Trump & Brexit is what happens when you smear all who disagree as racist Watch

Damien96
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#81
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#81
(Original post by mojojojo101)
If we all just slaves to our basic human nature, why the **** to we bother having societies and communities and all this other ****?


Here's an idea for some of the people who votedfor Trump/Brexit/whatever the next alt-right wet dream is: if you dont want to be called a racist, sexist homophobe stop being racist, sexist and homophobic...
And here's an idea for those who were against those voters, stop calling everyone racist, sexist homophobes and try listening to views you might not agree with. You no more hold the keys to absolute truth than they do, and the assumption they are all bigots is precisely the attitude that has led to a populist bigot gaining power.
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Fractite
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#82
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#82
Trump and Credit also proves that no crazy celebrity endorsement will ever help you too much (remain camp and Clinton).
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Little Popcorns
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#83
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#83
(Original post by Damien96)
Of course you didn't, that wouldn't sit well with your progressive stance. When you say poorly educated bigots and trailer trash I am sure you were referring to the millions of students and professionals that got him the presidency.

Trump is not the answer to the smug deafness and smearing of the modern left, he is the result. You won't find me argueing for either his policies or rhetoric.
They did it out of the ignorance of privilege, never having had to struggle to get where they are. These people don't have anything resting on their vote they're fine either way, whatever the result. If people don't speak for them then they won't be worse off... meanwhile, Trump now in office at least they can treat themselves to a good old giggle as they rest on their laurels.

What are you arguing for then?
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Willy Pete
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#84
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#84
Can't we just all be happy that the right people won?
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Little Popcorns
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#85
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#85
(Original post by Whitewell)
What social issues did they need education in?

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False consciousness... Trump doesn't give a **** about the ordinary man let alone understand them.
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Damien96
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#86
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#86
(Original post by Little Popcorns)
They did it out of the ignorance of privilege, never having had to struggle to get where they are. These people don't have anything resting on their vote they're fine either way, whatever the result. If people don't speak for them then they won't be worse off... meanwhile, Trump now in office at least they can treat themselves to a good old giggle as they rest on their laurels.

What are you arguing for then?
The assumptions you made within the first few words are breathtaking. Listen to yourself! How do you know this?

I am argueing, as I said in the OP, that we as liberals stop labelling everyone we disgaree with as bigots. There are genuine problems with immigration, there are genuine issues with Islamism, there are genuinely problems of unemployment and poverty within white working class communities. You don't need to agree with every conclusion, but you should listen. Either that or it will fester, harden and lead to where we are today.

None of this requires you to turn a blind eye to bigotry. I certainly won't be.
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yudothis
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#87
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#87
(Original post by Damien96)
Here's a fact for you, I don't support Trump, never said I did, never even eluded supporting him, but don't let that get in the way of your righteous indignation.

I hate Trump, I hate the fact that he is in power. I know he's a liar, the figure is actually around 70%, and I am utterly depressed by the result. The difference between you and I is that I am seeking solutions, not doubling down and shouting racism at anyone who disagrees.

But that's me, all illogical and prejudiced and that.
Yes, it is.

You are making it out as if calling people racists is what lost the election. You are also suggesting to not speak up against evil.
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Whitewell
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#88
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#88
(Original post by Little Popcorns)
False consciousness... Trump doesn't give a **** about the ordinary man let alone understand them.
By False consciousness, you mean they thought Trump listens and cares for the working man when the 'establishment' didn't?

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Damien96
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#89
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#89
(Original post by yudothis)
Yes, it is.

You are making it out as if calling people racists is what lost the election. You are also suggesting to not speak up against evil.
Oh OK, thanks for telling me what it is I and tens of millions of voters think. I wish I had your psychic ability, it would save me so much trouble discussing what's actually been said.
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Little Popcorns
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#90
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(Original post by Damien96)
The assumptions you made within the first few words are breathtaking. Listen to yourself! How do you know this?

I am argueing, as I said in the OP, that we as liberals stop labelling everyone we disgaree with as bigots. There are genuine problems with immigration, there are genuine issues with Islamism, there are genuinely problems of unemployment and poverty within white working class communities. You don't need to agree with every conclusion, but you should listen. Either that or it will fester, harden and lead to where we are today.

None of this requires you to turn a blind eye to bigotry. I certainly won't be.
Is it really that breathtaking? Why else would they punish the most vulnerable, the disabled, minority groups? You're telling me they've factored that in and decided to go ahead anyway? And you call that an educated decision? I agree there's nothing to be gained from just bashing people for their views but when you realise why people are doing it, out of anger for the vulnerable and the marginalised then... anger is expected you're expressing the upset and voicing concerns they might at this stage not be able to voice themselves.

The left wants to address these issues but doesn't believe the method of doing that is to sideline these people (minority groups) in order to address the ones who're looking for a scapegoat anyway. Change never came quietly.
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Little Popcorns
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#91
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#91
(Original post by Whitewell)
By False consciousness, you mean they thought Trump listens and cares for the working man when the 'establishment' didn't?

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yes that is ********, he is the establishment
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Damien96
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#92
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#92
(Original post by Little Popcorns)
Is it really that breathtaking? Why else would they punish the most vulnerable, the disabled, minority groups? You're telling me they've factored that in and decided to go ahead anyway? And you call that an educated decision? I agree there's nothing to be gained from just bashing people for their views but when you realise why people are doing it, out of anger for the vulnerable and the marginalised then... anger is expected you're expressing the upset and voicing concerns they might at this stage not be able to voice themselves.

