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    Why are Shia Muslims hated by so many Sunni Muslims?
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    (Original post by Napp)
    Indeed buttheres a huge golf between ideals and reality ...
    I was aiming at situations like the sectarian violence in iraq etc.
    Sectarian minded people and merchants of death from both sides use the differences and even widen the divide to cater to their agendas and this has caused so much strife, pain and death which keeps on feeding more cycles of death and revenge (even against those who did nothing to you).
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    Why do Shia`s flagellate themselves ?
    Shia`s paying visits to shrines,is that allowe under Islam ?
    Is it true Shia`s can group prayers together?
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    Tawheed

    thanks for your replies on my other thread.
    My question is to you can you explain to me in a simple way please:
    A) do men and women pray the same way?
    B) what namaz is now compulsory for me as a Shia? Is it Nafals or suntan, because i often have to shorten my prayers
    Ordinarily I believe this:
    Fajr 2 suntan and 2 farz (compulsory)
    Zohr 4 farz (c)+ 4 suntan + 2 suntan + 2 nafil [c)
    Asr 4 farz (c) + 4 suntan
    Maghrib 3 farz (c) + 2 suntan + 2 nafal (c]
    Isha. 4 farz (c), 4 suntan, 3 Witr (c), 2 nafal, 2 nafal, 2 suntan (c)

    Also brother, I have done these steps, which I found out we're common differences between Sunni and Shia
    -adding Ali r.a name to shahada
    - repeating phrase everyday is kerbala and believing it
    - keeping arms to side when praying
    - not saying Salam at end of prayer when used to turn head left and right
    -combining prayers
    -resting head on stone during sajda
    Is there anything else I can do?
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    (Original post by Kadak)
    Why do Shia`s flagellate themselves ?
    Shia`s paying visits to shrines,is that allowe under Islam ?
    Is it true Shia`s can group prayers together?
    These questions have/are being addressed, please have a quick look through the thread brother.
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    Discussion is getting fragmented over 3 separate threads and may cause confusion.
    I suggest consolidating it into just one thread.
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    (Original post by Al-farhan)
    Discussion is getting fragmented over 3 separate threads and may cause confusion.
    I suggest consolidating it into just one thread.
    Agreed. I suggest this thread Akhi - i've been trying to quote people on this thread and replying questions on other threads on this one.
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    (Original post by shazy2014)
    Tawheed
    thanks for your replies on my other thread.
    Salamunalaykum dear brother, no problem, guidance is ultimately from Allah azwj! Am i correct in understanding that you have reverted to shia -Islam ? If so, Alhamdullilah brother, for embarking on the path of Muhammed and ale Muhammed asws. I will be here to help you in any way, shape or form, that is halal, and answer absolutely any questions you have. You may also PM me/ send me messages. Do you know how ?

    But Alhamdullilah! I am so pleased to hear you have joined the school of Muhammed wa ale Muhammed asws, and have chosen to hold onto the two weighty things Muhammed s.a.w left behind, the Quran, and His Ahlulbayt!

    My question is to you can you explain to me in a simple way please:
    A) do men and women pray the same way?
    The Salah is essentially the same, with differences in positions of the limbs through the salah. Could i kindly ask if you are a brother or a sister? I'm assuming you're a brother for some reason.

    B) what namaz is now compulsory for me as a Shia? Is it Nafals or suntan, because i often have to shorten my prayers
    Ordinarily I believe this:
    Fajr 2 suntan and 2 farz (compulsory)
    Zohr 4 farz (c)+ 4 suntan + 2 suntan + 2 nafil [c)
    Asr 4 farz (c) + 4 suntan
    Maghrib 3 farz (c) + 2 suntan + 2 nafal (c]
    Isha. 4 farz (c), 4 suntan, 3 Witr (c), 2 nafal, 2 nafal, 2 suntan (c)
    The only compulsory salah on you is fajr, zuhr, asr, maghrib and ishah. In terms of shortening your salah, here are the verdicts of ayatullah sistani (ha) who i follow:
    http://www.sistani.org/english/book/48/2250/

    Nafilah Salah/Salat Al Layl (the night payer) are mustahab.


