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Cameron: Turkey must join the EU watch

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    (Original post by Don_Scott)
    And that is why they are against Turkey's membership in the EU, because their nations have already been flooded by Turks who are either parasites, criminals, or both at the same time.
    Which one is Mesut Ozil? :teeth:
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    Reasons he's doing it:

    (1) access to turkish markets + turks are useful military allies (huge army, good strategic location)

    (2) supporting turkish entry will help turkish secular moderates; keeping turkey out helps muslim hard-liners

    (3) for the same same reason we supported all those eastern european countries joining the EU - a good way of stopping the EU being a Franco-German love-in. if turkey joins the EU, we can forget about closer integration - i.e. it would be a eurosceptic's dream. most of the major countries would be strongly opposed to being in a close union with Turkey
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    I just remember the last time I went to Turkey a guy in a souvenir shop offered my parents money for me and my 3 year old sister to marry his sons. If it's still anything like that, then no, they shouldn't join because they still have a long way to go.
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    has anyone seen his facebook page? its good you should join.
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    (Original post by James10000)
    Iceland is going to join soon so why not Turkey ?

    its just makes turkey feel victimised and upset
    I mean everyone
    They should halt the new members process to sort themselves out!
    And why would they wanna take on Iceland after what just happened?
    Imagine Iceland was in the Euro zone when the banks went bust...the Euro would be screwed
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    Just what we need, uncontrollably open doors to 84 million more people...
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    (Original post by James10000)
    Iceland is going to join soon so why not Turkey ?

    its just makes turkey feel victimised and upset
    If they're that easily upset then it's probably best that they are kept out. Bringing in 69 million muslims is likely to exacerbate social tensions. There is already evidence of increased anti-semitism in Holland and Sweden.

    "But as in many other cities across Europe, a rapidly growing Muslim population living in segregated conditions that seem to breed alienation has mixed toxically with the anger directed at Israeli policies and actions by those Muslims — and by many non-Muslims — to all but transform the lives of local Jews. Like many of their counterparts in other European cities, the Jews of Malmo report being subjected increasingly to threats, intimidation and actual violence as stand-ins for Israel."
    http://www.haaretz.com/jewish-world/...itism-1.301276

    Also, the EU wants Turkey's military to get out of politics. But it has only been the threat of a coup by the resolutely secular army that has kept Islamic fundamentalism in check in Turkey. For all its problems, Turkey is, by Muslim standards, a successful nation-state. And that's another argument against Turkey submerging itself in the transnationalist European Union: Turkish nationalism provides a role model that should not be extinguished.

    National borders work to quarantine chaos. The lack of borders that Muslims respect as legitimate exacerbates the region's instability. The EU is designed to smother nationalist feelings. For Turks, however, the alternative to healthy nationalism would be Islamism, which is much more dangerous.
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    (Original post by jimbo139)

    (2) supporting turkish entry will help turkish secular moderates; keeping turkey out helps muslim hard-liners
    Why would you want more Muslim hardliners freely moving around Europe?
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    my point was that the moderates in turkey will do well in domestic politics if their secular pro-european policies are seen to produce tangible benefits. Whereas the religious hardliners tbenefit from the perception that europeans regard muslims as second-class human beings & discriminate against them.
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    (Original post by Chi019)
    If they're that easily upset then it's probably best that they are kept out. Bringing in 69 million muslims is likely to exacerbate social tensions. There is already evidence of increased anti-semitism in Holland and Sweden.


    http://www.haaretz.com/jewish-world/...itism-1.301276

    Also, the EU wants Turkey's military to get out of politics. But it has only been the threat of a coup by the resolutely secular army that has kept Islamic fundamentalism in check in Turkey. For all its problems, Turkey is, by Muslim standards, a successful nation-state. And that's another argument against Turkey submerging itself in the transnationalist European Union: Turkish nationalism provides a role model that should not be extinguished.

    National borders work to quarantine chaos. The lack of borders that Muslims respect as legitimate exacerbates the region's instability. The EU is designed to smother nationalist feelings. For Turks, however, the alternative to healthy nationalism would be Islamism, which is much more dangerous.
    anything reported by the Isreali media is bs

    getting easily upset ? any won would get upset if it been in the que first and 15 other countries get through

    Eastern europe is also a very dodgy place yet a few countries from there got it
    so what if turkey is Muslim ? since when was the EU as Christian Super Power ? social tensions hardly ...social tensions tend to happen when you let in working class immigration
    when was the last time you saw a Muslim Dentist stirring up trouble ?
    Its just stupid that some people are saying because turkey is muslim they cant join...there is nothing wrong with Islam or being a Practising muslim or Islamism as you call it...what I think you talking about is Islamic Terrorism which is different from being a muslim...Islamic Terrorist dont hate the west because they are muslim but its to with other things such as western occupation of other countries and most Terrorist are not Turks, but if you say Turks cannot join the EU because they are terrorist a few of them may become terrorist just for the fun of it
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    (Original post by jimbo139)
    my point was that the moderates in turkey will do well in domestic politics if their secular pro-european policies are seen to produce tangible benefits. Whereas the religious hardliners tbenefit from the perception that europeans regard muslims as second-class human beings & discriminate against them.
    Fair enough, but I don't see why Europe should have to sacrifice social cohesion to help moderates in Turkey. Also, the military do a pretty good job at present of keeping extremists in check. I understand the EU wants the military to stay out of politics.
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    (Original post by Phantom_X)
    Possibly, yes. But it can be argued that a homogenous 'British' culture has not existed for a long time. Not because of immigration, though this has diverted it further, but in fact, class disparities. It would not be foolish to suggest that th cultures of middle classes differ greatly from the working classes, and that upper class culture differs greatly from middle class culture. In terms of migrants, the only real differences lie in arbitrary things such as diet and dress.

