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# Nick Cleggs Maths = FAIL ! Watch

1. (Original post by jb9191)
He basically has said someone who graduates and gets a salary of £21000

will pay back just £7 per month

After 30 years the debt gets wiped.

If a degree costs £9000 per year tuition x 3 = £27,000 debt for 3 year course

Plus maintenance - lets say £5000 per year so x 3 = £15,000

Then £5,000 extra through overdrafts etc.

Total debt = £47,000.

----------------------------------

In 30 years there are obvious 360 months. (30 x 12 = 360)

360 x £7 per month he says = £2520 paid back of £47,000

----------------------------------

Therefore, he is a blatant liar or he struggles with maths.

That would leave the taxpayer at a £44,500 deficit.

The fact is someone who is on £21,000 per year would pay back £157.50 per month (9% of their income). This is £150 more per month than the figures hes putting forward.

----------------------------------

Yes I know many graduates will get promotions and earn more and pay back more. However, a lot will not get jobs which will leave a burden on the taxpayer who in the end will be the rest of the graduates.

He is 100% trying to pull a fast one and its not working. Welsh students now have success and will not have fee's increased, I hope our fellow English students have the same outcome.

Do you know how sickening it will be to go to university and for me to pay £3290 because I'm Welsh yet someone who is English has to pay £6000-9000 for the same degree. I think that is extremely unfair.

It will cause national tension and division of the classes.
It's 9% of your income OVER £21000

2. (Original post by Babycakes Barbie)
very good point! loll i think you should send that to Nick Clegg himself loll maybe even become his maths tutor loll but u have a very true point!
How since the maths is fine?
3. (Original post by ish90an)
Do you have trouble with the concept of averages? "Some universities "MAY BE" able..." is not the same as "on average, every university will be able to charge more and increase funding"(even though universities will have to provide loans etc for any such increase itself, thus not really increasing its own teaching budget, the money will keep running in the loans cycle). Do you also look at "it may be sunny in parts of Northern Scotland" as "it is definitely sunny all across the country"?
Its obvious that it will cause a knock on effect.

If Cambridge put their fee's straight up, then Oxford, UCL, Warwick, St Andrews etc will do the same in order not to fall behind. Then the next group will do the same to stop the gap behind the first group becoming wider. Eventually the majority of universities will increase fees in order to maintain their prestigious look.

This increased cap is going to increase competition for places so therefore the universities will want to look good.

If a university such as Aberystwyth was charging £9,000 for a Computer Science degree for English students

and

Swansea was charging £5,000 for a Computer Science degree, which would you pick?

I'd pick the university that was asking for money to be honest as the chances of a better education will go right up as they are getting more funding.

Therefore the majority of universities will do this. The only ones that wont are the extremely crap ones who will in the end, more than likely have to close down.
4. (Original post by radiated yoghurt)
It's 9% of your income OVER £21000

You do realise this has already been sorted.

Read the thread before making a comment - its only 4 pages

5. (Original post by jb9191)
Its obvious that it will cause a knock on effect.

If Cambridge put their fee's straight up, then Oxford, UCL, Warwick, St Andrews etc will do the same in order not to fall behind. Then the next group will do the same to stop the gap behind the first group becoming wider. Eventually the majority of universities will increase fees in order to maintain their prestigious look.

This increased cap is going to increase competition for places so therefore the universities will want to look good.

If a university such as Aberystwyth was charging £9,000 for a Computer Science degree for English students

and

Swansea was charging £5,000 for a Computer Science degree, which would you pick?

I'd pick the university that was asking for money to be honest as the chances of a better education will go right up as they are getting more funding.

Therefore the majority of universities will do this. The only ones that wont are the extremely crap ones who will in the end, more than likely have to close down.
I assume, therefore, you always shop in Waitrose and not Tesco? Why would anyone want to shop in Tesco?!? It's obviously worse, it costs less. Education's important, but food literally sustains your life.
6. (Original post by jb9191)
You do realise this has already been sorted.

Read the thread before making a comment - its only 4 pages

You missed a full stop in your post.

7. maths nerd alert.
8. (Original post by jb9191)
Its obvious that it will cause a knock on effect.

If Cambridge put their fee's straight up, then Oxford, UCL, Warwick, St Andrews etc will do the same in order not to fall behind. Then the next group will do the same to stop the gap behind the first group becoming wider. Eventually the majority of universities will increase fees in order to maintain their prestigious look.

This increased cap is going to increase competition for places so therefore the universities will want to look good.

If a university such as Aberystwyth was charging £9,000 for a Computer Science degree for English students

and

Swansea was charging £5,000 for a Computer Science degree, which would you pick?

I'd pick the university that was asking for money to be honest as the chances of a better education will go right up as they are getting more funding.