    Also brother, I have done these steps, which I found out we're common differences between Sunni and Shia
    -adding Ali r.a name to shahada
    Acknowledging that Ali ibn Abi Talib a.s is the wali, the successor of Muhammed s.a.w, not as a prophet, but as an imam, one who thus, acted to preserve the Sunnah of Muhammed s.a.w makes one a shia. Are you saying you believe in it ? Do you also believe in the Imams a.s after Ali ibn Abi Talib a.s, up to the Mahdi a.s, i.e the twelve Imams a.s?

    - repeating phrase everyday is kerbala and believing it
    You don't have to do that. You see, Kerbala was a time when the Grandson of Muhammed s.a.w, Hussain a.s, was brutally slaughtered in Kerbala, with much of his family and children. Hussain a.s is one of the leaders of the youths of paradise, and they brutally massacared the family of Muhammed s.a.w. Kerbala sparked the movement which led to the end of Yazid, the Tyrant, who if left uninhibited and had Hussain a.s given bayah to such a tyrant, would have gone to no ends to destroy Islam.

    You don't have to repeat 'every day is kerbala'. But, recognising the sacrifice of the grandson of Rasulullah s.a.w, the position of the ahlulbayt a.s, and feeling sadness at their utter masacare are clearly good things to reflect upon and understand.

    - keeping arms to side when praying
    Yes, this is necessary. You know, many Maliki's also pray with their arms to the sides. Imam Malik lived in Medina at the same time as Imam Jaffer as Sadiq a.s, the sixth imam , the great grandson of Hussain a.s. Imam Malik also taught to pray with the arms by the sides as something permissible. Interestingly, the people who would have been best placed to understand he practical sunnah of Muhammed s.a.w, and those least influenced by external factors are those who lived in Medina. And thus, it is of no surprise both Imam Malik, and Imam Jaffer as sadiq a.s (sixth shia imam) prayed with their arms by their sides.

    Here's Sheikh Hamzah Yusuf - a sunni maliki sheikh- discussing this:



    - not saying Salam at end of prayer when used to turn head left and right
    I know many shia's that, after the three takhbirs and the three salawats to end the prayer, give salams to each side. However, i don't do this personally, but my shia-in-laws (who were sunni's) do it. I'll check this out, but it's not really done by most shia's.

    -combining prayers
    We shia's believe Muhammed s.a.w enabled the combination of prayer, even when there was no reason or excuse, fort the ease of the Ummah. Therefore, you have a choice to combine your prayers. You can also seperate them, and i personally often seperate my salah, but when in congregation i often combine them.


    -resting head on stone during sajda
    Do you mean Turbah ?(earth?), if so yes you can prostrate on that, or stone, or grass or other things which are permissible.

    According to Ayatullah Sistani: http://www.sistani.org/english/book/48/2224/

    "1085. Sajdah should be performed on earth, and on those things which arenot edible nor worn, and on things which grow from earth (e.g. wood and leaves of trees). It is not permissible to perform Sajdah on things which are used as food or dress (e.g. wheat, barley and cotton etc.), oron things which are not considered to be parts of the earth (e.g. gold, silver, etc.). And in the situation of helplessness, asphalt and tar will have preference over other non-allowable things."

