£350m a week for the NHS lie finally bites the dust

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    (Original post by MagicNMedicine)
    Theresa May needs to be careful with the NHS.

    She seems to be trying to resemble Thatcher but she would do well to avoid the Thatcher tendency of the later years to ignore public opinion and barge down in to a cul de sac like the Poll Tax.

    The NHS is important to the public and if it is seen to be failing, it will be a major issue at the next election. May has taken the approach here of "getting tough with the NHS" telling them to focus on making efficiencies, just like Hunt focused on "getting tough with the doctors". I expect that their approach will be, in the face of criticism, to blame things on the BMA, blame NHS England for not being efficient, etc but by the time 2020 comes around and there has been a Conservative government for 10 years it becomes harder and harder to avoid blame and it will contribute to the image of the Tories not being on peoples side if the government is targeting the people that work in the NHS to blame.

    Whilst some right wing Conservatives and UKIPers love the idea of privatised healthcare, it is toxic as a voting issue in the UK - you simply will not get people to vote for you if you stand up on a ticket of privatising the NHS. Theresa May needs to sort this out: her focus on grammar schools, reforming company law and so on will all pale in to insignificance for the public if the NHS is failing.
    Yeah, they can, because they'll argue that the NHS is broken and the only choice is to distribute to private capital.

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    Are the remoaners STILL bitter about Brexit? Get on board, the liberals lost, we are off the sinking ship!
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    (Original post by cashcash871)
    Thanks for the detailed response. But didn't most of the banks and financial instructions in the City of London (and American banks with offices in London) support remaining in the EU?
    It isn't (generally) the big corporations. It is individual offshore oligarchs like Michael Ashcroft (Lord Ashcroft of Belize - a massive tax evader on an almost industrial scale who basically owns his own country) who funded most of the Tory backbenchers now slavering for Brexit and Arron Banks, funder of UKIP, who seems to live in Bristol whilst being offshored, somewhat strangely. He's a fixture in the Panama Papers.
    https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...-brexit-backer

    However, tax-dodging billionaires like these people are nothing compared to Rupert Murdoch, who has had a long running interest in removing the UK from the EU. From his bolt hole in New York, the Australian oligarch appears to be mainly motivated by hatred of Britain, something he often brags about. He has also tried repeatedly to destroy the monarchy, something he got close to achieving at the time of Diana's death.
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    (Original post by cashcash871)
    As an American, I'm curious. Did President Obama's speech about "back of the line" affect the outcome of the referendum? And what do you guys feel was the primary reason for leaving the EU? Was it the TTIP trade deal? Or mainly immigration and the refugee issue?
    It was a queue, not a line, and it probably didn't. Much like America with the presidential election (I hope) we aren't exactly fans of having foreign powers coming along and telling us how to vote, especially if there is perceived message rigging or vested interests. Further it amounted to a threat from an ally. As I recall there was a small polling shift for a few days, but like with all the threats made that polls shift only lasted a few days.

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    (Original post by Fullofsurprises)
    Theresa May has announced no more money for the NHS, despite widespread evidence of a massive crisis looming in both emergency and regular care, partly caused by the side effects of government cuts to social care for the elderly.
    https://www.theguardian.com/society/...tumn-statement

    This is the real Leave Britain - not a penny more for the NHS.

    Boris Johnson is not returning calls on the subject. Michael Gove is in hiding. Nigel Farage is at his luxury house in Brussels. The NHS is collapsing. :sad:

    Tory Britain. :rolleyes:
    The claim could of been true, but it appears the remain side of the argument are trying to put a downer on all most everything- the 350 Million claim was not strictly true due to us getting a rebate from the European union I calculated in the past we hand them about £35,000,000 a day and we have zero control to how the rebate is spent.The top and bottom of it is that they have chose a primeminister who is not fully behind brexit but the rational of the claim was giving the NHS money- had the primeminster been someone behind brexit we may have seen some of the money going to the NHS but the remoaners are trying to uproar news. I think Brexit is the best decision we have ever made
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    (Original post by That Bearded Man)
    Yeah, they can, because they'll argue that the NHS is broken and the only choice is to distribute to private capital.
    The Conservatives know that's not a vote winner otherwise they would have just said it outright and campaigned on it.