    And yes, on the surface, it is about British identity, and it 'being lost' or a long time. But i honestly do see this as an economic bi-product. I wonder for example, how much of he working class who are the main source for Britsh pseudo-nationalism would still be interested in nationalism if they had steady jobs, income and housing for example. Would the mosque down the road really be an issue if they were living decent lives ? Had globalisation not occured, and strong levels of manufacturing still took place in Britain rather than overseas, would there still be an inherent sense for nationalism ? I remember when Britian was lobbying to get into the EU (ok i dont, my dad does though) and te tory press who are completely against it were once kissing EU butt.

    I highly doubt that the rise of nationalism is a result of an inherent desire to reform 'old britannia' imo. I still beleive it i a result of poor economic conditions and a market system that bears its brunt on working class unskilled labourers, who then identify with idealist nationalist groups who actually beleive that protectionism is the key to economic power.
    yeah agree and then this leads them to "nationalism" for a sense of identity/belonging.
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    (Original post by James10000)
    anything reported by the Isreali media is bs

    ...
    so what if turkey is Muslim ? since when was the EU as Christian Super Power ? social tensions hardly ...social tensions tend to happen when you let in working class immigration
    when was the last time you saw a Muslim Dentist stirring up trouble ?
    Its just stupid that some people are saying because turkey is muslim they cant join...there is nothing wrong with Islam or being a Practising muslim or Islamism as you call it...what I think you talking about is Islamic Terrorism which is different from being a muslim...Islamic Terrorist dont hate the west because they are muslim but its to with other things such as western occupation of other countries and most Terrorist are not Turks, but if you say Turks cannot join the EU because they are terrorist a few of them may become terrorist just for the fun of it
    All the more reason for them not to join, I don't see why Europe particularly needs a greater number of Muslims per se. It will just bring greater social tension.

    It was not the kind of message a Harvard seminar expects to hear. Ethnic diversity causes a lot of problems, our guest speaker told us. It reduces interpersonal trust, civic engagement, and charitable giving. It causes us to disengage from society, like turtles shrinking into their shells, reducing our overall quality of life. The more diversity we experience in our lives, the less happy we are.
    http://www.american.com/archive/2009...-the-smart-way

    Also, you refer to dentists, but what proportion of Turkey's population are unskilled? It makes as much sense as admitting Mexico to the United States. Turkey's per capita GDP is $6,700 compared to Mexico's $9,000.
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    He's absolutely right.
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    (Original post by Phantom_X)
    Reasons why I love this move by Cameron for once

    1. Turkey is a lucrative market, ideal for diplomatic purposes and prevents them becoming close to iran

    2. Turkey has hot girls

    3. undoubtedly this has pissed off the right wing of the tory faction= epic lulz

    4. At least one story a week from the mail/express going "Oh noeeez, Muslims!!!" and this will eradicate tory support, and cameron butt kissing

    5. Goes against tory values of euroscepticism. Ie. bye bye true toryism.
    Your fifth point is incorrect. It is well in keeping with the tried and tested method of continually expanding the EU to prevent political integration. Can you imagine Germany and France pushing for a superstate if Turkey were involved?
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    (Original post by Chi019)
    All the more reason for them not to join, I don't see why Europe particularly needs a greater number of Muslims per se. It will just bring greater social tension.



    http://www.american.com/archive/2009...-the-smart-way

    Also, you refer to dentists, but what proportion of Turkey's population are unskilled? It makes as much sense as admitting Mexico to the United States. Turkey's per capita GDP is $6,700 compared to Mexico's $9,000.

    no it wont thats biggoted , im all for not allowing free movement of labour for 15 years but no because Turks are muslim, its that kind of racism that drives anyone insane

    Mexico is in NAFTA , no ones talking about admitting turkey into the UK

    yes you can debate the economic arguments of Turkish membership...but islam is not a valid reason to not let them in
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    (Original post by Apagg)
    Your fifth point is incorrect. It is well in keeping with the tried and tested method of continually expanding the EU to prevent political integration. Can you imagine Germany and France pushing for a superstate if Turkey were involved?

    once Turkey Gets in , Germany and France will no longer be running the Show which is a great Bonus , no more regulating British Chocolate
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    what about Cyprus
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    (Original post by James10000)
    no it wont thats biggoted , im all for not allowing free movement of labour for 15 years but no because Turks are muslim, its that kind of racism that drives anyone insane

    Mexico is in NAFTA , no ones talking about admitting turkey into the UK

    yes you can debate the economic arguments of Turkish membership...but islam is not a valid reason to not let them in
    No more than the Dalai Lama not wanting Tibet to be overrun by Han Chinese. Europeans don't owe some special duty to Turkey. They should resist being demographically displaced by Muslims.
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    France, Austria and Germany need to stop being absolute *******s and genuinely give Turkey the opportunity to prove themselves. Cameron is right, Turkey should be joining the European Union and when they have met the accession criteria, they should be members and the European Union should help them do that; If Britain helps them more, we can attempt to develop stronger relations with them.
 
 
 
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