinics and it would also be more of a bloody hassle than to just put something on the end of it or take a pill every day or even get the implant but I genuinely believe there are very few people like that and that a lot of the causes of unwanted pregnancy come from failed contraception, sadly rape and other circumstances other than people genuinely seeing abortion as an easy way out and a quick fix. It should be a last resort but should be available in every circumstance of unwanted pregnancy.
 
 
 
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