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Food "poverty" is caused by stupidity, not poverty Watch

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    (Original post by Laomedeia)
    and you sound as equilibrated as an intransigent bottle of alcoholic trinitrotoluene. You tell me where I can buy freshly cooked steak and chips for 30p! Your nuttier than squirrel feces if you really believe you can get a decent meal for 30p.
    That's not exactly the point though is it? People on benefits shouldn't have enough money to go around eating freshly cooked steak and chips...
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    (Original post by im so academic)
    There's something else that's not right and I bet she's hiding something. Can't even afford 76p for bread and jam. What the ****?
    So all the evidence is against you but you're absolutely convinced that its all her own fault and deserved our contempt?

    Try looking up prejudice in a dictionary
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    (Original post by im so academic)
    That ***** only has herself to blame.



    Yes it is acceptable. How dare she give up her job.
    I just don't understand the intense contempt from people like you towards people like her.. What good does it do society? Seriously there are worse crimes...
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    (Original post by thisistheend)
    It's all her own fault that she was poor and starving. I personally would have laughed if the b*tch had to bend down on her knees and suck c*ck for a fiver with tears streaming down her face to pay for food while the baby watched on due to her own stupidity.
    And now you are advocating that the child is sexually abused.
    Exposure to adult sexual activity, particularly when the activity is not exactly consensual (like one partner crying?), constitutes sexual abuse of children and is regarded as such by psychologists and social services alike.
    http://www.csun.edu/~psy453/expose_y.htm

    Please, go one step further and show your parents your posts.

    EDIT: have you considered getting yourself pre-emptively put on the "banned from working from children" list? If you are banned from working from children, you could save yourself the prison sentence that will inevitably result if you end up working with them in any capacity. Just a thought.
    (Original post by im so academic)
    There's something else that's not right and I bet she's hiding something. Can't even afford 76p for bread and jam. What the ****?
    Money does not appear from thin air, just because it's a seemingly small amount.

    Many people suffer from the same delusion that small amounts of money are of no concern and can simply be produced infinitely. They get into great trouble with their student loans...

    If you only look at the pounds, the pennies just run away, and you have no idea why you have no money left.
    (Original post by im so academic)
    This.

    Doesn't she have any friends that can look after the child?
    ...

    Of course she doesn't. If you asked this in a parenting forum, you'd be banned as a troll if you didn't tell them you were 17, because they wouldn't believe that anyone could be that ignorant. There are two issues here. One is that of reasonable requests, and the other is of legislation that has tightened up this area.

    Before I go on, do you happen to know the name Madeline McCann, or do you not generally notice the world around you? Three year old. Left alone while the parents went out, never been seen since?

    To preface this, how would you react if someone asked you to pay their electricity bill for them, because you're their friend? No? What about if they asked for you to drive them ten miles to and from work every day, and didn't pay for petrol once? I mean, that's just an hour a day, and four pounds a day, or something? (Someone else may have more exact figures for the petrol, here.)

    "Childminding" is a service where someone looks after your child within their own home while you go to work. It costs money.

    Anyone capable of looking after children knows that looking after a child during the day is worth between three and four pounds an hour, and they will not do that every single day for free. Assuming a rate of £3.50, shifts of 8 hours (they would most likely be longer, because she would have to deliver the child to the house in time to get to work, and she wouldn't get to the child-minder's house the very second she finished work, either, due to journey time), and a working week of 5 days, the mythical friend is doing £140 of work each week for free.

    Overnight childminding is rather more expensive, if you can find it, and accordingly vanishingly more likely to be provided by a friend for free.

    Next problem. If you can find a friend to be this generous, you need fixed shifts. I understand that this was a problem for the poor woman, whose life we're picking over. Can you imagine a friend who would reschedule her or his life for you on the fly, in response to your work arrangements, for free? I'll tell you this for nothing. Childminders who are paid won't accept it, because it mucks up their arrangements with their own family, their numbers (there's laws about how many children can be simultaneously supervised), and their arrangements with other clients.

    "Hi, I'm sorry, I'm on morning shift this week. Do you mind re-arranging everything? Just to be nice?"

