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does any one else think its too far taking our english heritage away from us? watch

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    (Original post by paperclip)
    Who's to decide that? I was born in England and am more English then indian.
    So what? I was born in Nigeria and I spent the vast majority of my life growing up in Africa and Japan. Doesn't stop me from being ethnically Tamil.
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    (Original post by Titanomachy)
    Link source please?

    Why should I prove that Japanese people are an ethinicity? I don't know or care if they are, in fact i'd guess they probably aren't.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Populat..._British_Isles

    And before you decry the fact that it is a Wikipedia link, please look at and explore some of the reference websites used.
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    (Original post by ypo)
    So what? I was born in Nigeria and I spent the vast majority of my life growing up in Africa and Japan. Doesn't stop me from being ethnically Tamil.
    But how is ethnicity relevant to your nationality or culture. If someone is ethnically Indian but have been brought up in England and is culturally English, then they have the same right as anyone to consider themselves English and be proud of their country.
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    omg BAN THIS SICK FILTH!
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    (Original post by imnosuperman)
    But how is ethnicity relevant to your nationality or culture. If someone is ethnically Indian but have been brought up in England and is culturally English, then they have the same right as anyone to consider themselves English and be proud of their country.
    They can have every right to be proud of their country just as, if I wanted to, I could be proud of Japan. However, claiming you are ethnically English is another matter. Showing pride in the historical achievements of the English people is yet another matter.
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    (Original post by Frodz)
    No you aren't. You are a UK citizen, you are not English. England isn't a state.
    (Original post by ypo)
    So what? I was born in Nigeria and I spent the vast majority of my life growing up in Africa and Japan. Doesn't stop me from being ethnically Tamil.
    "An ethnic group is a group of human beings whose members identify with each other, usually on a presumed or real common heritage. Ethnic identity is further marked by the recognition from others of a group's distinctiveness and the recognition of common cultural, linguistic, religious, behavioral or biological traits, real or presumed, as indicators of contrast to other groups."
    1) I identify more with english culture, religion, behaviour. Ethnicity is a social construction not biological. Unless you're thinking of nationality. My friends also consider me as English as i don't follow any indian heritage.
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    Right

    The arguments on both side of this have, in my opinion, been utterly retarded so let's wipe the slate clean and start again, mm?

    - English is a nationality. I have no problem with putting "White British" as my ethnicity because that's what I am, although I am "English before I am British" as I often say. What I do have a problem with is when I'm filling out forms (and I wish I could remember what this was for) and there's the options "Welsh", "Scottish" but not "English". It was "British". That's just stupid.

    - It is possible to be "proud to be English" without being a "Tub-thumping skinhead nationalist", although sadly there are far too many patriots who are completely ******* stupid (BNP anyone?)

    " Pride...something that causes a person or persons to be proud: His art collection was the pride of the family."
    http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/pride

    Not the best of definitions but the only one I could find to back up my point in a hurry (should probably go back to Calculus in a minute).

    I am known amoungst my friends as being proud to be English, also of being proud to be Somersetian(?). It's not that I think my county or country is better than anyone elses, it's that I feel a sense of pride in my heritage and history. I place a high amount of importance on history and tradition. Yes, even traditions with Christian roots, and I'm a borderline pagan :p:

    What I am not are these idiots who think that immigrants should go back home (I'm all for other traditions and cultures in England! It's fantastic! But not at the expense of our own, thanks), or that the World Wars were THE most important events in our entire history, or that we're automatically better than America because...well we are. I think none of these things but know so many idiot "patriots" who do yet couldn't name our ruling monarch 150 years ago, or why mistletoe is a tradition at Christmas, or who Guy Fawkes was trying to kill. And I imagine it's these utter ***** who have prompted the responses so many have given in this thread.

    Which is quite sad, really. I can understand not being proud of your country and heritage, because I've had this debate so so many times with my friend and she has pointed out many times "You can't be proud of something that you haven't contributed towards". Fair enough. My ancestors have but I can still see her point of view. But I think those who don't shouldn't be put off by the semi-Nazi BNP members who want to burn down mosques, because not all patriots are Neanderthals.
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    (Original post by ypo)
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Populat..._British_Isles

    And before you decry the fact that it is a Wikipedia link, please look at and explore some of the reference websites used.
    "The percentage of the R1b haplotype on the Y chromosomes of English males, at about 64%"

    Self-pwned.
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    (Original post by paperclip)
    "An ethnic group is a group of human beings whose members identify with each other, usually on a presumed or real common heritage. Ethnic identity is further marked by the recognition from others of a group's distinctiveness and the recognition of common cultural, linguistic, religious, behavioral or biological traits, real or presumed, as indicators of contrast to other groups."
    1) I identify more with english culture, religion, behaviour. Ethnicity is a social construction not biological. Unless you're thinking of nationality. My friends also consider me as English as i don't follow any indian heritage.
    Well done for ignoring the first line........

    :rolleyes:
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    (Original post by Forsaken)
    Right

    The arguments on both side of this have, in my opinion, been utterly retarded so let's wipe the slate clean and start again, mm?

    - English is a nationality. I have no problem with putting "White British" as my ethnicity because that's what I am, although I am "English before I am British" as I often say. What I do have a problem with is when I'm filling out forms (and I wish I could remember what this was for) and there's the options "Welsh", "Scottish" but not "English". It was "British". That's just stupid.

