Turn on thread page Beta

Tibet watch

Announcements
  • View Poll Results: Do you support Tibet's freedom?
    Yes
    62.22%
    No
    37.78%

    • Thread Starter
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by chaosclazza)
    i will NOT vote unless u change the poll.
    Tibet is free. so theres no such thing as 'Do you support Tibet's freedom?'

    U can ask the question as 'do u support Tibet to become a independent country'

    As far as i know, Tibetans are seperated into 2 different halfs.
    the majority of them (whos still living in Tibet) were once slaves. and the so called 'Free Tibet' org. were the Landlords. before the Chinese went in Tibet. They were ruled under slavery.The CCP took their lands away and gave them to the ex-slaves. therefore the Landlords arent so happy and tried to get the CCP out of tibet since.(i got this info whn i was arguing with another guy in my school about Tibet issues LOL)

    why is Tibet issue so BIG if its jsut another state that wants to be seperated from their country?
    1. hmmmmm Because the country is China... and apparently every western country hates China ...
    2. Because Tibet is located in an INCREDIBLY valuable Millitary position:- Its got Russia on the top, China on the east, Europe on the west and the upcoming power India and the Oil-rich countries on the South....so yh the reason is Obvious why the americans are so keen about seperating Tibet from China.

    I bet with a whole year of my student Loan that IF Tibet becomes an independent country, the first military force goes in there are from the USA.......thn goes the Russian and Chinese.. etc... so yh.

    But anyway!
    The most important thing is: Tibet was is and always will be a province of China, it was that way in the past 5000 years of Chinese History and it will stay like that
    I welcome you not to vote.
    Look into your China, there are two halfs, the members of the Party (CCP) and the non members of the Party, who are treated differently. I just say, I admit I have no evidence. Should we free China?
    1. Why does every western country hate China? Dont say they envy China's growth. Look at other growing economies, for example India, do they got that much hatred? Eating babies, harvesting organ from living people, exporting fake/poisoned products.. Where are these gossips come from?
    2.Millitary position.. just shut up.
    Offline

    1
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by chaosclazza)
    As far as i know, Tibetans are seperated into 2 different halfs.
    the majority of them (whos still living in Tibet) were once slaves. and the so called 'Free Tibet' org. were the Landlords. before the Chinese went in Tibet. They were ruled under slavery.The CCP took their lands away and gave them to the ex-slaves. therefore the Landlords arent so happy and tried to get the CCP out of tibet since.
    Is this the crap they teach you over there? That China invaded and slaughtered thousands of Tibetans so that they could liberate them from... the bad Tibetans?
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by neo232)
    Look into your China, there are two halfs, the members of the Party (CCP) and the non members of the Party, who are treated differently. I just say, I admit I have no evidence. Should we free China?
    That's a ridiculous comparison. The quoted post was talking about a legalised class system. If you wish to you can join the CCP but you might never be able to join the Landlord class in a society that doesn't promote economic life cycles.
    Offline

    10
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Kondar)
    I don't know what can be done that has not already been seen. I think the pre-olympic build up and the conflicts that revolved around it will probably be the most we will see for a while. Although this did spark new discussion and attention towards the issue, which should be good for the Tibetans. It also forced the Chinese to tighten their fist and retain greater control over the area, imprisoning many priests and activists for who knows how long. There are varying voices in the Tibetan community that are united in their call for true religious freedom, but differ in political matters. The Dali Lama himself would like only autonomy, while others, including various authors and political savy exiles are calling for outright independence. Some believe this can be achieved through conflict while others think that their patience can outlast anything.

    What do you think? You see this escalating to a military conflict?
    Not in the conventional sense, because, um, the Tibetans don't have an army. No, I'm thinking more of an insurgency that eventually provokes a good old-fashioned Chinese crackdown because the Party doesn't know how to react any other way. After all, every time something happens in Tibet, their response exacerbates things. It's a vicious circle.
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by neo232)
    I welcome you not to vote.
    Look into your China, there are two halfs, the members of the Party (CCP) and the non members of the Party, who are treated differently. I just say, I admit I have no evidence. Should we free China?
    1. Why does every western country hate China? Dont say they envy China's growth. Look at other growing economies, for example India, do they got that much hatred? Eating babies, harvesting organ from living people, exporting fake/poisoned products.. Where are these gossips come from?
    2.Millitary position.. just shut up.
    I cant believe that comment came from a Student in the 21st Century! because its just absolutely SHALLOW.
    Eating babies? Harvest body organs? what do you think this is ?
    Pre-stoneage?

