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Can Corbyn win the 2020 election? watch

  • View Poll Results: Can Jeremy Corbyn win the 2020 election?
    Yes
    554
    50.00%
    No
    554
    50.00%

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    (Original post by billydisco)
    If people have a problem with their job, quit. If the employer is being unreasonable then every employee they hired would quit and they would be forced to make the changes, yes?
    So you want these people to become the non-taxpaying benefit claimants you moan about? Also quitting so someone else takes the job is less inconvenient to the employer than picketing.
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    (Original post by billydisco)
    Some of us are grown-ups....

    So who would be paying for your degree then?
    Except you show immaturity by making that comment.

    It would be the Government, not that I agree with the policy the money could be better spent.
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    (Original post by billydisco)
    Earlier you said we wouldn't get attacked because of nuclear weapons:

    You are aware the nuclear devices are kept on submarines nowhere near the mainland?

    How can the NHS defend us?

    See, even in this bit you are wrong.

    We have a free education system, so what is the excuse of poor people for not achieving?
    trident is stored in a loch near a Scottish navy base so not at sea

    i never said the nhs could defend us

    poorer people tend to achieve less in education as they cant afford the same supplies/equipment as wealthier student (extra revision books etc.) also working class parents tend to have less time to help with homework etc. due to having to work difficult hours and middle class families can afford extra tuition, or field visits which poorer families cannot, also wealthier parents have more time to invest in their childrens education (parents evenings etc.) and often use the same language codes as teachers, meaning they communicate with teachers better and this can help their children more and have more ability to get their children into the better schools (lower class kids may not be able to afford the travel to the better school which is half an hour away, while richer families can)- while yes education is free, the more money you have the more you are able to invest in your education (not saying poorer kids always do worse, i come from a working class family myself, however there are trends that show this)
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    (Original post by billydisco)
    1) Workers have the right to refuse to work? Nope- scrap it. If you don't like the job, quit!

    2) Under the previous Labour Government (Corbyn's lot) people who didnt work and had more and more kids would receive more money. Its still the case now, albeit less money.

    3) If you say so.

    4) The only people who benefit from it are those who hardly contribute to it. I do not believe in the American system, but our higher and additional higher tax rates are pure extortion when you include NIC too.
    1) not everybody can afford the luxury of quitting a job just because they dont like it - jobs are hard to come by, this should not be an excuse for having to face poor working conditions, low pay and unsociable hours, everybody should have the right to stand up for themselves and for most working people the only way they can do this is through strikes (also remember workers are penalised for striking they dont just do it for fun)

    2) previous labour govt is totally different to "corbyns lot" do ya damn research first please, also that is again not true


    4) that isnt true everybody benefits from it. our tax rates are not even that high compared to other countries (also not those with higher taxes also have a higher standard of living), our tax rates are not extortionate at all
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    (Original post by United1892)
    Except you show immaturity by making that comment.

    It would be the Government, not that I agree with the policy the money could be better spent.
    You realise "the Government" doesn't pay money, they're called taxpayers.

    So taxpayers should fund your degree? Not you?
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    (Original post by billydisco)
    You realise "the Government" doesn't pay money, they're called taxpayers.

    So taxpayers should fund your degree? Not you?
    The taxpayers fund the Government, the Government then sets out a budget which funds everything. So I was right.

    I believe education should be subsidised by the Government because it is helpful to our economy. I wouldn't go so far as funding degrees if you would kindly read my post carefully.
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    (Original post by citydeer)
    poorer people tend to achieve less in education as they cant afford the same supplies/equipment as wealthier student (extra revision books etc.)
    Total *******s

    (Original post by citydeer)
    also working class parents tend to have less time to help with homework etc. due to having to work difficult hours
    Middle class parents don't sit down with their kids like you think they do...... you're idealising wealth away from reality.

    Secondly its not because working class parents work difficult hours, its because they care less about education and more about TV.

    (Original post by citydeer)
    and middle class families can afford extra tuition, or field visits which poorer families cannot, also wealthier parents have more time to invest in their childrens education (parents evenings etc.)
    The **can** but they don't.... except for the 11+ and if they're child is REALLY struggling. Then the tutors come in.

    (Original post by citydeer)
    and often use the same language codes as teachers, meaning they communicate with teachers better and this can help their children more
    You really are stretching....

