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Leaving Islam/ telling my family I'm athiest? watch

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    (Original post by Plantagenet Crown)
    They are glaring to anyone with the simplest grasp of logic. The fact you have not been able to logically and consistently consolidate them shows this.
    So you find it difficult to understand that whilst non-muslims are able to work towards this life, they won't have any share in the hereafter?
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    (Original post by emily Z)
    So you find it difficult to understand that whilst non-muslims are able to work towards this life, but won't have any share in the hereafter?
    I don't find that difficult to understand. It's a claim made, but one with no evidence in its favour whatsoever, nor is there the slightest shred of evidence proving there's some sort of retributive afterlife where you're rewarded or punished for your actions on Earth. That notion is at best primitive, and at worst, vindictive and psychotic.
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    (Original post by Plantagenet Crown)
    Again, incorrect. Yes, because the evidence says so, what other reason would there be for accepting a theory as true if not for that?

    You are the one that's hypnotised, as well as making false statements about what's in the Qur'an.
    Lol this is jokes
    The statement I made about the Quran is true.
    Like I said there is no evidence
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    (Original post by Plantagenet Crown)
    I don't find that difficult to understand. It's a claim made, but one with no evidence in its favour whatsoever, nor is there the slightest shred of evidence proving there's some sort of retributive afterlife where you're rewarded or punished for your actions on Earth. That notion is at best primitive, and at worst, vindictive and psychotic.
    Ok so there is no contradiction?

    Everything you have said is in your own opinion, no proof to back it up.
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    (Original post by ssdizzy12)
    Lol this is jokes
    The statement I made about the Quran is true.
    Like I said there is no evidence
    No it isn't and you're right, there's no evidence for the Big Bang in the Qur'an.
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    (Original post by Plantagenet Crown)
    No it isn't and you're right, there's no evidence for the Big Bang in the Qur'an.
    yes yes okay whatever you say you're unbeatable
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    (Original post by emily Z)
    Ok so there is no contradiction?
    There is. You make a sweeping generalisation about non-muslims working towards this life, (you'll have to explain in detail what you actually mean by this as it's rather vague).

    You then say that muslims work towards the hereafter. In the context of the discussion your insinuation was clear in that those non-muslims blessed with riches and fortune are having their "reward" now. Yet there are also muslims who are rich and fortunate, thereby also being blessed in the dunya, which goes against your assertion that their reward is in heaven.

    I'm sure you'll try to get round this by saying that muslims can be rewarded in both the dunya and akhirah, but this then causes your argument to crumble as well as revealing that this so-called test is fundamentally flawed and unjust.
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    (Original post by emily Z)
    Everything you have said is in your own opinion, no proof to back it up.
    On the contrary, everything I have said is backed up by logic whereas you have provided no concrete proof for any of your assertions and merely saying something is true because it's found in ancient scripture.
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    (Original post by Plantagenet Crown)
    You then say that muslims work towards the hereafter. In the context of the discussion your insinuation was clear in that those non-muslims blessed with riches and fortune are having their "reward" now. Yet there are also muslims who are rich and fortunate, thereby also being blessed in the dunya, which goes against your assertion that their reward is in heaven.
    In essence this life is a test, and Allah tells us in the Qur'an that he will test us with wealth, hunger etc.Not everyone has the same test, one person may be tested by having a lot of wealth another person may be tested with a lack of wealth.
    (Original post by Plantagenet Crown)
    I'm sure you'll try to get round this by saying that muslims can be rewarded in both the dunya and akhirah, but this then causes your argument to crumble as well as revealing that this so-called test is fundamentally flawed and unjust.
    Not really sure about what you are asserting here, Allah is the most just, what you perceive as just is entirely in your perspective, you have a finite mind, how will you understand true justice, Allah has the most perfect justice, and actions will be met in full in the hereafter.
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    (Original post by Plantagenet Crown)
    On the contrary, everything I have said is backed up by logic whereas you have provided no concrete proof for any of your assertions and merely saying something is true because it's found in ancient scripture.
    Lol 'logic'
    Who's logic, your logic? my logic? That is completely subjective.
    All your arguments are based around emotion
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    (Original post by emily Z)
    In essence this life is a test, and Allah tells us in the Qur'an that he will test us with wealth, hunger etc.Not everyone has the same test, one person may be tested by having a lot of wealth another person may be tested with a lack of wealth.
    Which reveals how unfair and flawed the test really is. In an exam hall all students take the same exam, not different ones.

    Not really sure about what you are asserting here, Allah is the most just, what you perceive as just is entirely in your perspective, you have a finite mind, how will you understand true justice, Allah has the most perfect justice, and actions will be met in full in the hereafter.
    This is nothing more than "Allah knows best" which is a reply used when you can't logically explain away the contradictions or more difficult aspects of dogma.