    'exporting fake/poisoned products'
    Its not us exporting it. its jsut U are buying it. There are Millions of High-quality factories in China.... and its just the English Business man cant be assed to pay that much money.
    (Original post by neo232)
    Why does every western country hate China? Dont say they envy China's growth. Look at other growing economies, for example India, do they got that much hatred?
    Hmmmmm that was a 'good' example to talk about....
    Yh India..........
    China GDP 2007 - 11.40%

    India GDP 2007 - 9.60%

    Well done. arent they growing at the 'same' rate

    Oh btw how many soildiers has the Indian got? and how many has the Chinese got....... Hmm yh no wonder the Americans are so keen on making everyone to hate the Chinese.

    'Look into your China, there are two halfs, the members of the Party (CCP) and the non members of the Party, who are treated differently. I just say, I admit I have no evidence. Should we free China?' Hmmm guess wot. non of my families are in the CCP, but they still get alot of benefits from the government.

    All i wanna say is IF u heard it from someone else without seeing the truth. thn dont tell other ppl about it. because that is called Bull****ing :yep:
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Kondar)
    Is this the crap they teach you over there? That China invaded and slaughtered thousands of Tibetans so that they could liberate them from... the bad Tibetans?
    see as i just said. IF U HEARD THIS FROM SOMEONE ELSE WITHOUT KNOWING WOT AcTUALLY HAPPENED THN KEEP IT TO URSELF> because as at the moment u tell other ppl about it. Its called Bull*****ing.

    (Original post by Kondar)
    Is this the crap they teach you over there??
    Not really
    (Original post by Kondar)
    China invaded and slaughtered thousands of Tibetans so that they could liberate them from... the bad Tibetans?
    Is that the CRAP they teach u in the States??
    • Thread Starter
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    see as i just said. IF U HEARD THIS FROM SOMEONE ELSE WITHOUT KNOWING WOT AcTUALLY HAPPENED THN KEEP IT TO URSELF> because as at the moment u tell other ppl about it. Its called Bull*****ing.
    Calm down Chinese boy, if you want to see the evidence Chinese soldiers kill Tibetans, check out the video at my first post - if u want to say that is fake, and call anyone ********, join the Youtube debate, not here.

    Its not us exporting it. its jsut U are buying it
    Actually some are banned, how to prevent British people from buying Chinese products? You can write a letter to Gordon Brown and suggest the idea of boycotting all Chinese products. If you want.

    Oh btw how many soildiers has the Indian got? and how many has the Chinese got....... Hmm yh no wonder the Americans are so keen on making everyone to hate the Chinese.
    I wonder how many did they kill? You can say the rest of the world, at least the media, keen on making China to be a threat to this world, not only the Americans. You still didnt answer the question: why do the world, at least the media, hate China?

    Hmmm guess wot. non of my families are in the CCP, but they still get alot of benefits from the government.
    So how do u know the way CCP treats its members? you have nothing to compare with.

    China GDP 2007 - 11.40%

    India GDP 2007 - 9.60%

    Well done. arent they growing at the 'same' rate
    Is growing rate the only economic factor you know about in China? Btw people hate China because China is growing? to be a bigger threat to this world?

    Eating babies? Harvest body organs? what do you think this is ?
    Pre-stoneage?
    Still want me to prove/show evidence about baby eating, organ harvesting.. ? Anyway you can just google it. Make sure it is google.com not google.cn ok? Coz many sites like google.cn are censored in China, even wikipedia.

    Oh just realize u had American's flag some minutes earlier, then now Chinese flag.. Words go well with actions, dont hesitate to humiliate any American here, good job Chinese boy.
    Offline

    10
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by chaosclazza)
    Is that the CRAP they teach u in the States??
    Um, I think you've missed the point.

    Anyway, this thread now seems to have been derailed from discussion of the actual realities of Tibet, and how to deal with them, by a single frothing Chinese nationalist railing against everyone who's not pureblood Han.
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Agent Smith)
    Um, I think you've missed the point.

    Anyway, this thread now seems to have been derailed from discussion of the actual realities of Tibet, and how to deal with them, by a single frothing Chinese nationalist railing against everyone who's not pureblood Han.
    Did u just say a Chinese is frothing about hes own country? bloodyhell.
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by neo232)
    Calm down Chinese boy, if you want to see the evidence Chinese soldiers kill Tibetans, check out the video at my first post - if u want to say that is fake, and call anyone ********, join the Youtube debate, not here.
    Hmm ive seen that video a long while ago. No one knows what actually happened that day.i dont want to argue with u about that video either because its just somethng cant be explained to ppl believe in their media so much. ANYWAY.