    Have a look at the rulings in terms of what you can prostrate on:
    http://www.sistani.org/english/book/48/2224/



    Is there anything else I can do?
    There are also differences in how Salah is Performed, this is a good video:
    https://youtu.be/qAPD6JoAiE0

    Here is also another video of how to perform the salah according to Muhammed wa ale Muhammed asws:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qSvkAL1vJ4E

    Here's are video's on how to pray:
    Maghrib: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ovQ8R8kEFJQ
    Isha: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7B7T4EnQyT4

    Here is an online e-booklet on how to perform the salah: https://www.al-islam.org/nutshell/files/prayers.pdf

    There is also a difference in how one performs Whudhu[watch the video]: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HG8TVSVLOls


    As a shia muslim, you and i should either go into the islamic seminaries and learn for decades until we reach a stage where we can derive our own rulings. If that is not possible, we have to follow a scholar, and perform taqlid on a scholar you have understood to be the most knowledgable. I follow Ayatullah Sistani.

    Performing Taqleed essentially means you follow that scholars rulings on your day to day issues. For instance, how to pray salah, what is halal, what is haram.

    Here's information about Taqleed:
    http://www.sistani.org/english/book/49/2394/

    And also read this:
    http://www.sistani.org/english/book/48/2116/







    Could you tell me a little bit more on your background ? Do you have any other questions? From that, i will be able to give you further guidance and advice, inshAllah. There is plenty i would like to share with you, but let me know first

    Also, are you having any trouble in finding a shia mosque ?

    Do you have any queries or questions about shia islam, or want to be pointed towards some good resources?
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    (Original post by Kadak)
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    I'll answer all these questions soon, inshAllah.

    Give me a little bit of time as i have a few things to sort out
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    (Original post by Al-farhan)
    Salaam.
    x
    Walaykumsalam,

    I'll address your post more thoroughly when i get time - i have already developed answers to many of the points raised. But let me ask you the following:


    I take you to Kerbala, where ubdayallah ibn Ziyad was the commander at the time, leading to the slaughter of Hussain a.s, and much of the family of Hussain a.s, and Hasan a.s , and the absolute persecution of them. Imam Zain Al Abideen the fourth Imam a.s, was the father of Imam Muhammed Baqir a.s. One must note that he must have seen Ubaydallah, the commander, and his visciousness, and history tells us the sorrow of Kerbala had such a profound effect on the fourth Imam a.s, and there is absolutely no doubt Imam Muhammed Baqir a.s would have absolutely known the man who led the absolute brutal charge against his grandfather, Hussain a.s, was none other than Ubaydallah ibn Ziyad.

    In Saheeh Bukhari, they state:
    "Anas bin Malik said, "The head of Al-Husain was brought to 'Ubaidullah bin Ziyad and was put in a tray, and then Ibn Ziyad started playing with a stick at the nose and mouth of Al-Husain's head and saying something about his handsome features." Anas then said (to him), "Al-Husain resembled the Prophet more than the others did." Anas added, "His (i.e. Al-Husain's) hair was dyed with Wasma (i.e. a kind of plant used as a dye)"

    Yet, we find Imam Muhammed Baqir a.s naming one of his sons Ubaydullah, the son of the Imam a.s was Ubaydullah ibn Muhammed Al Baqir

    : Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muhammad_al-Baqir#

    Not only, that, we find Imam Musa Al Kadhim a.s, also naming one of his sons Ubaydullah/dillah: Ubaydull/dillah ibn Musa Al Kadhim
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Musa_al-Kadhim

    Did the Imams a.s name their sons after the famous commander who led the forces , which by his command slaughtered Hussain a.s, his sahaba r.a and his family? And then proceeded to play with the decapitated head of Imam Hussain a.s?
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    (Original post by Tawheed)
    Walaykumsalam,

    I'll address your post more thoroughly when i get time - i have already developed answers to many of the points raised. But let me ask you the following:


    I take you to Kerbala, where ubdayallah ibn Ziyad was the commander at the time, leading to the slaughter of Hussain a.s, and much of the family of Hussain a.s, and Hasan a.s , and the absolute persecution of them. Imam Zain Al Abideen the fourth Imam a.s, was the father of Imam Muhammed Baqir a.s. One must note that he must have seen Ubaydallah, the commander, and his visciousness, and history tells us the sorrow of Kerbala had such a profound effect on the fourth Imam a.s, and there is absolutely no doubt Imam Muhammed Baqir a.s would have absolutely known the man who led the absolute brutal charge against his grandfather, Hussain a.s, was none other than Ubaydallah ibn Ziyad.

