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    (Original post by ellie0497)
    Can we have a day without an Islam related thread please?
    Sure, as soon as it becomes as unthreatening as other ideologies.
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    (Original post by inhuman)
    So how come ol' Mo was one of the most prominent warlords of his era? His wasn't warfare wasn't "aggressive"? Or his conquests not "violent"?
    Not sure where you got the idea that Muhammad was a warlord, and even then, so were many other figures in history? Why is the Muslim one suddenly more worthy of criticism than say Chairman Mao or Hitler?
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    (Original post by alevelstresss)
    so why is this violence borderline non-existent in the highest population Muslim regions, and specific to the deprived, corrupt, desert regions which have had violent regimes such as Assad?

    the cause is not religion here buddy
    It is existent in those countries, its embedded in the laws of those countries.In indonesia a girl was recently lashed because she went on a date with the opposite sex.It says in the quran to lash adulterers and this cones under the same category.There have been a lot of recent cases if islamic extremists hacking atheists to death in Bangladesh.Why don't you prove that islam isnt violent?
    There is a lot of evidence it is.Muhhamed even gave nicknames to his weapons.He was not a nice man and muslims are taught to emulate him.
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    (Original post by savonarola)
    Dude, I appreciate your efforts in trying to establish that "muslims" are in fact in the crosshairs of bigotry. But you, just like many are wrong in many things with regards to the theological and practical founding of islam.
    Disclaimer :
    I was born to a muslim family in a muslim country which I've only quit a few years ago when i was already 18. I am also quite knowledgeable in theology. I have been an atheist since i was 11.

    First, Islam does not mean peace, Islam is a sort of adverb of the word
    تسليم
    Which means to submit, in this case to submit to the will of god. god as defined by Momo. [actually, Momo's bro in law who was a great theologian and a nestorian priest
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Waraka_ibn_Nawfal]
    The Quran can be divided in two segments which correspond to two different stages in the life of Momo as a wanabee prophet.

    Initially, he mimicked jesus a lot and established himself as a spiritual leader. very popular among the rich youth of Quraish and Mecca. Nothing better than rebelious teens to start a cult.
    The verses of the quran which were "published" at this stage are referred to as Meckian surats as they were released when he was in... mecca. they are purely spiritual.
    Next lots of **** happens and this small cult picks up tempo thanks to some very favourable social conditions (slavery, discontent with quraish elites & Momo's ties to some prominent figure who were either enticed by what momo's folk were preaching or some who came in later when they realized the potential/tides shifting.
    Anyway, they end up in a town called Medina where Momo declares full war on Quraish elites who happened to be polytheists and god coincidentally publishes through momo some surats full of hate and insults for quraishi elites where he calls for war against these infidels. Momo and his entourage are now tax-collecting warlords.
    They subsequently end up winning over quraish and settle in Mecca which will be the center of the future prodigious islamic umma spanning territories as far as into france to the north and persia to the east. Momo soon dies after the conquest of Mecca and there will be no more surats after him of course. instead we will now get a bunch of hadiths from dubious sources whenever the context calls for one.

    Anyway, reason I'm telling you about all of this is to explain the origin of these violent/pro-conquest verses. the bigotry towards various groups was simply inherited from the bible and the torah
    Now on to my point : out of the 1.6B muslims 1.6B are just superstitious people with islamic or arabic elements. Real men and women of fate are very rare in every religion. the orthodox Jewry which spends all it's time studying scriptures, dedicated priests, nuns. studious non-political imams, templars, louis 9. very rare and i would argue precious indeed.
    The current attacks are not to be solved through theology as the problem isn't a theological one. mistakes have been made and they now need to be corrected but no one seems to be willing to fix that. perhaps once obama steps down.
    1. I never said Islam means peace or that it is a religion of peace.

    2. 1500 years ago the world was a very different place, denouncing 1500 year old conquest or cultural norms is stupid
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    (Original post by Robby2312)
    It is existent in those countries, its embedded in the laws of those countries.In indonesia a girl was recently lashed because she went on a date with the opposite sex.It says in the quran to lash adulterers and this cones under the same category.There have been a lot of recent cases if islamic extremists hacking atheists to death in Bangladesh.Why don't you prove that islam isnt violent?
    There is a lot of evidence it is.Muhhamed even gave nicknames to his weapons.He was not a nice man and muslims are taught to emulate him.
    It is existent, but no more than violence in our own countries. But apparently, the foreign, dirty religion is the one most worthy of criticism. You're attacking religion when that does nothing whatsoever to help the situation, regardless of whether or not it is actually the cause.
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    (Original post by ellie0497)
    Can we have a day without an Islam related thread please?
    Can we have a week without Islamic terror please?
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    (Original post by alevelstresss)
    Not sure where you got the idea that Muhammad was a warlord, and even then, so were many other figures in history? Why is the Muslim one suddenly more worthy of criticism than say Chairman Mao or Hitler?
    Not sure where you deny this.