    Boycott Chinese products? HAHAHAHA LOL id love to see Gordon doing that :yep:
    Never say whats wrong with their own way,always blame on someone else. aint that Typical British :yep:
    tell ya what, if u dont want those low quality products in ur house thn dont go to Pound Land.



    (Original post by neo232)
    'So how do u know the way CCP treats its members? you have nothing to compare with.
    I dunno and i dont care. as Long as the CCP is making China better, thn they are a GOOD government. unlike some... who always cause trouble to their fellow country men.

    (Original post by neo232)
    You still didnt answer the question: why do the world, at least the media, hate China?.
    ah ah! CNN+ BBC ≠ the Media of the world. get it right Mr 'Im so clever'


    (Original post by neo232)
    Is growing rate the only economic factor you know about in China?
    I think u can only messure Economic growth rate with the 'economic growth rate'. Dont u? well, read a couple of books and learn. btw i believe u r doing Economics in uni arnt u?? Cant believe u dont know wot GDP represents. epic fail?
    (Original post by neo232)
    Is growing rate the only economic factor you know about in China? Btw people hate China because China is growing? to be a bigger threat to this world?
    a word of correction Btw people hate China because China is growing? to be a bigger threat to the Western ex-Big countries.


    (Original post by neo232)
    Still want me to prove/show evidence about baby eating, organ harvesting.. ? Anyway you can just google it. Make sure it is google.com not google.cn ok? Coz many sites like google.cn are censored in China, even wikipedia.
    sensored websites in China. ahhhh i hate them! but anyway. Baby eating LOL are u jsut gonna bring up the Chinese are Aliens from Mars next? Dont be childish.

    (Original post by neo232)
    Oh just realize u had American's flag some minutes earlier then now Chinese flag..
    Did i? Theres a quiet big difference between Malaysian flag and the US flag u know?..
    (Original post by neo232)
    Words go well with actions, dont hesitate to humiliate any American here, good job Chinese boy.
    No one like the Americans.:yep: well, at least Bush.

    (Original post by neo232)
    Chinese boy.
    Dont make urself sound so Old and Mature. coz ur comments are just as Childish as a Baby's Nappy.
    Offline

    13
    ReputationRep:
    Tough question in a way. Pretty much everything that is wrong and reprehensible about Chinese rule in Tibet is going on across the rest of the country. Id like to see the end of Communist rule and the growth of liberal democracy across the entire region, not just Tibet, and considering the deeply primitive, feudal and theocratic country Tibet was before Chinese rule i find it hard to jump on the always fashionable "free Tibet" bandwagon.
    Offline

    13
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by chaosclazza)
    a word of correction Btw people hate China because China is growing? to be a bigger threat to the Western ex-Big countries.
    Nah. I wouldnt say anyone really hates China but it is certainly viewed with suspicion and hostility - and rightly so. Its a dictatorship with a great many problems regarding human rights and freedoms which is imperial in its ambition and is doing its damnedest to prop up some of the most disgusting and destablising regimes in history such as Burma, Sudan, Zimbabwe, North Korea - the last actually being a Chinese Communist creation - and makes no secret of its determination to go to war against the only part of China which is free, democratic and first world; the Republic of China. One of the great tragedies of history is that the mass-murdering madman Mao and his Communists defeated Chiang Kai-Shek and the Nationalists.
    Offline

    1
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by chaosclazza)
    as a Baby's Nappy.
    haha, I love it!

    Listen, a major difference in our perspectives seems to be that we in the west are allowed to make up our own minds and can access any information we want. Our government allows us to read and obtain any kind of website, periodical, or book that we chose. The Chinese are not allowed this same luxury and have all of their information handed to them by the government. The very same government that still has a huge picture of Chairman Mao hanging in front of the Forbidden City, the same government that denies there was ever a massacre at Tienanmen Square, the same government that complains about Japanese glossing over a troubled past in their textbooks and then completely makes up their own history.

    We have access to so much information that you will never see and never hear because your government does not think you can handle it. You want you country to be recognized as one of the best and most powerful on earth yet it is one of the last to allow their citizens freedom of the press.