    In Saheeh Bukhari, they state:
    "Anas bin Malik said, "The head of Al-Husain was brought to 'Ubaidullah bin Ziyad and was put in a tray, and then Ibn Ziyad started playing with a stick at the nose and mouth of Al-Husain's head and saying something about his handsome features." Anas then said (to him), "Al-Husain resembled the Prophet more than the others did." Anas added, "His (i.e. Al-Husain's) hair was dyed with Wasma (i.e. a kind of plant used as a dye)"

    Yet, we find Imam Muhammed Baqir a.s naming one of his sons Ubaydullah, the son of the Imam a.s was Ubaydullah ibn Muhammed Al Baqir

    : Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muhammad_al-Baqir#

    Not only, that, we find Imam Musa Al Kadhim a.s, also naming one of his sons Ubaydullah/dillah: Ubaydull/dillah ibn Musa Al Kadhim
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Musa_al-Kadhim

    Did the Imams a.s name their sons after the famous commander who led the forces , which by his command slaughtered Hussain a.s, his sahaba r.a and his family? And then proceeded to play with the decapitated head of Imam Hussain a.s?
    Salaam bro.
    This doesn't really answer my questions, just creates them.
    Ps: This could be the exception case here.
    As we all know the blessing of using slave of Allah names and their derivatives. So you are not taking someone's name you are taking your god's name and your servitude to him.
    Show me someone named hajaj? ps my other points
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    This is very interesting
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    (Original post by Tawheed)
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    When can I get an answer to my question (post 71)?
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    (Original post by Boondock Saint)
    When can I get an answer to my question (post 71)?
    Soon, inshAllah. Sorry for the delay.
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    (Original post by Al-farhan)
    Salaam bro.
    This doesn't really answer my questions, just creates them.
    Ps: This could be the exception case here.
    The issue here is, no Imam before the fifth Imam a.s named their child Ubaydallah. infact, Abdullah is a far more common name with similar meaning. Is it not strange for Imam Muhammed Baqir a.s, to name his child UbaydAllah, knowing full well his father , Imam Zain Al Abideen, was tied in chains, imprisoned, and his grandfather Hussain a.s slaughtered on the plains of Kerbala, and the decapitated head of Hussain ibn Ali a.s played with the commander on the day of Kerbala, Ubaydallah ibn Ziyad ?

    Similarly, the seventh Imam a.s also named a son Ubaydullah. I have yet to meet a born-shia who is named Ubaydullah today.

    As we all know the blessing of using slave of Allah names and their derivatives. So you are not taking someone's name you are taking your god's name and your servitude to him.
    The issue is, from Abdullah, Umar, Uthman, Ubaydullah, these are all names, even if the names themselves have meanings - at the end of the day, they are all names.

    I will answer your other points, but i would like to ask - Ubaidullah, a name that had never before been used before Kerbala by the imams a.s, or before the Fifth Imam a.s, a name after arguably the most famous/infamous ubaydallah - the commander who caused and ordered the most viscious slaughter of Hussain a.s, was used by the very Imam a.s who absolutely felt the affects and heard the tragedy of Kerbala his father and grandfather suffered, as well as by the seventh imam a.s, itself lends strong evidence that even if there is someone who is infamous , it does not mean they are named after them.