    Moreover, there is no evidence for this "hereafter" or would you like to provide some?
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    (Original post by emily Z)
    Lol 'logic'
    Who's logic, your logic? my logic? That is completely subjective.
    All your arguments are based around emotion
    False, I have noted that your arguments are based on shaky and inconsistent logic. Which of my arguments have been based on emotion?
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    (Original post by ssdizzy12)
    blah blah evidence this evidence that there is NO evidence, people like you are soooo deeply hypnotised and brain washed by lies and stupid theories from scientist and theorises.You can't sit down for a second and ask yourself if all this evidence crap is really true. How are you so 100% sure that it's true? Because someone said so? Because someone said there's evidence. LWAL go ahead, bum lick your brain washers and believe there bs irrefutable evidence crap and I'll believe mine
    I'm not the type to get into arguments with people concerning religion, but come on just think logically about what you're saying. Stupid theories, like what for example? Evolution? All evolution is a change in allele frequency in a population and you can go in a lab and test it for yourself, and literally observe it happening in front of you. The problem with you is that you've brainwashed from a young age to believe a very particular set of beliefs, and anything outside that is something that is going to lead you astray or lead you to hell. You cannot do any open and logical thinking because you've been brainwashed from such a young age. You're asking him about being 100% sure when you absolutely ZERO empirical evidence of a God existing. I mean c'mon, try and think for yourself for once.
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    (Original post by Plantagenet Crown)
    Which reveals how unfair and flawed the test really is. In an exam hall all students take the same exam, not different ones.
    Are all people the same? People have different capabilities, mental capacities, different physical attributes. How is it fair if we everyone gets the same test? Surely then some people will be at an advantage over others?
    Each test is suited exactly, perfectly to each individuals capabilities .

    (Original post by Plantagenet Crown)
    Which reveals how unfair and flawed the test really is. In an exam hall all students take the same exam, not different ones.This is nothing more than "Allah knows best" which is a reply used when you can't logically explain away the contradictions or more difficult aspects of dogma.Moreover, there is no evidence for this "hereafter" or would you like to provide some?
    I find it extremely alarming that you never understood what i said.
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    (Original post by Plantagenet Crown)
    False, I have noted that your arguments are based on shaky and inconsistent logic. Which of my arguments have been based on emotion?
    The fact that you seem to think something is not just, clearly distresses you.
    You formed an opinion based upon this emotion, through what you like to call logic.
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    (Original post by emily Z)
    Are all people the same? People have different capabilities, mental capacities, different physical attributes. How is it fair if we everyone gets the same test? Surely then some people will be at an advantage over others?
    Each test is suited exactly, perfectly to each individuals capabilities .
    Are all students in an exam hall the same? No. Do they all get the same exam? Yes, which makes it completely fair.

    The fact people have different tests is what is unjust, as some people's tests will undoubtedly be easier than others'. The whole concept of the test is nonsense anyway, it is simply too flawed to be the actual method by which an all-knowing God would rule by.

    I find it extremely alarming that you never understood what i said.
    I understood what you said, it simply didn't make logical sense.
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    (Original post by emily Z)
    The fact that you seem to think something is not just, clearly distresses you.
    You formed an opinion based upon this emotion, through what you like to call logic.
    False, yet again. I was merely highlighting that it is unjust, this is a fact. How can it distress me when I neither believe life is a test nor that Allah exists?

    Your arguments are entirely lacking in logic and have still failed to explain the contradictions concerning people being rewarded while alive despite rejecting Allah.
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    Just reassure them that you're still their daughter, you still love them and you still need them. They probably worry that in not being Muslim they will lose you so make sure they know that's not true, but also remember you've done nothing wrong and never deserve criticism.
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    (Original post by Plantagenet Crown)
    Are all students in an exam hall the same? No. Do they all get the same exam? Yes, which makes it completely fair.

    The fact people have different tests is what is unjust, as some people's tests will undoubtedly be easier than others'. The whole concept of the test is nonsense anyway, it is simply too flawed to be the actual method by which an all-knowing God would rule by.
    Are not exams in this life done to see our capabilities?
    Allah knows out capabilities, the test is to see if a person will choose right from wrong.

    (Original post by Plantagenet Crown)
    I understood what you said, it simply didn't make logical sense.
    I know you never, based upon your reply.
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    (Original post by Plantagenet Crown)
    False, yet again. I was merely highlighting that it is unjust, this is a fact. How can it distress me when I neither believe life is a test nor that Allah exists?

    Your arguments are entirely lacking in logic and have still failed to explain the contradictions concerning people being rewarded while alive despite rejecting Allah.
    'highlighting it was unjust'
    Again you don't seem to want to tell me, according to whom?
    Please read the definition of subjective. I don't think you know what it means and yes it applies to logic too.
 
 
 
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