    (Original post by citydeer)
    and have more ability to get their children into the better schools (lower class kids may not be able to afford the travel to the better school which is half an hour away, while richer families can)- while yes education is free, the more money you have the more you are able to invest in your education (not saying poorer kids always do worse, i come from a working class family myself, however there are trends that show this)
    Better schools? Shouldn't have closed the Grammars then.

    You want to know the truth? The lower class (there is no such thing as "working class" as everybody works nowadays- oh except Labour voters) are too preoccupied with who they are currently shagging, or TV, than supporting their children and providing a stable environment for them to learn.
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    (Original post by billydisco)
    Total *******s


    Middle class parents don't sit down with their kids like you think they do...... you're idealising wealth away from reality.

    Secondly its not because working class parents work difficult hours, its because they care less about education and more about TV.


    The **can** but they don't.... except for the 11+ and if they're child is REALLY struggling. Then the tutors come in.


    You really are stretching....


    Better schools? Shouldn't have closed the Grammars then.

    You want to know the truth? The lower class (there is no such thing as "working class" as everybody works nowadays- oh except Labour voters) are too preoccupied with who they are currently shagging, or TV, than supporting their children and providing a stable environment for them to learn.
    these are all things studied by sociologists so you cant just call it bull because it actually has evidence to back it up
    honestly reducing this to b*tchy personal attacks doesnt really make your arguments look politically credible
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    (Original post by citydeer)
    1) not everybody can afford the luxury of quitting a job just because they dont like it - jobs are hard to come by, this should not be an excuse for having to face poor working conditions, low pay and unsociable hours, everybody should have the right to stand up for themselves and for most working people the only way they can do this is through strikes (also remember workers are penalised for striking they dont just do it for fun)

    2) previous labour govt is totally different to "corbyns lot" do ya damn research first please, also that is again not true


    4) that isnt true everybody benefits from it. our tax rates are not even that high compared to other countries (also not those with higher taxes also have a higher standard of living), our tax rates are not extortionate at all
    1) Those who deserve another job, find another job.

    2) Considering he is even more left-wing, he would be even worse!

    4) I don't care about other countries. 40% higher rate, plus 9% for NIC means I only keep 50p on every £1 I earn over £36k. Thats a complete disgrace. The Government keeps the same amount as I get to take home, over £36k. Disgusting.

    When it comes to additional higher rate taxpayers the Government takes 54% of each £1 over £150,000. So the Government takes more than you get to take home! Oh and this is ignoring the fact we pay tax on nearly every other single thing! So I get taxed at source, then I buy petrol, taxed again, buy alcohol, taxed again, buy a TV- taxed at 20%. Might as well get rid of these taxes and make income tax what it really is, more like 65%!
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    (Original post by citydeer)
    these are all things studied by sociologists so you cant just call it bull because it actually has evidence to back it up
    honestly reducing this to b*tchy personal attacks doesnt really make your arguments look politically credible
    I don't need to be a sociologist to look around me:

    Do police spend more time dealing with domestics in middle, or lower class areas?

    Do people with ASBOs typically originate from middle, or lower class areas?

    Do those in jail typically come from middle, or lower class areas?

    Are smokers more likely to be lower, or middle class?

    Starting to get the picture? I'm not saying middle class parents cant help their kids, i'm saying its not on the scale you lot are making-out. All these imaginary tutor stories, its just crazy.

    Poor children fail because their backgrounds are dreary, depressing and their parents are typically less-bothered about their education. Its not because their parents are soooooo hard-working they are working all hours. They watch TV and care more about that than their kids' education.
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    (Original post by billydisco)
    I don't need to be a sociologist to look around me:

    Do police spend more time dealing with domestics in middle, or lower class areas?

    Do people with ASBOs typically originate from middle, or lower class areas?

    Do those in jail typically come from middle, or lower class areas?

    Are smokers more likely to be lower, or middle class?

    Starting to get the picture?
    dont forget that police often police lower class areas more, meaning the likelyhood of lower class criminals being caught is higher
    also upper class people often have more resources available to avoid prosecution (not to mention how the upper class often have a blind eye turned to their crimes - how many MP's and celebrities have had their crimes as sex offenders ignored?)
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    To be honest, I have to admit during the time of the campaign I really really did not want Corbyn to win - I believed he was unelectable and wouldn't make a good leader.