    As you have said this could be an exception, that both the fifth Imam a.s, the grandson of Hussain a.s, and the son of Imam Zain Al Abideen (both suffered at the hands of Ubaydullah, who even palyed with the decapitated head of Hussain a.s , in the most humuliating fashion), as well as the seventh Imam a.s were exceptions, i take you to another name:

    Abdurahman ibn Muljim, the man who slaughtered Ali ibn Abi Talib a.s, the man who enabled shariah law, and like-for like one strike death penalty to be carried out on Abdurahman ibn muljim according to some sources, was Hasan ibn Ali a.s, the eldest son of Imam Ali a.s

    Yet, we find Hasan Ibn Ali a.s has named one of his sons Abdurahman. Ali ibn Abi Talib a.s was matyr'd around 661. Kerbala took place in 680 AD.

    Many of the children of Imam Hasan a.s were matyrd in Kerbala, many were too young too fight. However, we do not find the name of Abdurahman, suggesting that he may have been too young during the battle of Kerbala, or not in a state where he could, like Qasim, fight, or perhaps not even present. It is likely he was born after the death of Ali ibn Abi Talib a.s, and thus after Abdurahman ibn Muljim struck Ali ibn Abi Talib a.s with the posioned sword during Sujood.

    Would i name my child after a man who killed my father, and whom i, sought retribution from myself in shariah in those days ? Again, similarly to ubaydullah, very few shia's if at all (i have yet to meet a born shia) are named Abdurahman, even though the name means something good, at the end of the day, like Umar, like Zayd, these are still names, irrespective what they mean.

    I do owe you a reply on your other points, in addition i and am currently working to compile the shia narrators of ahadith named with the Qunya Abu Bakr (because even these Abu Bakrs, have real names), Umar, Uthman, Muawiyah, and Yazid.
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    (Original post by Boondock Saint)
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    The only way to become a mu'min (rather than simply being within the folds of Islam, as a Muslim), is to recognize that the Prophet s.a.w left behind two weighty things, the Quran, and his ahlulbayt asws, and that Ali ibn Abi Talib asws was the rightful successor of Rasulullah s.a.w, the the prserver of his sunnah, followed by the imams of the ahlulbayt of Rasullah asws.

    If you consider that, to a number of sunni's, shia scholars are regarded as kuffar, praying behind them discouraged or considered impermissible, and the fact that shia muslims are only saved from mass takfir by virtue of the fact they are considered layman (users on here , and a number of website themselves) have said shia's are kaffir, but the layman are saved due to their ignorance , so i 'can't commit mass takfir', its puts things into perspective. If you look at the number of people who say you can not marry a shia, it also adds to the issue.

    According to the ijma afaik of shia ulema, we can marry sunni's in principal, we can even pray behind a sunni Imam. We are told never to refer to sunni's be names that may be used in a way that offends them (yet, on here and on other forums, i have been called a kaffir, or a rafhida many times, and even when i asked for an apology and stated i do not want to be referred to with the intention to abuse me, i got no apology). In fact, if you look at it, who are the ones always pushing and striving for shia-sunni unity ? It almost always comes from the shias. If you compare the words of ayatullah sistani (ha) with the words of the grand mufti of saudi arabia, on one hand, the grand mufti calls shias rafidha's, vile, backward, while ayatullah sistani (ha) asks shia's not to refer to sunni's as 'brothers', but 'our souls'.

    With regards to the day of judgement, it will be on Allh azwj to decide and judge. We all have the ahadith that says there will be 73 sects, and only one will go to paradise. I'm not sure what each madhab regards of the authenticity, but if anyone even knowingly rejects say, that that Salah is wajib,or that Hajj is not part of islam, and claims that there will be no day of judgement that itself in a sense is like rejecting Allah azwj and the fundamentals of the religion. On the day of judgement, it will up to Allah azwj to judge between muslims of every madhab, be they shia, salafi, ashari, and he will judge each individual, and judge them fairly, and no soul will be wrong in the least.

    So no, sunni's won't be 'doomed'. Each individual will be judged fairly by Allah azwj, who will see how much access to truth they had, and truly look at the sincerity of their hearts. I am not qualified nor is it my place to say who will enter jannah or not.

