Your favourite historical figure who hardly anyone has heard of? Watch

Norfolkadam
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#101
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#101
(Original post by Adorno)
I am fairly sure that there are more than 5% of the population of these islands who have heard of all of the people in the list I posted.

I'm not going to get angry however I do think it's fairly sad that you don't know about the founder of methodism. I also find it fairly sad that people don't know who the first Prime Minister of this country was Robert Walpole. It's just emblematic of the decline of general knowledge that more people know the shoe size of a minor celebrity like Zac Efron than they do about the very people behind many of the singular reforms that have happened in the last four hundred years. That's what annoys me more than the general ignorance of fairly intelligent people on these forums.
Care to tell me when, during my life I was supposed to stumble upon the piece of inconsequential knowledge that is the founder of Methodism. I am well read and I know alot more about politics than alot of people in the UK but that doesn't mean I have an infinite knowledge of people, history and events. I actually know the Prime Ministers of Great Britain and the Kings and Queens of England off by heart but this isn't exactly what you'd call universal general knowledge, is it? I just don't have the time to fit in the entire history of England along side a degree and a social life.

Don't get angry because other people don't know who these people are. Just accept that you're smarter than others.
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Adorno
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#102
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#102
(Original post by iwilson03)
:eek:

what IS the shoe size of Zac Efron???

(btw I would dispute you calling him a 'minor' celebrity, I have never seen any of the films he is in but I have heard of him and I have seen his face plastered on advertising billboards in the area that I live...)
Minor in the grand scheme of things he most certainly is. Are people going to know who he is in 10 years time? 50 years time? 1000 years time? Unlikely, yet people still know of Churchill, of Cromwell, of Alfred the Great...
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Paul_r
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#103
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#103
Simon de Montford for me.

Is he to famous?
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Adorno
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#104
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#104
(Original post by Norfolkadam)
Care to tell me when, during my life I was supposed to stumble upon the piece of inconsequential knowledge that is the founder of Methodism.
Through reading? How else does one "stumble across" anything outside their immediate sphere of knowledge?
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iwilson03
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#105
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#105
(Original post by Adorno)
Minor in the grand scheme of things he most certainly is. Are people going to know who he is in 10 years time? 50 years time? 1000 years time? Unlikely, yet people still know of Churchill, of Cromwell, of Alfred the Great...
Well ok but I would say that those people are historically important figures, I wouldn't really classify them as a 'celebrity' whereas Zac Efron is - I don't think celebrity really takes into account longevity. So he is a major celebrity - but the likes of Alfred the Great are not, they are instead VIP's of History.
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iwilson03
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#106
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#106
(Original post by Norfolkadam)

Don't get angry because other people don't know who these people are. Just accept that you're smarter than others.
Knowing random stuff doesn't make that person smarter than others anyway.
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screwyouguysimgoinghome
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#107
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#107
Urgh. This thread is where the pretentious people come out in force. Ooh, look at my vast hinterland of extra curricular knowledge... go you!!

****!
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Norfolkadam
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#108
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#108
(Original post by Adorno)
Through reading? How else does one "stumble across" anything outside their immediate sphere of knowledge?
I read alot but I've never heard of him or at least I should say I don't remember having heard of him. I've actually read two fairly concise histories of Great Britain (one from 1945 onwards and one from 0AD onwards).
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Adorno
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#109
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#109
(Original post by iwilson03)
Well ok but I would say that those people are historically important figures, I wouldn't really classify them as a 'celebrity' whereas Zac Efron is - I don't think celebrity really takes into account longevity. So he is a major celebrity - but the likes of Alfred the Great are not, they are instead VIP's of History.
Alright, we'll try again: he's relatively minor even in the realms of current obsession with temporary fame for doing relatively little.
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Norfolkadam
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#110
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#110
(Original post by Adorno)
Alright, we'll try again: he's relatively minor even in the realms of current obsession with temporary fame for doing relatively little.
That's just factually incorrect. Even I've heard of Zac Efron and I didn't know Jordan and Katy Price were the same person until last week. I guarantee more people know who Zac Efron is than Nye Bevan or John Wesley.

Also here are the two responses you will get from 99% of people in the UK and USA;

(Original post by stephyrose23)
It is blaites Zac Efron. Good thing? Bad thing? I dunno.