    You are likely now going to suggest that the woman pays her friend less than the market rate, I expect. No-go. Some people would have friends who might agree to this arrangement, but it is now illegal to accept money for childminding, if you are not a registered childminder. Becoming a registered child-minder means rather more than signing a piece of paper.

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...s-toddler.html

    http://www.hounslow.gov.uk/index/hea...ildminding.htm
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    (Original post by Octopus_Garden)
    And now you are advocating that the child is sexually abused.
    Exposure to adult sexual activity, particularly when the activity is not exactly consensual (like one partner crying?), constitutes sexual abuse of children and is regarded as such by psychologists and social services alike.
    http://www.csun.edu/~psy453/expose_y.htm

    Please, go one step further and show your parents your posts.

    EDIT: have you considered getting yourself pre-emptively put on the "banned from working from children" list? If you are banned from working from children, you could save yourself the prison sentence that will inevitably result if you end up working with them in any capacity. Just a thought.
    Money does not appear from thin air, just because it's a seemingly small amount.

    Many people suffer from the same delusion that small amounts of money are of no concern and can simply be produced infinitely. They get into great trouble with their student loans...

    If you only look at the pounds, the pennies just run away, and you have no idea why you have no money left.
    ...

    Of course she doesn't. If you asked this in a parenting forum, you've be banned as a troll if you didn't tell them you were 17, because they wouldn't believe that anyone could be that ignorant. There are two issues here. One is that of reasonable requests, and the other is of legislation that has tightened up this area.

    Before I go on, do you happen to know the name Madeline McCann, or do you not generally notice the world around you? Three year old. Left alone while the parents went out, never been seen since?

    To preface this, how would you react if someone asked you to pay their electricity bill for them, because you're their friend? No? What about if they asked for you to drive them ten miles to and from work every day, and didn't pay for petrol once? I mean, that's just an hour a day, and four pounds a day, or something? (Someone else may have more exact figures for the petrol, here.)

    "Childminding" is a service where someone looks after your child within their own home while you go to work costs money.

    Anyone capable of looking after children knows that looking after a child during the day is worth between three and four pounds an hour, and they will not do that every single day for free. Assuming a rate of £3.50, shifts of 8 hours (they would most likely be longer, because she would have to deliver the child to the house in time to get to work, and she wouldn't get to the child-minder's house the very second she finished work, either, due to journey time), and a working week of 5 days, the mythical friend is doing £140 of work each week for free.

    Overnight childminding is rather more expensive, if you can find it, and accordingly vanishingly more likely to be provided by a friend for free.

    Next problem. If you can find a friend to be this generous, you need fixed shifts. I understand that this was a problem for the poor woman, whose life we're picking over. Can you imagine a friend who would reschedule her or his life for you on the fly, in response to your work arrangements, for free? I'll tell you this for nothing. Childminders who are paid won't accept it, because it mucks up their arrangements with their own family, their numbers (there's laws about how many children can be simultaneously supervised), and their arrangements with other clients.

    "Hi, I'm sorry, I'm on morning shift this week. Do you mind re-arranging everything? Just to be nice?"

    You are likely now going to suggest that the woman pays her friend less than the market rate, I expect. No-go. Some people would have friends who might agree to this arrangement, but it is now illegal to accept money for childminding, if you are not a registered childminder. Becoming a registered child-minder means rather more than signing a piece of paper.

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...s-toddler.html

    http://www.hounslow.gov.uk/index/hea...ildminding.htm
    You my friend have a fantastic habit of saying exactly what I cant be bothered to say

    To be honest, these two clowns are clearly in some way deficient in compassion/morally/experience/common sense/maturity. It's probably best we leave them to their prejudice and move on
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    (Original post by felixb)
    You my friend have a fantastic habit of saying exactly what I cant be bothered to say

    To be honest, these two clowns are clearly in some way deficient in compassion/morally/experience/common sense/maturity. It's probably best we leave them to their prejudice and move on
    I'm somewhat inclined to agree. You can't reason someone out of a position they didn't think themselves into.

    They do neatly illustrate why the child-minding industry is so regulated now. It's to stop people who have no idea what they're doing setting up child-care businesses!

