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World Cup 2014 Final: Germany vs Argentina Watch

  • View Poll Results: World Cup final: Germany vs Argentina
    Germany win in 90 mins
    70.93%
    Argentina win in 90 mins
    15.12%
    Germany win after Extra time
    11.63%
    Argentina win after Extra time
    1.16%
    Germany win on penalties
    1.16%
    Argentina win on penalties
    0
    0%

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    (Original post by Movember)
    For these guys, it's -EV. These guys are betting blindly on football matches without any clue who is going to win.
    OK, I guess I can't argue with that. It just annoyed me when you continued to tell me I was going to lose in the long run.
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    (Original post by Movember)
    ok.

    Sorry. It's tempting to bet but in the long term, it's -EV.

    Weren't you the guy who bet £20k on Germany to beat Brazil? You would have been screwed if you lost that one!
    Yes but that was accumulated profit and I traded it out before the game ended. I don't fully gamble.
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    (Original post by stefl14)
    The quality of teams in Brazil is and always has been so bad compared to teams in Europe. Their defence was and still is mediocre, which makes scoring for someone like Pele easy.

    Maradona played with a good Argentina team - not a great one but not a bad one either. Pele, on the other hand, played with a much better Brazilian team (relative to the competition) than Messi does for Argentina. Saying Garrincha was a better player than Messi makes you a ****ing idiot though so I shouldn't really be arguing with you.
    Hahahahahah you know nothing, Jon Snow. Brazil produced many of the best defenders in football history, see Nilton Santos, Bellini, Carlos Alberto Torres, Zagallo, etc etc. Maradona had a normal team, not bad, not amazing, he was a god. Pele always had help from great squads, but he was the best scorer, no doubts.

    And saying that Messi, this whinning little **** that always had the best treatments, played with the best of his time, winning millions every year, is better than Garrincha, the inventor of the beautiful game, 2 times world champion (in 62 being the MAN), and having a chronic disease in his leg (his right leg was 7 cm bigger than the left), just proves that you know NOTHING about football history. Even Cruyff, Zico and Romário were better than Messi.
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    (Original post by MichelBraga)
    Zidane was amazing, but the 98 Final was one of the weirdest matches ever, Ronaldo's seizures till today remain unexplained. Maradona was a beast, for me, the best ever. I mentioned Garrincha because in Brazil many people consider him even better than Pele, and he was the man in 58 and 62, but he destroyed his career too early. Ronaldo is great, but Romário was better, imo. All great players, all better than Messi. Maradona was the best of all, I think.
    These Barcelona teams have been superior to every team Ronaldo played in, bar Real (zidane, figo, Beckham etc). The number of chances the forwards get is ridiculous. His performances on the international level, not just goals, best Messi by far. He was electric for Brazil. Messi is only 27 so I fully expect him to beat Ronaldo in my mind soon...unless he gets injured.
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    (Original post by stefl14)
    The quality of teams in Brazil is and always has been so bad compared to teams in Europe. Their defence was and still is mediocre, which makes scoring for someone like Pele easy.
    Obviously I didn't watch football back then, and I don't think anyone will have seen any of Brazilian Serie A football from Pele's day, but Santos did beat a very, very good Benfica side in the 1962 Intercontinental Cup and they beat Milan the following year in the same competition.
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    (Original post by pane123)
    Obviously I didn't watch football back then, and I don't think anyone will have seen any of Brazilian Serie A football from Pele's day, but Santos did beat a very, very good Benfica side in the 1962 Intercontinental Cup and they beat Milan the following year in the same competition.
    Anyone can look up about Santos and Botafogo squads in the 60s and Flamengo squad in the 80s to see how impressive those teams were. They all toured across Europe, beating every team they faced. Some people think that football began in the 90s...
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    (Original post by pane123)
    Spain will require a complete transformation in their tactics but they do have great players coming through, as do France.

    France seem to have good young players in every area, whereas Germany are lacking a striker. I don't follow the Budesliga at all, so there could be young guys I'm completely unaware of.
    You reckon? I got the impression that Koke/Isco/Thiago would just slot right in and overtake Xavi/Iniesta/Alonso.
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    (Original post by silent ninja)
    These Barcelona teams have been superior to every team Ronaldo played in, bar Real (zidane, figo, Beckham etc). The number of chances the forwards get is ridiculous. His performances on the international level, not just goals, best Messi by far. He was electric for Brazil. Messi is only 27 so I fully expect him to beat Ronaldo in my mind soon...unless he gets injured.
    I agree, and Ronaldo was injured for a long time and retired quite early. Messi needs to do a lot of more than just beat Almerias and Getafes in the poor Spanish League.
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    (Original post by manchesterunited15)
    You reckon? I got the impression that Koke/Isco/Thiago would just slot right in and overtake Xavi/Iniesta/Alonso.
    Need to return to a pressing style, need to be able to play at more than one gear again. Also need to somehow assimilate Costa into their system properly.
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    (Original post by MichelBraga)
    I agree, and Ronaldo was injured for a long time and retired quite early. Messi needs to do a lot of more than just beat Almerias and Getafes in the poor Spanish League.
    :sigh: He has done more than this. He's won two Champions Leagues. Scored four against Arsenal, scored in two finals against United. Scored twenty-four in twenty-four games for Argentina. Broken every European record. You do know that most of these Spanish teams have been around for decades, yes? And only the two Ronaldos, di Stefano and Telmo Zarra have come close to Messi's scoring rate.