    Read the other guy's post - Mohamed was a warlord. In order to justify this, gather followers and establish social control, he came up with something that already existed and was very good at all of this - a religion.

    And surely you are now fully out of your mind. You are saying those that today follow Hitler would not receive the same if not more criticism than those following Mo?

    That is what people like you don't want to see.
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    (Original post by alevelstresss)
    It is existent, but no more than violence in our own countries. But apparently, the foreign, dirty religion is the one most worthy of criticism. You're attacking religion when that does nothing whatsoever to help the situation, regardless of whether or not it is actually the cause.
    There is a difference between the random violence of bad humans, and the systematic discrimination and oppression inherent in the ideology you subscribe to (as a Muslim).
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    (Original post by alevelstresss)
    so we have the word of God which is apparently violent, but about 1.5 billion Muslims seem to ignore it

    do you see the idiocy in this logic? either all Muslims aren't true Muslims, or your interpretation of the Quran and the way its followed is lacking in perspective
    opinion polls show the majority of muslims believe in the barbaric teachings of the quran and the hadiths, they just don't blow themselves up over it
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    (Original post by 1010marina)
    Can we have a week without Islamic terror please?
    a few days would even be nice
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    (Original post by inhuman)
    There is a difference between the random violence of bad humans, and the systematic discrimination and oppression inherent in the ideology you subscribe to (as a Muslim).
    Dude, if everyone who more or less identified with islam was out to get you you'd be dead. the west has a problem with the iraqi military left-overs they barred from gov jobs after sadam. These people want you to stop bombing them so they can take oily parts of iraq and syria. Just so happens that the west has a bed of mites who's lives are so *****y that they are willing to commit revenge-suicide actions. tough luck.
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    Islam is a revolting, sickening, backwards, bigoted and violent religion that deserves all the criticism and brutal scrutiny it can get. That's the only way it will have a chance, no matter how small, of becoming more liberal and less literal in the near future.
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    (Original post by Robby2312)
    It is existent in those countries, its embedded in the laws of those countries.In indonesia a girl was recently lashed because she went on a date with the opposite sex.
    Whilst I think it horrible and completely disagree with it, I don't think this incident is representative of Indonesia as a whole. This incident took place in the autonomous region of Aceh. Outside of Aceh this doesn't take place.
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    (Original post by Plantagenet Crown)
    Islam is a revolting, sickening, backwards, bigoted and violent religion that deserves all the criticism and brutal scrutiny it can get. That's the only way it will have a chance, no matter how small, of becoming more liberal and less literal in the near future.
    i don't know if provoking a bunch of hot heads who don't have much going for them is the best way to go around this ....
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    (Original post by savonarola)
    i don't know if provoking a bunch of hot heads who don't have much going for them is the best way to go around this ....
    Bending over for them has got us nowhere

    I do think if they want a fight a fight is what they should get
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    (Original post by D3LLI5)
    opinion polls show the majority of muslims believe in the barbaric teachings of the quran and the hadiths, they just don't blow themselves up over it
    No they don't, a misleading poll or two suggest that x Muslims want Sharia Law, and Sharia Law has no set list of things that have to be followed, and also the majority of Muslims who want Sharia Law do not want it imposed on non-Muslims.

    Get your facts straight.
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    (Original post by inhuman)
    There is a difference between the random violence of bad humans, and the systematic discrimination and oppression inherent in the ideology you subscribe to (as a Muslim).
    I'm not a Muslim, sorry to disappoint you.
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    (Original post by Plantagenet Crown)
    Islam is a revolting, sickening, backwards, bigoted and violent religion that deserves all the criticism and brutal scrutiny it can get. That's the only way it will have a chance, no matter how small, of becoming more liberal and less literal in the near future.
    I smell ignorance.
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    (Original post by alevelstresss)
    No they don't, a misleading poll or two suggest that x Muslims want Sharia Law, and Sharia Law has no set list of things that have to be followed, and also the majority of Muslims who want Sharia Law do not want it imposed on non-Muslims.

    Get your facts straight.
    It seems that many people on this thread are committed to misunderstanding you.
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    (Original post by alevelstresss)
    It is existent, but no more than violence in our own countries. But apparently, the foreign, dirty religion is the one most worthy of criticism. You're attacking religion when that does nothing whatsoever to help the situation, regardless of whether or not it is actually the cause.
    I dislike the implication that im picking on islam because its foreign and dirty.Islam is not a race and i'm perfectly within my rights to criticise aspects of the religion which I see as intolerant or violent.I dislike christianity just as much because its notoriously homophobic however christians arent going around blowing people up.But saying that this problem of violence is not just confined to Islam.Its apparent throughout the centuries.Christianity has been just as violent.Giordano Bruno was burnt at the stake because he wouldnt say there were no other worlds.Hypatia was flayed alive in Alexandria because she advocated science and reason over christianty.So the problem of regressive laws and violence seems to be common to both Islam and christianty.Violence appears to be a symptom of the religous mind and you can see this throughout history.
 
 
 
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