    But after his victory and reading his biography (forgive me I haven't read his policies) - I just saw what a great leader he could be. All the marches and protests he gets involved in, shows how much he cares about issues.

    At the moment, Britain is so divided due to fear and austerity due to the help of Tories, Farage and the Media - I fully believe Corbyn could help this country back on its feet in unity. He will definitely be a better leader than Ed - even Cameron is all worried so he decides to tweet the negativity to attempt to morph people's mind.

    I just hope people do not get sucked into the propaganda and vote with their own minds
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    Potentially he could, however I don't think he can try the Ed Miliband approach of trying to look good by not rising to the "Red-ed" spin the right wing press was using...which is amusing as Ed is pink compared to Corbyn. He'll need a strong media campaign and will have to take the fight to the Tories very strongly.

    Still though the likes of the DM with "Commie Corbyn" (DM if you use this title pay meh royalties!) will end up being very damaging I think as many readers will ironically be automatically against this idea of letting a "Commie" win...when they're lower class and would probably benefit, lol.

    I'll say the Tories won't get a majority but will get more than Labour, so it depends if Labour can do say an SNP/Lib dem/Green coalition or something which allows them in.....which would likely be pretty horrific.
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    Yes it's possible. A lot can happen in a few years.

    1. He will be fantastic in Debates - Cameron will suffer there.
    2. He will be brave enough to suggest things us "common" people will start to think "yes, why not?"
    3. He will be principled enough to show up all the others' expenses fiddles, lack of commitment to the role of MP. and I am talking about all parties. The spongers and self-interested ones will no longer be welcome in public office.
    4. His environmental ethics will win over many.
    5. His presence at public events will win over many more.

    It's old-style, but it doesn't mean that's wrong, and the people might just be ready for it.
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    (Original post by billydisco)
    Total *******s


    Middle class parents don't sit down with their kids like you think they do...... you're idealising wealth away from reality.

    Secondly its not because working class parents work difficult hours, its because they care less about education and more about TV.


    The **can** but they don't.... except for the 11+ and if they're child is REALLY struggling. Then the tutors come in.


    You really are stretching....


    Better schools? Shouldn't have closed the Grammars then.

    You want to know the truth? The lower class (there is no such thing as "working class" as everybody works nowadays- oh except Labour voters) are too preoccupied with who they are currently shagging, or TV, than supporting their children and providing a stable environment for them to learn.
    Poorer people do do worse than their rich counterparts, you can't deny that.

    -

    Middle class parents often have the knowledge to help their children with homework if they need it. Which is an advantage.

    That's a huge generalisation. My parents aren't glued to the TV in any sense, but they would never be able to help me with my work, because they simply don't have the knowledge to, and wouldn't be able to if they tried.

    Huge amount of people I know who were privately educated also had tutors, or attended private tuition. So you can't say they don't. Even if what I'm saying is anecdotal, it shows you can't just dismiss it like that.

    Absolute load of trash that last part. Those are chavs on benefits who don't give a ****, a small minority. There are also those who just can't help, because they don't know how.

    I don't know what the original argument was but what you've said isn't true or fair.
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    The poll is tied. Interesting.
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    (Original post by Birkenhead)
    I hope he does. Wouldn't mind erasing my SFE debts.
    One of the only potential positives.
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    I don't think he can win the election at all. Single biggest concern for the electorate in the last election was the economy, and Jeremy Corbyn's economic policy includes printing loads of money to buy back utility companies, it's a shambles. His policy on immigration is hugely unpopular when general consensus is strongly opposed. In fact, his foreign policy in general seems pretty unpopular with the general public. And to top it off, financial forecasts have Britain operating at a surplus by 2020; right in time for the election the tories will have hard proof that their economic policy of austerity has worked. I don't see Corbyn having a cat in hell's chance.

    In fact, I'd go so far as to say his election could prove quite bad for democracy in Britain. We're already seeing the start of infighting in labour, I think it was seven resignations from the cabinet? This could easily end up like the Michael Foot era, where the infighting between the hard left and more moderate left leads to a succession of victories for the tories. I think it would take a cataclysmic disaster economically for the tories to lose the election, and there seems no real chance of such an issue - all the forecasts suggest the British economy will be as healthy as its been for a very long time come the next election.
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    Yes
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    He'll be in his 70s when the general election is called. I'm pretty sure that is going to be relevant to a lot of voters.
 
 
 
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