    Also, ayatullah shirazi has some big disagrements compared to the rest of the shia scholars. Ahyatullah shirazi (note, not to be confused with makarem shirazi), disregards unity with sunni's, promotes tatbir, things other marji's are at odds with with regards to him.
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    (Original post by Kadak)
    Why do Shia`s flagellate themselves ?
    I will inshAllah, answer one question at a time. The majority of shia's do not perform self-flagellation. It is only a small minority, who ofcourse, due to the nature of the act, get media. It is a relatively recent act in the way it is done today, and has absolutely no justification, or basis, or encouragement from any authentic ahadith in shia Islam. The imams of ahlulbayt a.s and Rasullah s.a.w never themselves forbade it because it never existed to begin with then! The burden of proof is to prove they accepted or encouraged it.

    Shia Scholars differ on the issue of Tatbir. I am sure you have heard of Ayatullah Khomeini(rh), the biggest religious authority in Iran at his time, who forbade self-flagellation/tatbir, and rather, promoted poetry. Currently, his successor, Ayatullah Khamanei(ha) has stated this act is absolutely harram, absolutely forbidden, irrational, and for shia's to absolutely avoid it. Some of the greatest modern thinkers in shia Islam, such as the renowned, Ayatullah Shaheed Mutahari(rh), who was assasinated shortly after the Islamic revolution of 1979 in Iran, regarded tatbir/self-flagellation as irrational, with absolutely no basis in Islam, and a clear instance of deviation. One of the most respected scholars in Iran currently, Ayatullah Makarem Shirazi, has this to say about the issue:



    Among widely followed scholars in shia Islam in the last 10-15 years are: Ayatullah Sistani, Ayatullah Khamanei, Ayatullah Fadllullah. Ayatullah Fadllulah and Ayatullah Khamanei both absolutely forbade tatbir in the strongest words. Ayatullah Sistani has never allowed it, nor has he forbidden it. On this issue, he has said he has no opinion.

    Even going back in the past 100 years, some of the most eminent marji's of their time, such as ayatullah abdul esfahani, himself stated tatbir is from the encouragement of the shaytan. Al Muhsin, another renowned scholar, boycotted meetings where it was done.


    What then, of those that do it, and the scholars who allow it?

    It is important to group the scholars that allow it. Firstly, many of those who say it is permissible are saying so as a fiqh issue. Not everyone who allows the act necessarily promotes or encourages it. Rather, many of the scholars who allow it forbid it in cases of loss of a limb or life or function. Furthermore, a number forbid it if the act itself disgraces Islam, and the school of ahululbayt a.s. Indirectly, we understand this to absolutely be the case anyway. Of the scholars that encourage it, they also have preconditions.
    As far as i am aware, being a shia, and interacting with shia's, i am seeing this act questioned more and more, and i predict it is dying.
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    (Original post by Kadak)
    Why do Shia`s flagellate themselves ?
    There's a video on this, promoting the views of the prominent marji's many of whom are absolutely against it.

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    (Original post by Tawheed)
    The issue here is, no Imam before the fifth Imam a.s named their child Ubaydallah. infact, Abdullah is a far more common name with similar meaning. Is it not strange for Imam Muhammed Baqir a.s, to name his child UbaydAllah, knowing full well his father , Imam Zain Al Abideen, was tied in chains, imprisoned, and his grandfather Hussain a.s slaughtered on the plains of Kerbala, and the decapitated head of Hussain ibn Ali a.s played with the commander on the day of Kerbala, Ubaydallah ibn Ziyad ?

    Similarly, the seventh Imam a.s also named a son Ubaydullah. I have yet to meet a born-shia who is named Ubaydullah today.



    The issue is, from Abdullah, Umar, Uthman, Ubaydullah, these are all names, even if the names themselves have meanings - at the end of the day, they are all names.