Is William Pitt the bloke that was Prime Minister or summat?
(Original post by Dior-perfume)
considering i dont know william pitt it'll have to be zac in terms of knowingness
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iwilson03
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#111
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#111
(Original post by Adorno)
Alright, we'll try again: he's relatively minor even in the realms of current obsession with temporary fame for doing relatively little.
So you are saying that even ignoring the big important historical people such as Churchill and Aristotle, and only considering contemporary celebrities who are often elevated to their position of fame without much talent, he is still not a major celebrity?
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EnthusiasticEnthusiast
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#112
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#112
Vasily Zaytsev, a few people may know him though.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vasily_Zaytsev

Georgy Zhukov, perhaps less known.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Georgy_Zhukov

and finally Alexander Suvorov who I'm sure very few people on TSR will know.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suvorov
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Adorno
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#113
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#113
(Original post by Norfolkadam)
I read alot but I've never heard of him or at least I should say I don't remember having heard of him. I've actually read two fairly concise histories of Great Britain (one from 1945 onwards and one from 0AD onwards).
Yeah, concise histories tend to gloss over a lot of material particularly as they won't have the space to cover something like the growth of nonconformity and the importance of nonconformity to the emergence of political liberalism and the breakdown of the dominance of the old landed elites in anything other than a paragraph. That said, the influence of methodism on the politics of Britain particularly in the C19th is fundamental to an appreciation of quite why the country developed in the way it did, quite why repealling the Test and Corporation Acts in 1828 pave the way for Catholic Emancipation the year after, and ultimately the Great Reform Act. The strenght of nonconformity and the political will it threw behind the Liberal Party broke down the old privileges of Anglicanism and the Tory ascendency and enabled capitalism to take the shape it did. Nonconformists were the ones who declared: no taxation without representation in the British context.
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Adorno
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#114
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#114
(Original post by iwilson03)
So you are saying that even ignoring the big important historical people such as Churchill and Aristotle, and only considering contemporary celebrities who are often elevated to their position of fame without much talent, he is still not a major celebrity?
I'm thinking of people like Morgan Freeman or Sean Penn, for example, as being major celebrities rather than a Disney Corp minion.
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cconstant
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#115
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#115
(Original post by ajp100688)
While not my favourite historical figure, this guy would probably come under the topic of 'favourite hardly anyone has heard of'

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Isaac_Brock

Without him, theres a good chance that Canada wouldn't have existed today and if he hadn't died the North West Territory (Illinois, Wisconsin, Michigan etc) may well have been retaken by the British in 1812-15 and with it control of the Great Lakes, which would have been a real kick in the teeth for the nascent United States.
Isn't he the modest mouse lead singer?
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Adorno
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#116
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#116
(Original post by Norfolkadam)
That's just factually incorrect. Even I've heard of Zac Efron and I didn't know Jordan and Katy Price were the same person until last week. I guarantee more people know who Zac Efron is than Nye Bevan or John Wesley.
Of a certain age group. Not universally.
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Norfolkadam
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#117
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#117
(Original post by Adorno)
Of a certain age group. Not universally.
I'd argue otherwise but I can only gather statistics from this age group and it seems I was right.

http://www.thestudentroom.co.uk/show...php?p=21348845
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iwilson03
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#118
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#118
(Original post by Adorno)
I'm thinking of people like Morgan Freeman or Sean Penn, for example, as being major celebrities rather than a Disney Corp minion.
Well I must say I disagree. The very fact that he works for Disney on their films means he has a HUGE audience including adults and children (I'm thinking parents, grandparents, older siblings, aunties and uncles etc etc).
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James09
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#119
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#119
I think I'm related to this guy..



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jacques_MacDonald

Our family done some research and we're definitely related to Neil MacEachen, his father, although our family line comes from Neils other children who stayed in Scotland.

I can't quite remember the story but Neil MacEachen was one of the people who helped Bonnie Prince Charlie. He "held the gates" at Carlisle or something like that then fled to France were he had Jacques MacDonald.

MacDonald had none of that military genius that distinguished Davout, Masséna and Lannes, nor of that military science conspicuous in Marmont and St Cyr, but nevertheless his campaign in Switzerland gives him a rank far superior to such mere generals of division as Oudinot and DuPont. This capacity for independent command made Napoleon, in spite of his defeats at the Trebia and the Battle of Katzbach, trust him with large commands till the end of his career. As a man, his character cannot be spoken of too highly; no stain of cruelty or faithlessness rests on him. [1]
I like him because he seems like a fairly likeable guy, considering he came from Scotland :rolleyes:
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TheFriendlySocialist
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#120
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#120
(Original post by Adorno)
I'm thinking of people like Morgan Freeman or Sean Penn, for example, as being major celebrities rather than a Disney Corp minion.
Talent =/= celebrity. I'll bet Sean Penn is less well known in Britain than Katie Price. Put it this way, if Sean Penn divorced, it wouldn't make it on the BBC or C4 news cycles, it certainly did when that bloody tart "discovered" that the marriage she'd broadcast to the world for years was a sham.
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