Therefore the majority of universities will do this. The only ones that wont are the extremely crap ones who will in the end, more than likely have to close down.
This is why BA are doing so well as opposed to budget airlines, because they charge more and thus have the obvious better service. Also why everyone has private healthcare and the NHS are struggling for numbers and why everyone in the US goes to Harvard and community colleges are missing out on all this top talent.
The majority of universities will only be able to do this if they can guarantee they can provide the loans and bursaries necessary to fund the increase. Given not every university gets the same in endowments and grants, this will not happen.
9. (Original post by ish90an)
This is why BA are doing so well as opposed to budget airlines, because they charge more and thus have the obvious better service. Also why everyone has private healthcare and the NHS are struggling for numbers and why everyone in the US goes to Harvard and community colleges are missing out on all this top talent.
The majority of universities will only be able to do this if they can guarantee they can provide the loans and bursaries necessary to fund the increase. Given not every university gets the same in endowments and grants, this will not happen.
Food is food regardless,
A flight will get you to the same place

Standards of education can vary thus why prices are important.

Hence why Cambridge will charge more than Oxford Brookes.

Please stop replying to my posts as well as you come with no sensible answer, instead look at faults and try and twist things.

The key issue is if a university is at a certain place in the league table then it will be able to increase its tuition fees by a certain amount.

Oxford & Cambridge will probably be able to go right to the top £12,000.

If Aber is higher than an English University of the same level it will still be able to charge the same fee's, therefore most students will opt for Aber. Its quite a common concept to grasp.
10. I'd like to point out that it's fairly obvious that Nick Clegg didn't come up with these figures. There's almost certainly someone who came up with it for him.
11. (Original post by jb9191)
Food is food regardless,
A flight will get you to the same place

Standards of education can vary thus why prices are important.

Hence why Cambridge will charge more than Oxford Brookes.

Please stop replying to my posts as well as you come with no sensible answer, instead look at faults and try and twist things.

The key issue is if a university is at a certain place in the league table then it will be able to increase its tuition fees by a certain amount.

Oxford & Cambridge will probably be able to go right to the top £12,000.

If Aber is higher than an English University of the same level it will still be able to charge the same fee's, therefore most students will opt for Aber. Its quite a common concept to grasp.
So you take back this ridiculous notion of yours that somehow when Oxford etc will charge 12k it will let other universities as well? Good.
12. (Original post by 69Crazyfists)
I'd like to point out that it's fairly obvious that Nick Clegg didn't come up with these figures. There's almost certainly someone who came up with it for him.
Is that why they are right? because hes rubbish at maths and so needed someone else to do the figures?
13. (Original post by Quady)
Is that why they are right? because hes rubbish at maths and so needed someone else to do the figures?
Come again?
14. (Original post by 69Crazyfists)
Come again?
Well you said that Nick didn't work this out.

Since the maths is all fine and correct are you saying that if Nick did it himself it would be clear that he can't count?
15. This is what makes me angry about Nick Clegg it proves that he is a liar and he lied to get into power, he lied to all those people who could vote. At the time of the election I was not old enough to vote but at the time as I have always wanted to go to university I would of voted for the liberal democrats. This article is another reason that those who are going to graduate from university with a job paying more or the stated amount of £21,000 are going to be able to pay their debt off, however this is what I do not understand by the time those students going to university at the start of the academic year 2011/2012 by the time they graduate Britain will be either be out of the recession or coming towards coming out of the recession. However we are going to be paying for this recession for the next 10 to 15 years or even longer. What I do not understand is that if the current goverment is cutting welfare and benefits then what are these students who graduate from university but can't find a job which relates to their degree then what are they going to rely on to pay of their debt?
16. (Original post by ish90an)
So you take back this ridiculous notion of yours that somehow when Oxford etc will charge 12k it will let other universities as well? Good.
No.

Oxford will charge £12,000 as well as Cambridge, maybe some others.

Other universities will be able to charge up to £9000, only those with government jurisdiction can go up to £12,000.

There is nothing stopping a University way down the table putting fees up to £9000 in order to increase funding in turn to increase reputation - as funding allows you to employ better lecturers, build better learning facilities and so on.

Just you wait and see how many universities sky rocket the cost of tuition fee's. Maybe then you'll wake up.

Once the top universities increase prices the rest will follow in order for a standards gap not to open, its happened before.
17. (Original post by Quady)
Well you said that Nick didn't work this out.

Since the maths is all fine and correct are you saying that if Nick did it himself it would be clear that he can't count?
No I'm just saying as a general point because the thread is called 'Nick Clegg's maths fail', he's a busy man - chances are it's not his maths. I'm not saying Clegg is good or bad at maths just making an observation.

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