    This is the 21st century, not the 12th, if China really wants respect from the west (which they are begging for) then they need to get with the modern times and stop spying on all of their citizens and arresting people for having opinions. There is no way anyone can argue with you over this as you only have one (fabricated) side of the story, heck, I would guess most people here know more about China's history than you do.
    • Thread Starter
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by chaosclazza)
    Dont make urself sound so Old and Mature. coz ur comments are just as Childish as a Baby's Nappy.
    Sorry Chinese man, the little flag symbol is so small that I didnt recognize yours was Malaysian flag. That was my stupid fault.
    (Original post by chaosclazza)
    I think u can only messure Economic growth rate with the 'economic growth rate'. Dont u? well, read a couple of books and learn. btw i believe u r doing Economics in uni arnt u?? Cant believe u dont know wot GDP represents. epic fail?
    Yes I am doing economics at the university, I did read economics books and I know what GDP is. All I want to say is: Chinese media, which is totally controlled by its government, only focus on the achievements like GDP growth - which make Chinese citizens believe that CCP's policies are perfect - but forget about other aspects of economics such as inflation, poverty, corruption, pollution, workers' safety and their rights to have an Union..
    (Original post by chaosclazza)
    Baby eating LOL are u jsut gonna bring up the Chinese are Aliens from Mars next? Dont be childish.
    It might not be true. However you deny it just because you have NEVER seen it? Learn critical thinking, and If you want I will make another thread about these problems with full proofs, evidences, pictures, sources etc. Hope you will join and have a nice debate Chinese man.
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Kondar)
    haha, I love it!

    Listen, a major difference in our perspectives seems to be that we in the west are allowed to make up our own minds and can access any information we want. Our government allows us to read and obtain any kind of website, periodical, or book that we chose. The Chinese are not allowed this same luxury and have all of their information handed to them by the government. The very same government that still has a huge picture of Chairman Mao hanging in front of the Forbidden City, the same government that denies there was ever a massacre at Tienanmen Square, the same government that complains about Japanese glossing over a troubled past in their textbooks and then completely makes up their own history.

    We have access to so much information that you will never see and never hear because your government does not think you can handle it. You want you country to be recognized as one of the best and most powerful on earth yet it is one of the last to allow their citizens freedom of the press.

    This is the 21st century, not the 12th, if China really wants respect from the west (which they are begging for) then they need to get with the modern times and stop spying on all of their citizens and arresting people for having opinions. There is no way anyone can argue with you over this as you only have one (fabricated) side of the story, heck, I would guess most people here know more about China's history than you do.
    1. I tottally agree with u about the government control issues. I hate it whe they senor all those websites in China, therefore im on your side about this issue.
    2. The reason why we still have a pictrue of Chairman Mao in frony of Forbidden city i believe is because He was the one who Created PRChina. YES he has made ALOT of Mistakes whn he was alive, YES he did do some stupid things that u think we dont learn about in China which we do. But what the good things he did to the Chinese people are undeniable, he started the chapter in which China becomes one of the leading countries in the world again.
    3. The japanese massacre in China is UNDENIABLE. I personally know people old enough who has witnessed the massacare during the WW2, there are pictrue evidences, there are even ex-japanese soildiers who tells people what happened during the war. We chinese dont expect anything from Japan, but an apology. The germen president KNEELED infront of the millions of dead souls of Jewish. we dont want that, all we want is a simple 'SORRY'(maybe in japanese)
    4. Yes u do have alot of Information that we dont seem to be able to get hold of in China, but god know how many of those are true and how many were jsut simply made up to entertain all those shallow minded people.
    5.The 'pying on all of their citizens and arresting people for having opinions' comment is partially true. They arrest people with Extreme opinions, which may lead to trouble. seee this is where common sense comes in. u dont just go on to the street and kill whoever says bad things about the Chinese goverment, otherwise the chinese population wouldnt be this high.
    6.'I would guess most people here know more about China's history than you do' I feel sorry for this comment. u reckon u know Chinese history more thn a Chinese do? 5000 years of Chinese History,From Rhe Huang and Yan to the Qin Empire; From Tang,Song Yuan, Ming,Qing To the modern China. How much do you know about? 2 years? 2 months? or is it just the few 'dark dots'?
    7. Yes the Chinese state television/ CCTV is Controlled by the government. However that is not the only news we watch. There is a typical 'in the middle' news channel called Phoenix and surprisingly its from HongKong, and has NOTHING, abusolutly nothing with the Government.

