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    (Original post by That Bearded Man)
    It is outrageous that BoE notes are accepted across UK but England won't recognise NI notes

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    Not at all true. The only legal tender in Scotland and Northern Ireland is coins, and I believe it's the same for the Crown Dependencies. Most places will accept non BoE notes though.

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    (Original post by Saracen's Fez)
    You'd be amazed how many Spanish school groups you see on Shrewsbury High Street - visiting what I really have no idea.
    I was trying to give a random example. I've never been to Shrewsbury, so that clearly backfired.
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    (Original post by Jammy Duel)
    Not at all true. The only legal tender in Scotland and Northern Ireland is coins, and I believe it's the same for the Crown Dependencies. Most places will accept non BoE notes though.

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    That's just incorrect mate, I know, I live there.

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    (Original post by Jammy Duel)
    Not at all true. The only legal tender in Scotland and Northern Ireland is coins, and I believe it's the same for the Crown Dependencies. Most places will accept non BoE notes though.

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    NI recognises BOE and Scottish notes, never seen a Welsh one but I believe I do remember an Isle of (Man?) Note being accepted.

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    (Original post by That Bearded Man)
    NI recognises BOE and Scottish notes, never seen a Welsh one but I believe I do remember an Isle of (Man?) Note being accepted.

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    Whilst they may recognise them as a legal currency, doesn't mean it's legal tender.

    For example, Scottish bank notes are not legal tender anywhere, not even Scotland.
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    (Original post by That Bearded Man)
    NI recognises BOE and Scottish notes, never seen a Welsh one but I believe I do remember an Isle of (Man?) Note being accepted.

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    There are no Welsh notes, and accepting money and it being legal tender are not the same thing, legal tender means that you are legally obliged to accept it to settle a debt, that does not mean that it is the only thing you can pay with, for example, cards and cheques are not legal tender, yet people still pay/paid with them, and in exactly the same way that there is nothing currently that legally stops people from being able to pay in Euros if the retailer agrees to do so. The fundamental distinction here needs to be made between legal tender and acceptance of payment.
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    Nay, for the obvious reasons
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    (Original post by Jammy Duel)
    There are no Welsh notes, and accepting money and it being legal tender are not the same thing, legal tender means that you are legally obliged to accept it to settle a debt, that does not mean that it is the only thing you can pay with, for example, cards and cheques are not legal tender, yet people still pay/paid with them, and in exactly the same way that there is nothing currently that legally stops people from being able to pay in Euros if the retailer agrees to do so. The fundamental distinction here needs to be made between legal tender and acceptance of payment.
    Ah fair point
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    (Original post by Jammy Duel)
    There are no Welsh notes, and accepting money and it being legal tender are not the same thing, legal tender means that you are legally obliged to accept it to settle a debt, that does not mean that it is the only thing you can pay with, for example, cards and cheques are not legal tender, yet people still pay/paid with them, and in exactly the same way that there is nothing currently that legally stops people from being able to pay in Euros if the retailer agrees to do so. The fundamental distinction here needs to be made between legal tender and acceptance of payment.
    With an emphasis on the fact that just because something is legal tender does not mean it must be accepted as payment for goods or services, which are mutually-agreed exchanges. This is evident in businesses not wishing to accept £50 notes, for example, or machines not accepting low-denomination coins.
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    Pretty sure English banknotes aren't currently 'legal tender' in the UK, though it's practically unheard of for them not to be accepted.
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    (Original post by TheDefiniteArticle)
    Pretty sure English banknotes aren't currently 'legal tender' in the UK, though it's practically unheard of for them not to be accepted.
    They are in England and Wales

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    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lITBGjNEp08
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    Nay.
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    (Original post by TheDefiniteArticle)
    I accept that full-blown socialism cannot work on less than a global stage because the necessity of at least moderate levels of planning in its economies for the initial couple of centuries mean a single socialist state cannot be competitive internationally.I will, however, note that most of the previous instances of socialist economies are irrelevant to the question of whether one can work, as a) the world is too different (basically, history over about 30 years ago is irrelevant to assessment of modern conditions); and b) many of the flaws can be put down to individual humans' fallibility.
    Let's get back to this. You say that the world is too different now compared to 30 years ago, why is this only relevant to socialism? Surely it is also working against capitalism, especially since popular opinion seems to be swinging towards socialism, at least for now. It is also true that 30 years ago was very different to 60-70 years ago and very different to 100 years ago. What has to be remembered is that when socialism prospered it was under the same conditions that Capitalism prospered. When did the Soviet Union prosper the most? Shortly after formation when reforming its economy and industrialising, funnily enough, the Western economies had the same thing happen when they industrialised; during war years when production went into overdrive, again, funnily enough it happened to other economies too as they went into overdrive, at least relative to what would happen if they were merely bombed to hell; and in the post war years, when there were cities to rebuild and massive technological advancement. The thing is, after the golden age of capitalism it was able to ride its momentum whilst the soviet model could not. The US could manage to maintain high military spending, and still does, whilst the USSR collapsed under the pressure.As for human fallibility, again, this is not unique to any single system or size.
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    (Original post by Jammy Duel)
    Let's get back to this. You say that the world is too different now compared to 30 years ago, why is this only relevant to socialism? Surely it is also working against capitalism, especially since popular opinion seems to be swinging towards socialism, at least for now. It is also true that 30 years ago was very different to 60-70 years ago and very different to 100 years ago. What has to be remembered is that when socialism prospered it was under the same conditions that Capitalism prospered. When did the Soviet Union prosper the most? Shortly after formation when reforming its economy and industrialising, funnily enough, the Western economies had the same thing happen when they industrialised; during war years when production went into overdrive, again, funnily enough it happened to other economies too as they went into overdrive, at least relative to what would happen if they were merely bombed to hell; and in the post war years, when there were cities to rebuild and massive technological advancement. The thing is, after the golden age of capitalism it was able to ride its momentum whilst the soviet model could not. The US could manage to maintain high military spending, and still does, whilst the USSR collapsed under the pressure.As for human fallibility, again, this is not unique to any single system or size.
    My point is merely that we cannot possibly draw conclusions about the validity of political systems from history.
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    (Original post by TheDefiniteArticle)
    My point is merely that we cannot possibly draw conclusions about the validity of political systems from history.
    How about we count the number of heavily socialist states, especially amongst the most successful in the world, can we give a figure greater then 0?
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    (Original post by Jammy Duel)
    How about we count the number of heavily socialist states, especially amongst the most successful in the world, can we give a figure greater then 0?
    Great, let's count the number of men in space Pre-1960 oh wait... There weren't any so that must mean it was impossible to get a man into space...

    When you use a capitalist measure to determine the effectiveness of a socalists state it will clearly do poorly. Neutral measures such as child mortality and social mobility shoudl be used.
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    (Original post by Jammy Duel)
    popular opinion seems to be swinging towards socialism, at least for now.
    Which popular opinion evidence is this silly claim based on? Not the evidence of the recent general election, obviously, which saw popular opinion swing away from the left.
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    (Original post by Aph)
    Great, let's count the number of men in space Pre-1960 oh wait... There weren't any so that must mean it was impossible to get a man into space...

    When you use a capitalist measure to determine the effectiveness of a socalists state it will clearly do poorly. Neutral measures such as child mortality and social mobility shoudl be used.
    Which still favour capitalism...

    So, socialism has been established and then it remains for minor elements of a predominately capitalist world. It even had an opportunity to establish itself globally and look what happened. It's getting another chance, and look what's happening, it's not going too well.
 
 
 
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