    I will answer your other points, but i would like to ask - Ubaidullah, a name that had never before been used before Kerbala by the imams a.s, or before the Fifth Imam a.s, a name after arguably the most famous/infamous ubaydallah - the commander who caused and ordered the most viscious slaughter of Hussain a.s, was used by the very Imam a.s who absolutely felt the affects and heard the tragedy of Kerbala his father and grandfather suffered, as well as by the seventh imam a.s, itself lends strong evidence that even if there is someone who is infamous , it does not mean they are named after them.


    As you have said this could be an exception, that both the fifth Imam a.s, the grandson of Hussain a.s, and the son of Imam Zain Al Abideen (both suffered at the hands of Ubaydullah, who even palyed with the decapitated head of Hussain a.s , in the most humuliating fashion), as well as the seventh Imam a.s were exceptions, i take you to another name:

    Abdurahman ibn Muljim, the man who slaughtered Ali ibn Abi Talib a.s, the man who enabled shariah law, and like-for like one strike death penalty to be carried out on Abdurahman ibn muljim according to some sources, was Hasan ibn Ali a.s, the eldest son of Imam Ali a.s

    Yet, we find Hasan Ibn Ali a.s has named one of his sons Abdurahman. Ali ibn Abi Talib a.s was matyr'd around 661. Kerbala took place in 680 AD.

    Many of the children of Imam Hasan a.s were matyrd in Kerbala, many were too young too fight. However, we do not find the name of Abdurahman, suggesting that he may have been too young during the battle of Kerbala, or not in a state where he could, like Qasim, fight, or perhaps not even present. It is likely he was born after the death of Ali ibn Abi Talib a.s, and thus after Abdurahman ibn Muljim struck Ali ibn Abi Talib a.s with the posioned sword during Sujood.

    Would i name my child after a man who killed my father, and whom i, sought retribution from myself in shariah in those days ? Again, similarly to ubaydullah, very few shia's if at all (i have yet to meet a born shia) are named Abdurahman, even though the name means something good, at the end of the day, like Umar, like Zayd, these are still names, irrespective what they mean.

    I do owe you a reply on your other points, in addition i and am currently working to compile the shia narrators of ahadith named with the Qunya Abu Bakr (because even these Abu Bakrs, have real names), Umar, Uthman, Muawiyah, and Yazid.
    Salaam.
    Your points are moot because:
    It still follows the ground rule (exception) that when you name using an abd name it is a blessed name tree ( both sunni/shia view that) and it is an encouraged name.
    With these names the namesakes hold no value compared to the value of the blessed name.
    Whereas with the other names esp the great 3 names these are named after their namesakes, and are popular due to their famous namesakes. And people generally name after the namesakes due to love, respect, emulation...etc.
    Generally it is accepted that namesakes play no value in hamd names (ahmed, mohamed, mahmoud..etc) and abd names (abdullah, abdulrahman....etc)
    Also I have been looking around for shia answers for this and the best answer I have found so far is:
    They did it out of taqiyaah.

    Basically what I'm saying is that these names you mention of the abd tree already have a strong root of being encouraged to use it due to their link of affirming one's servitude to god. So you don't look at namesakes rather the meaning of the name.

    Meanwhile the names of the 3 have no root islamically except by their namesakes and their fame, and how after them these names exploded in popularity due to the love and respect people had and everyone wanting a umar, uthman, abubakar in their family.
    Also please go back to replying the other points raised.
    take your time bro.
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    (Original post by Tawheed)
    The only way to become a mu'min (rather than simply being within the folds of Islam, as a Muslim), is to recognize that the Prophet s.a.w left behind two weighty things, the Quran, and his ahlulbayt asws, and that Ali ibn Abi Talib asws was the rightful successor of Rasulullah s.a.w, the the prserver of his sunnah, followed by the imams of the ahlulbayt of Rasullah asws.