    I feel a hell of a lot more accepting of the fees now.
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    (Original post by Octopus_Garden)
    I'm somewhat inclined to agree. You can't reason someone out of a position they didn't think themselves into.

    They do neatly illustrate why the child-minding industry is so regulated now. It's to stop people who have no idea what they're doing setting up child-care businesses!

    I feel a hell of a lot more accepting of the fees now.
    I just don't understand what the need was to start an entire thread purely to spout their own irrational hatred. I just don't get it!

    But I agree entirely, the remark earlier regarding prostitution as a viable course of action I guess demonstrates that there really are people in the world that you don't want anywhere near children - or dependents of any kind - and I'm not talking about "poor people"...
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      (Original post by Octopus_Garden)
      Money does not appear from thin air, just because it's a seemingly small amount.

      Many people suffer from the same delusion that small amounts of money are of no concern and can simply be produced infinitely. They get into great trouble with their student loans...

      If you only look at the pounds, the pennies just run away, and you have no idea why you have no money left.
      Then the ***** should stop complaining that she can't afford to give her child bread/jam (which makes her look pathetic), or do something about it.

      Where does the child benefit go?

      Of course she doesn't. If you asked this in a parenting forum, you'd be banned as a troll if you didn't tell them you were 17, because they wouldn't believe that anyone could be that ignorant. There are two issues here. One is that of reasonable requests, and the other is of legislation that has tightened up this area.

      Before I go on, do you happen to know the name Madeline McCann, or do you not generally notice the world around you? Three year old. Left alone while the parents went out, never been seen since?
      They left their child alone. I'm talking about leaving the child with a friend, did you not read my post?

      To preface this, how would you react if someone asked you to pay their electricity bill for them, because you're their friend? No? What about if they asked for you to drive them ten miles to and from work every day, and didn't pay for petrol once? I mean, that's just an hour a day, and four pounds a day, or something? (Someone else may have more exact figures for the petrol, here.)
      That's different as you're asking for money. All you're doing is asking a favour - from a friend.

      "Childminding" is a service where someone looks after your child within their own home while you go to work. It costs money.
      NO, she leaves the child in someone else's house that she trusts. Simple concept.

      Anyone capable of looking after children knows that looking after a child during the day is worth between three and four pounds an hour, and they will not do that every single day for free. Assuming a rate of £3.50, shifts of 8 hours (they would most likely be longer, because she would have to deliver the child to the house in time to get to work, and she wouldn't get to the child-minder's house the very second she finished work, either, due to journey time), and a working week of 5 days, the mythical friend is doing £140 of work each week for free.
      Yes, it's called being a friend. Or alternatively, she can look after her friend's kids whilst she is not working. You know, a reciprocated favour?

      Overnight childminding is rather more expensive, if you can find it, and accordingly vanishingly more likely to be provided by a friend for free.

      Next problem. If you can find a friend to be this generous, you need fixed shifts. I understand that this was a problem for the poor woman, whose life we're picking over. Can you imagine a friend who would reschedule her or his life for you on the fly, in response to your work arrangements, for free? I'll tell you this for nothing. Childminders who are paid won't accept it, because it mucks up their arrangements with their own family, their numbers (there's laws about how many children can be simultaneously supervised), and their arrangements with other clients.
      She may have to leave the child with different friends depending on the shift.

      Seriously, you're making excuses for this woman. ***** should've kept her job and paid childcare costs. She is irresponsible. Oh and where's the father who is meant to PAY for his own child?

      She's a despicable woman, she's contributing to the poverty problem, I have no sympathy for her at all.
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      There is some truth to the OP; the rationality of people in general often gets in the way of how they should act. There's a great book on this topic, called ''Poor Economics'' which looks at the rationality of the poor. For example, residents of Indian shanty towns do go underfed, but prefer to buy more spices/better tasting food, rather than more food to feed themselves with, due to cultural obligations to make nice food, etc..
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      (Original post by im so academic)
      Then the ***** should stop complaining that she can't afford to give her child bread/jam (which makes her look pathetic), or do something about it.