    They always like to insist that the Conservatives are the true guardians of the NHS and Labour are the party that led to the largest privatisation (which surely is a good thing, in the eyes of free-marketeers?)
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    (Original post by Fullofsurprises)
    Theresa May has announced no more money for the NHS
    Remind me what Ms. May's position was re: EUref?

    Tory Britain. :rolleyes:
    Remind me which party presided over the greatest PFI bankrupting, and percentage terms privatisation, of NHS institutions?
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    (Original post by Foo.mp3)
    Remind me what Ms. May's position was re: EUref?

    Remind me which party presided over the greatest PFI bankrupting, and percentage terms privatisation, of NHS institutions?
    Saying 'ah but Labour did it too' is not an excuse, it's whataboutery. I'm a Labour voter who was appalled at Blair's PFI. Does that mean I can't be appalled at May?
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    (Original post by Jammy Duel)
    It was a queue, not a line, and it probably didn't. Much like America with the presidential election (I hope) we aren't exactly fans of having foreign powers coming along and telling us how to vote, especially if there is perceived message rigging or vested interests. Further it amounted to a threat from an ally. As I recall there was a small polling shift for a few days, but like with all the threats made that polls shift only lasted a few days.

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    Yet you support Farage telling Americans to vote for Trump

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    (Original post by TheBigMan2)
    The claim could of been true, but it appears the remain side of the argument are trying to put a downer on all most everything- the 350 Million claim was not strictly true due to us getting a rebate from the European union I calculated in the past we hand them about £35,000,000 a day and we have zero control to how the rebate is spent.The top and bottom of it is that they have chose a primeminister who is not fully behind brexit but the rational of the claim was giving the NHS money- had the primeminster been someone behind brexit we may have seen some of the money going to the NHS but the remoaners are trying to uproar news. I think Brexit is the best decision we have ever made
    All depends where the money goes, and I guarantee none or very little of that will trickle down to us plebs

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    (Original post by Foo.mp3)
    Remind me what Ms. May's position was re: EUref?

    Remind me which party presided over the greatest PFI bankrupting, and percentage terms privatisation, of NHS institutions?
    Two odd arguments.

    What has that got to do with the EU? The Tories are using that as an excuse to defund the health service.

    So is your argument that since Blair/Burnham instigated PFI and therefore Labour can't ever be trusted, so thus the Tories are allowed carte blanche?

    Further services are being handed to private sector, Cameron now involved with Bain Capital who run our blood services, hospitals forced to compete instead of merge etc. Do you support this or is it just "not as bad as Labour"

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    (Original post by Fullofsurprises)
    Theresa May has announced no more money for the NHS, despite widespread evidence of a massive crisis looming in both emergency and regular care, partly caused by the side effects of government cuts to social care for the elderly.
    https://www.theguardian.com/society/...tumn-statement

    This is the real Leave Britain - not a penny more for the NHS.

    Boris Johnson is not returning calls on the subject. Michael Gove is in hiding. Nigel Farage is at his luxury house in Brussels. The NHS is collapsing. :sad:

    Tory Britain. :rolleyes:
    I'm sure it's been said already but no one said we would spend 350m a week extra on the NHS.

    It was suggested by the leave campaign that we could spend an extra 100m a week on the NHS but that's all it was, a suggestion they aren't a government with a manifesto to sell.

    If someone can't read two sentences separately or be bothered to listen to a debate on the tv or even understand the difference between a cross party single issue campaign and a government that is their problem


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    (Original post by Bornblue)
    Saying 'ah but Labour did it too' is not an excuse
    1) Nothing in what I said establishes, in fact, any desire to excuse anyone of anything

    2) I did not say Labour did it too, I implied Labour were even worse

    I'm a Labour voter who was appalled at Blair's PFI. Does that mean I can't be appalled at May?
    (Original post by That Bearded Man)
    So is your argument that since Blair/Burnham instigated PFI and therefore Labour can't ever be trusted, so thus the Tories are allowed carte blanche?
    No idea what you guys are gassing about, but keep trying to put words in my mouth if it helps sooth your Labour wounds

    Do you support this or is it just "not as bad as Labour"
    I support competition/efficiency drives, but absolutely abhor Crony Capitalism and profiteering re: fulfilment of basic needs (food, water, shelter, healthcare @ unwitting illness/injury)
 
 
 
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