    If you consider that, to a number of sunni's, shia scholars are regarded as kuffar, praying behind them discouraged or considered impermissible, and the fact that shia muslims are only saved from mass takfir by virtue of the fact they are considered layman (users on here , and a number of website themselves) have said shia's are kaffir, but the layman are saved due to their ignorance , so i 'can't commit mass takfir', its puts things into perspective. If you look at the number of people who say you can not marry a shia, it also adds to the issue.

    According to the ijma afaik of shia ulema, we can marry sunni's in principal, we can even pray behind a sunni Imam. We are told never to refer to sunni's be names that may be used in a way that offends them (yet, on here and on other forums, i have been called a kaffir, or a rafhida many times, and even when i asked for an apology and stated i do not want to be referred to with the intention to abuse me, i got no apology). In fact, if you look at it, who are the ones always pushing and striving for shia-sunni unity ? It almost always comes from the shias. If you compare the words of ayatullah sistani (ha) with the words of the grand mufti of saudi arabia, on one hand, the grand mufti calls shias rafidha's, vile, backward, while ayatullah sistani (ha) asks shia's not to refer to sunni's as 'brothers', but 'our souls'.

    With regards to the day of judgement, it will be on Allh azwj to decide and judge. We all have the ahadith that says there will be 73 sects, and only one will go to paradise. I'm not sure what each madhab regards of the authenticity, but if anyone even knowingly rejects say, that that Salah is wajib,or that Hajj is not part of islam, and claims that there will be no day of judgement that itself in a sense is like rejecting Allah azwj and the fundamentals of the religion. On the day of judgement, it will up to Allah azwj to judge between muslims of every madhab, be they shia, salafi, ashari, and he will judge each individual, and judge them fairly, and no soul will be wrong in the least.

    So no, sunni's won't be 'doomed'. Each individual will be judged fairly by Allah azwj, who will see how much access to truth they had, and truly look at the sincerity of their hearts. I am not qualified nor is it my place to say who will enter jannah or not.

    Also, ayatullah shirazi has some big disagrements compared to the rest of the shia scholars. Ahyatullah shirazi (note, not to be confused with makarem shirazi), disregards unity with sunni's, promotes tatbir, things other marji's are at odds with with regards to him.
    As I said, I'm fully aware that all Shia scholars (including the Shirazis) have ruled that Shari'i rulings must apply to Sunnis in this world and that we must be treated as Muslims.

    In relation to the hadith on 73 sects, a lot of Sunni scholars have rendered it weak. Imam ash-Shawkani, al-Kawthari and Ibn al-Wazir declared the latter part of the hadith which reads ‘all of whom will be in the hellfire except one’ to be a weak addition (because the same hadith exists without it). Ibn Hazm, in his assessment of the hadith, concluded that the addition was fabricated. Even the scholars that did consider the addition to be sound, such as Imam Shatibi, very clearly stipulated in their commentaries that it isn’t permissible for any group of people to identify as the ‘saved sect’. I've also read commentaries of the hadith which point out that the text doesn't mean every other group are made up of disbelievers or that they'll be sentenced to hell for eternity.

    Moreover, another hadith actually exists within the Sunni corpus which says ’72 groups will be in paradise except for one’ which also has a sound chain, and according to the authority relied on by Dar al-Ifta (Mohammed ibn Ahmed Al-Bishari Al-Maqdisi), actually contains a sounder chain. http://www.dar-alifta.org/Foreign/Vi...spx?ID=4796

    The Shirazis, however, understand the '72 sects' hadith with the addition which specifies 'all of whom will be in hell except one' to be sound, and they also interpret it to mean that Shias are the only group which are guaranteed paradise. My question for you now is this: How do your Maraji grade and interpret the '72 sects' hadith? If it's the case that your Maraji don't dispute its authenticity or hold a different interpretation of the text in question, then you must admit, as a matter of general principle, that according to Shia doctrine, anyone that is Sunni, is heading to one place, and that is hell.
 
 
 
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