      Where does the child benefit go?
      Food, clothing, electricity, water bill. Child benefit is £20.30

      They left their child alone. I'm talking about leaving the child with a friend, did you not read my post?
      You evidently didn't read the one you posted "This" in response to! S/he advocated leaving the child alone!

      That's different as you're asking for money. All you're doing is asking a favour - from a friend.
      Most people know what their time is worth. Anyone capable of looking after a child will.
      NO, she leaves the child in someone else's house that she trusts. Simple concept.

      Yes, it's called being a friend. Or alternatively, she can look after her friend's kids whilst she is not working. You know, a reciprocated favour?
      Really, you'd work eight hours a day five days a week, out of "friendship"? You don't really come across here as a charitable person. More surprisingly than that, are you apparently anticipating to be unemployed and capable of fitting your life around someone else's work hours?


      Or did you not think of the idea that maybe all her friends might be at work, even if they were willing to work unpaid so someone else could have a job?

      Secondly, did you not read the link I gave you: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...s-toddler.html

      No financial reward took place. It was purely favour-for-a-favour. OFSTED were still not happy about it, and termed it "illegal child-minding".


      I suggest you make a thread on mumsnet. People will explain to you exactly what is thought of people expecting free childcare. The language used may astound you!

      She may have to leave the child with different friends depending on the shift.
      Oh, you admit it's going to need more than one, now? This is still going to need fixed shifts, which has been a problem for her, as detailed in the article.

      Seriously, you're making excuses for this woman. ***** should've kept her job and paid childcare costs. She is irresponsible. Oh and where's the father who is meant to PAY for his own child?
      The father should be contributing, I'll agree on that. However I am not making excuses. I am explaining reality to you.
      She's a despicable woman, she's contributing to the poverty problem, I have no sympathy for her at all.
      At least she's not contributing to the emotionally neglected child problem, or the intellectually undeveloped child problem. Y'know?

      If you're concerned about the "poverty problem" have you considered increasing benefits then? Seeing as you're so concerned?
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      (Original post by Octopus_Garden)
      Food, clothing, electricity, water bill. Child benefit is £20.30

      You evidently didn't read the one you posted "This" in response to! S/he advocated leaving the child alone!

      Most people know what their time is worth. Anyone capable of looking after a child will.
      Really, you'd work eight hours a day five days a week, out of "friendship"? You don't really come across here as a charitable person. More surprisingly than that, are you apparently anticipating to be unemployed and capable of fitting your life around someone else's work hours?


      Or did you not think of the idea that maybe all her friends might be at work, even if they were willing to work unpaid so someone else could have a job?

      Secondly, did you not read the link I gave you: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...s-toddler.html

      No financial reward took place. It was purely favour-for-a-favour. OFSTED were still not happy about it, and termed it "illegal child-minding".


      I suggest you make a thread on mumsnet. People will explain to you exactly what is thought of people expecting free childcare. The language used may astound you!

      Oh, you admit it's going to need more than one, now? This is still going to need fixed shifts, which has been a problem for her, as detailed in the article.

      The father should be contributing, I'll agree on that. However I am not making excuses. I am explaining reality to you.
      At least she's not contributing to the emotionally neglected child problem, or the intellectually undeveloped child problem. Y'know?

      If you're concerned about the "poverty problem" have you considered increasing benefits then? Seeing as you're so concerned?
      Not having any of it this im so academic! I don't know what kind of adults they surround themselves with who would happily drop everything to look after someone else's kids at any moment...
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      (Original post by im so academic)
      Then the ***** should stop complaining that she can't afford to give her child bread/jam (which makes her look pathetic), or do something about it.

      Where does the child benefit go?



      They left their child alone. I'm talking about leaving the child with a friend, did you not read my post?



      That's different as you're asking for money. All you're doing is asking a favour - from a friend.



      NO, she leaves the child in someone else's house that she trusts. Simple concept.



      Yes, it's called being a friend. Or alternatively, she can look after her friend's kids whilst she is not working. You know, a reciprocated favour?



      She may have to leave the child with different friends depending on the shift.

      Seriously, you're making excuses for this woman. ***** should've kept her job and paid childcare costs. She is irresponsible. Oh and where's the father who is meant to PAY for his own child?