    Im not here to argue for the government, i just feel sorry as a Chinese, that so many bad things are being said about us in th UK and US, and so many of them are just simply untrue.I also feel sorry for those uni. people who is so in trend of joining the 'Free Tibet' group, just because the media surrounding them says so. tbh and i am being honest here. Tibet is more Chinese than Northern Irish being British.
    If you dont believe me ( i dont expect any of the 'activist' in this post to believe me anyway) just go to China and see. when you are in china dont just stay in the 'White man's circle' Go out! and Talk! Talk to those Chinese! the Real Chinese!Learn from them! Then compare them with what you see over here in the west.

    This is it. My last post on this thread. Im too tired of arguing with so many people on so many english forums about the Tibet issues.Its just one of those Political issues that can only be decided by the generation after us. In my opinion theres no such thing as Right or Wrong, no such thing as good or bad. it all depends on how and where u look at it.

    so. Yh..

    p.s. if i wrote this much for my GCSE english coursework. i would hav got an A* for it LOL
    Offline

    1
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by chaosclazza)
    This is it. My last post on this thread. Im too tired of arguing with so many people on so many english forums about the Tibet issues.Its just one of those Political issues that can only be decided by the generation after us. In my opinion theres no such thing as Right or Wrong, no such thing as good or bad. it all depends on how and where u look at it.

    p.s. if i wrote this much for my GCSE english coursework. i would hav got an A* for it LOL
    Thank you for taking the time to share your opinion with us, one of the great things about freedom of speech is that people of all different backgrounds and opinions can come together and discuss ideas. No country has a perfect past and it is always easier to hold other nations accountable for their mistakes than it is to concentrate on our own.

    "Every man I meet is in some way my superior; and in that, I can learn from him." -Ralph Waldo Emerson, One of my favorite quotes.
    • Thread Starter
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by chaosclazza)
    I dunno and i dont care. as Long as the CCP is making China better, thn they are a GOOD government. unlike some... who always cause trouble to their fellow country men.
    Tienanmen 1989:

































    Those were Han Chinese, not Tibetans.
    Once you become a Chinese soldier, you arent human anymore.
    Something similar to this might have happened in Tibet. The world never know.
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by an Siarach)
    One of the great tragedies of history is that the mass-murdering madman Mao and his Communists defeated Chiang Kai-Shek and the Nationalists.
    Do you know why the Nationalist lost popular support over to the CCP in the first place? CCP was a lesser of the two evil. I believe there are others who hold your similar view by examining the situation of the current Taiwan. But many don't know the history behind Taiwan's revival of democracy and economy. It was under the leadership and reforms of Chiang's son.

    If the Nationalists weren't obliterated in the Mainland and what remained of the Nationalist weren't forced to reform then Chiang's son would have never reached his position of office and allowed to execute the reforms. Chiang was the very opposite to his son. He wanted full dictatorship, no different to the CCP, and relied on a corrupt military and corrupt bureaucracy - every American ambassador who went there was appalled by the situation. Chiang also resisted many reforms that the American government insisted. He was a notorious bargainer who eventually made Americans to be fed up in helping him.

    Chiang's son was more liberal due to his communist upbringing - he studied in Moscow for tertiary education. With such a background, his son's ascension to presidency, under the condition of former Nationalist China, was near to nil. Hard-line Nationalists hated communists or anyone associated with them. They viewed them with suspicion, believed these communist elements as Soviet agents. It's all evident in the discomfort with their alliance in Sun Yat Sen's day and World War Two.
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by neo232)
    Those were Han Chinese, not Tibetans.
    Once you become a Chinese soldier, you arent human anymore.
    Something similar to this might have happened in Tibet. The world never know.
    No doubt, the mean to the end of the June 4 event was terrible and repulsive. But if anyone have any good understanding of current China then you shouldn't have brought this up again. Every generation of new leaders are becoming less and less Bolshevik in mind. The recent crack down in Tibet is sufficient enough to show that the methods of those days are long gone. We must be aware that at the time China was much less sensitive to International criticism.
    • Thread Starter
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    I just want to show some guys that their government is not perfect. These pics are terrified, but history facts will never be denied or changed to the way you want.
 
 
 
Poll
Do you like exams?
Useful resources

Groups associated with this forum:

View associated groups

The Student Room, Get Revising and Marked by Teachers are trading names of The Student Room Group Ltd.

Register Number: 04666380 (England and Wales), VAT No. 806 8067 22 Registered Office: International House, Queens Road, Brighton, BN1 3XE

Write a reply...
Reply
Hide
Reputation gems: You get these gems as you gain rep from other members for making good contributions and giving helpful advice.