    - It is possible to be "proud to be English" without being a "Tub-thumping skinhead nationalist", although sadly there are far too many patriots who are completely ******* stupid (BNP anyone?)

    " Pride...something that causes a person or persons to be proud: His art collection was the pride of the family."
    http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/pride

    Not the best of definitions but the only one I could find to back up my point in a hurry (should probably go back to Calculus in a minute).

    I am known amoungst my friends as being proud to be English, also of being proud to be Somersetian(?). It's not that I think my county or country is better than anyone elses, it's that I feel a sense of pride in my heritage and history. I place a high amount of importance on history and tradition. Yes, even traditions with Christian roots, and I'm a borderline pagan :p:

    What I am not are these idiots who think that immigrants should go back home (I'm all for other traditions and cultures in England! It's fantastic! But not at the expense of our own, thanks), or that the World Wars were THE most important events in our entire history, or that we're automatically better than America because...well we are. I think none of these things but know so many idiot "patriots" who do yet couldn't name our ruling monarch 150 years ago, or why mistletoe is a tradition at Christmas, or who Guy Fawkes was trying to kill. And I imagine it's these utter ***** who have prompted the responses so many have given in this thread.

    Which is quite sad, really. I can understand not being proud of your country and heritage, because I've had this debate so so many times with my friend and she has pointed out many times "You can't be proud of something that you haven't contributed towards". Fair enough. My ancestors have but I can still see her point of view. But I think those who don't shouldn't be put off by the semi-Nazi BNP members who want to burn down mosques, because not all patriots are Neanderthals.
    Your friend sounds very clever.
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    (Original post by ypo)
    They can have every right to be proud of their country just as, if I wanted to, I could be proud of Japan. However, claiming you are ethnically English is another matter. Showing pride in the historical achievements of the English people is yet another matter.
    Really?
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    Patriotism is for stupids.

    That said, preservation of culture is a valid goal. Though not for the sake of ill-conceived pride.
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    (Original post by paperclip)
    "An ethnic group is a group of human beings whose members identify with each other, usually on a presumed or real common heritage. Ethnic identity is further marked by the recognition from others of a group's distinctiveness and the recognition of common cultural, linguistic, religious, behavioral or biological traits, real or presumed, as indicators of contrast to other groups."
    1) I identify more with english culture, religion, behaviour. Ethnicity is a social construction not biological. Unless you're thinking of nationality. My friends also consider me as English as i don't follow any indian heritage.
    Put it this way, if you and one one of your native English friends were to send away DNA samples, it would be able to identify which of you has ancestors from England and which of you has ancestors from the Indian subcontinent.

    There are several instances of white Americans that have been adopted by African-Americans or have grown up exclusively in African-American foster homes and were completely surrounded in African-American environments and cultures. Should they then tick African-American on a census?
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    (Original post by ypo)
    The responses on this thread are outrageous. You have every right to be proud of your English heritage! If a certain race that has contributed virtually nothing of worth to civilization can have a history month dedicated to them, hundreds of specialized groups and no end to government-funded programs furthering their racial pride, I see it as absolutely no problem that you have pride in your people. And this comes from a so-called ethnic.
    :toofunny:

    Black African slaves practically built America, including the very White House that the newly elected mixed-race president and his family have just moved into. For a social group to have climbed from such oppression to the very top of society is pretty impressive whichever way you look at it.
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    (Original post by ypo)
    Put it this way, if you and one one of your native English friends were to send away DNA samples, it would be able to identify which of you has ancestors from England and which of you has ancestors from the Indian subcontinent.

    There are several instances of white Americans that have been adopted by African-Americans or have grown up exclusively in African-American foster homes and were completely surrounded in African-American environments and cultures. Should they then tick African-American on a census?
    Only a 64% chance, homeboy. Thanks for that link
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    (Original post by Titanomachy)
    Your friend sounds very clever.
    *Shrug* she is, I can't argue with that point and I know it. I know that I am in some small way contributing to history and heritage as I live, but it's a teeny tiny way and no one in 100 years time will care.

    It might be totally irrational to be proud of being English (especially when I then go on to have the same debate about "gay pride" but sit on the other side of the fence...why the hell would anyone be proud to be gay??) but at least I've put some small reasoning and (hopefully) haven't come across as a "Tub thumping skin head", because that really bugged me. I'd look bloody stupid if I was bald.
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    (Original post by Titanomachy)
    Only a 64% chance, homeboy. Thanks for that link
    Of one kind of halotype..........That is not the same as the chance to know where your ancestors come from.

    But then you'd actually have to be clever to understand that..........
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    (Original post by Titanomachy)
    Really?
    I could if I so felt that way. Of course I don't! My point is, why should a Desi growing up in England feel pride in England and actually feel English when a Desi growing up in Japan is not even allowed to show the slightest bit of pride in Japanese culture?
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    People who enjoy waving flags shouldn't deserve to have one.
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    (Original post by ypo)
    I could if I so felt that way. Of course I don't! My point is, why should a Desi growing up in England feel pride in England and actually feel English when a Desi growing up in Japan is not even allowed to show the slightest bit of pride in Japanese culture?
    What I find funnier is the people claiming you shouldn't be proud of what other people/people in the past have done claim that someone of a different ethnicity can be proud to be English too.......:eyeball:
 
 
 
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