      She's a despicable woman, she's contributing to the poverty problem, I have no sympathy for her at all.
      She's not asking for sympathy. She was out of work and started a blog for something to do. She even ended up making some money out of it. She clearly sees the value in earning money. Just relax seriously.

      I could just as easily say you're contributing to the ignorance problem but it's really none of my business!
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      (Original post by Aspiringlawstudent)
      Not nearly by enough.
      Oh really not by enough? My family gets so little in benefits on top of my sisters work wages that I have to use my own student finance (which is supposed to be supporting ME with food and rent through uni ) just so that my family can eat.
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      (Original post by SophieSmall)
      Oh really not by enough? My family gets so little in benefits on top of my sisters work wages that I have to use my own student finance (which is supposed to be supporting ME with food and rent through uni ) just so that my family can eat.
      Oh I don't know, maybe your sister could try living elsewhere so the rest of your family can get more benefit.

      This is assuming neither your mother or your father works. Why isn't even one of them working? And listen, yeah it's ****ty you're having to give up your money for drinking and going out for uni. But I'm sure your family can find some other avenue to feed themselves. Afterall, the point of this thread, was that food, if you try hard enough, can be dirt cheap.
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      (Original post by thisistheend)
      Oh I don't know, maybe your sister could try living elsewhere so the rest of your family can get more benefit.

      This is assuming neither your mother or your father works. Why isn't even one of them working? And listen, yeah it's ****ty you're having to give up your beer money for uni. But I'm sure your family can find some other avenue to feed themselves. Afterall, the point of this thread, was that food, if you try hard enough, can be dirt cheap.
      My sister doesn't earn enough wages to move out, my father is absent and my mother can't work as she is disabled. And nope I don't even drink so get over yourself. True food when you shop properly and effectively can be cheap, but it still costs some money.
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      (Original post by Octopus_Garden)
      I'm somewhat inclined to agree. You can't reason someone out of a position they didn't think themselves into.

      They do neatly illustrate why the child-minding industry is so regulated now. It's to stop people who have no idea what they're doing setting up child-care businesses!

      I feel a hell of a lot more accepting of the fees now.
      (Original post by felixb)
      I just don't understand what the need was to start an entire thread purely to spout their own irrational hatred. I just don't get it!

      But I agree entirely, the remark earlier regarding prostitution as a viable course of action I guess demonstrates that there really are people in the world that you don't want anywhere near children - or dependents of any kind - and I'm not talking about "poor people"...
      Having a friend looking after your children isn't a business while you pop out. **** OFSTED and the govt for being so petty and encouraging people to grass on each other other. Seriously, this is pretty Stalinist / Maoist. I ignore government nannying, I know best, not some laminated leaflet commissioned by a jobsworth.

      And yeah, childcare as a business should be obviously you know, better and more proper. But there's just as a good way rather than regulating it. See, people say childcare is expensive, then the new regs only push up the cost. Even pre reg, it was already expensive and demand was high. I'm willing to bet ya that some parents would consider it a rational choice to forgo higher regulation for a cheaper price to save money. Race to the bottom? Hardly, people who want better with the means to pay for will do, as they always have done. People without the means to pay much, can afford at least something, rather than nothing. Scandals waiting to happen? Not important if people know and don't expect very much.

      The McCanns are a bad example, because A) They didn't lock their doors / windows properly B) They probably had something to do with it. I have never believed the mother, the look of her and the way she acted.

      ----------

      Plenty of hard up women time immortal has taken a crack at the world's oldest profession to feed themselves. If they have no other desirable skills, they have that. And it's not like they don't get paid well for it. Be thankful. Most men can't even have this as a viable option, unless they're a rent boy on the receiving end. It's a lot harder (or not) if you're not actually gay, if you'll pardon the pun.

      I'm just saying. When you hit rock bottom, you'll do anything. It becomes the best choice for you, and the most rational. Have you ever watched the C4 show "Run" earlier this summer by any chance? These people who complain of food poverty won't starve to death on their free sofa, they'll find something, or they will starve to death.

      ------------

      I started this thread because I read about the woman's story and felt very strongly about it.
     
     
     
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