    You cannot, furthermore, venerate Pele when all he did outside of World Cups was score against weak sides.
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    (Original post by pane123)
    OK, I guess I can't argue with that. It just annoyed me when you continued to tell me I was going to lose in the long run.
    But for you, what makes you think you know more about the outcome of a game than the average punter in the street? Even the experts (commentators, football pundits etc.) regularly get the outcome of these things wrong. Sport is so volatile and unpredictable that you can't possibly estimate the result of enough games correctly to show a profit in the long run. I know guys in real life and online who are sports bettors and avid sports fans, who I know for a fact are net lifetime losers but they claim they profit from it.

    If you're doing arbing or matched betting, that's a different story altogether. You're exploiting a mathematical edge which has nothing to do with the outcome of any particular game.

    (Original post by Dekota-XS)
    Yes but that was accumulated profit and I traded it out before the game ended. I don't fully gamble.
    Ok fair enough.
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    (Original post by manchesterunited15)
    You reckon? I got the impression that Koke/Isco/Thiago would just slot right in and overtake Xavi/Iniesta/Alonso.
    It's more the defence I have issues with. Their midfield is top class but the current set up is so vulnerable when they lose the ball. The goalkeeping issues don't help either.
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    I should have put 400 on germany win
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    (Original post by pane123)
    It's more the defence I have issues with. Their midfield is top class but the current set up is so vulnerable when they lose the ball. The goalkeeping issues don't help either.
    De Gea will be a top keeper by 2016, they're fine there. A back 4 of Alba, Ramos, Martinez and Azpi could be pretty good.
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    (Original post by LostGear)
    I should have put 400 on germany win
    easy to say now :lol:
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    (Original post by KingMessi)
    Need to return to a pressing style, need to be able to play at more than one gear again. Also need to somehow assimilate Costa into their system properly.
    I imagine the higher energy and pressing will be easy to get back when they have younger players coming in.
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    (Original post by MichelBraga)
    Hahahahahah you know nothing, Jon Snow. Brazil produced many of the best defenders in football history, see Nilton Santos, Bellini, Carlos Alberto Torres, Zagallo, etc etc. Maradona had a normal team, not bad, not amazing, he was a god. Pele always had help from great squads, but he was the best scorer, no doubts.

    And saying that Messi, this whinning little **** that always had the best treatments, played with the best of his time, winning millions every year, is better than Garrincha, the inventor of the beautiful game, 2 times world champion (in 62 being the MAN), and having a chronic disease in his leg (his right leg was 7 cm bigger than the left), just proves that you know NOTHING about football history. Even Cruyff, Zico and Romário were better than Messi.
    You keep telling yourself that. Historically, barely anyone will see it this way.
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    (Original post by Movember)
    But for you, what makes you think you know more about the outcome of a game than the average punter in the street? Even the experts (commentators, football pundits etc.) regularly get the outcome of these things wrong. Sport is so volatile and unpredictable that you can't possibly estimate the result of enough games correctly to show a profit in the long run. I know guys in real life and online who are sports bettors and avid sports fans, who I know for a fact are net lifetime losers but they claim they profit from it.

    If you're doing arbing or matched betting, that's a different story altogether. You're exploiting a mathematical edge which has nothing to do with the outcome of any particular game
    Understanding odds and predicting winners are very different things. Read my posts in the betting threads and you will learn a lot about it.

    My win rate is 54% so I'm wrong almost half the time, but at average odds of just above evens I have a massive edge.
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    (Original post by pane123)
    It's more the defence I have issues with. Their midfield is top class but the current set up is so vulnerable when they lose the ball. The goalkeeping issues don't help either.
    Yeah I see what you mean.
    I think DDG should be there number one goalkeeper with Carvajal, Jordi Alba, Moreno and Azpilicueta playing as the full backs. There are not too many center backs that I know off as Ramos/Pique will be in their 30's by the next world cup and their u21 have Amat and Gomez but aren't experienced enough at all.
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    The Real Madrid striker Alva morata looks pretty decent too. Spain will always have a top class squad. It's just what they do with it
 
 
 
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