The left wants to address these issues but doesn't believe the method of doing that is to sideline these people (minority groups) in order to address the ones who're looking for a scapegoat anyway. Change never came quietly.
I didn't claim it to be an educated decision, I do say it was a desperate, angry and fearful one, a situation not helped by faux left wing bullies. We seem to agree on some of that?

Liberalism is typically the best way to address those issues you highlighted and is why I consider myself one. It is also why I am so angry the left has become so iliiberal and nauseatingly smug.

The problem with setting up the premise of minorities against a white majority is it assumes those within the majority weild some kind of power. The left has done this for too long, dismissing all of their concerns, and the right has scooped them up like turds on a street corner.

It is too easy to blame the right and shout racism, we alsoneed to look in the mirror as we are losing every election miserably to more and more extreme expressions of that frustration.
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mojojojo101
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#93
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#93
(Original post by Damien96)
And here's an idea for those who were against those voters, stop calling everyone racist, sexist homophobes and try listening to views you might not agree with. You no more hold the keys to absolute truth than they do, and the assumption they are all bigots is precisely the attitude that has led to a populist bigot gaining power.
Where did I call everyone racist?

The right wing are constantly whinging about how sensitive the left is, yet they are the ones who are constantly offended. I won't stop calling people racist when the express racist points of view, I won't stop calling you sexist or a homophobe when you are sexist or homophobic just to protect your fragile ego.

I will listen, I do listen, how about you do the same.
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Bang Outta Order
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#94
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(Original post by Mathemagicien)
Also, not letting prisoners vote really hurt the non-white voting base, and thus the democrats. I wonder if polling data includes prisoners or not (there are millions of them in the US).
I was saying this in my countdown thread (at 3am when votes were closing in lol), that if blacks weren't prisoners/felons they'd be able to push Hillary over the small speed bump to a win. But that's their fault being criminals. Now they have a president who doesn't prioritise them, if they ever did.
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Damien96
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#95
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#95
(Original post by mojojojo101)
Where did I call everyone racist?

The right wing are constantly whinging about how sensitive the left is, yet they are the ones who are constantly offended. I won't stop calling people racist when the express racist points of view, I won't stop calling you sexist or a homophobe when you are sexist or homophobic just to protect your fragile ego.

I will listen, I do listen, how about you do the same.
I apologise, I missed the "SOME of the people" part of your response.

I agree wholly as long as you mean pushing back against real bigotry and not those that might make us uncomfortable by disagreeing on sensitive topics.

I also despise the Alt-Right. Largely a bunch of conmen and women working for Breitbart, doing everything they can to prevent respectful, honest discourse.
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Dodgypirate
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#96
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#96
(Original post by Mathemagicien)
Imma just leave this here



Can't find source lol, but similar here
https://www.surveymonkey.com/electio...ials-white-cps

Absolutely deplorable.
Deplorable that the vast majority of white men voted Trump?

Isn't that racism?

What's your point? It's almost as if you're saying POC are better than whites because they voted for the candidate you wanted, and who you thought was right.
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Bang Outta Order
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#97
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#97
(Original post by Fractite)
Trump and Credit also proves that no crazy celebrity endorsement will ever help you too much (remain camp and Clinton).
lmao so true. Nearly every celeb paid out their arse for her, Katy Perry has enough twitter followers to give Hillary the vote by herself but thankfully/apparently people don't value celebrities' opinions after all :daydreaming:lol
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Dodgypirate
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#98
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#98
Summary of why and how Trump won.

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Bang Outta Order
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#99
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#99
(Original post by Little Popcorns)
I didn't say anything about poor people thank you very much! I said uneducated bigots two very different things i.e. people who don't understand the issues and vote with their gut and on the basis of him opening is big fat gob and coming out with sexist/racist things they probably resonate with whilst discarding any of the real issues and not looking into his policy on those because why would they when he said he wants to get rid of all the muslims and they hate the bloody muslims and the mexicans well they hate them too so he's said these thing must = man after my own heart... except when he pulls all the state welfare they receive or doesn't bother to help social care problems/poverty etc, then they're like ughhhh so racist doesn't = good person willing to fight for our rights as trailer trash? No sweetie it means he'll be fighting for the rights of big corps that don't give two ****s about you, but you can still sit at home and be racist if you like he'll never take that away from you!
shhh calm dowwwwn :console:

it's over. No amount of bickering will change that.
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Little Popcorns
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#100
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(Original post by Damien96)
I didn't claim it to be an educated decision, I do say it was a desperate, angry and fearful one, a situation not helped by faux left wing bullies. We seem to agree on some of that?

Liberalism is typically the best way to address those issues you highlighted and is why I consider myself one. It is also why I am so angry the left has become so iliiberal and nauseatingly smug.

The problem with setting up the premise of minorities against a white majority is it assumes those within the majority weild some kind of power. The left has done this for too long, dismissing all of their concerns, and the right has scooped them up like turds on a street corner.

It is too easy to blame the right and shout racism, we alsoneed to look in the mirror as we are losing every election miserably to more and more extreme expressions of that frustration.
I don't know about them being faux left bullies I think the people shouting loudly and aggressively in response on the left are doing so with good intentions and speaking for the marginalised as they see it which you can't fault them for! And you really can't uncover a similar pure intention from the opposing side. They are driven by power at the expense of others and you have to expect anger from the opposition in those circumstances. That doesn't mean there doesn't need to be a dramatic shift in direction to the major political/societal problems at the moment noone can deny that. Anger and aggression from either side are not going to solve them. The UK is a liberal country that has not shielded it from the rise of right wing extremism we have to recognise that the solutions are complex and noone denies that everyone must be heard in order to effect change with the least casualties but that doesn't mean left wing activism is the problem!!!
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