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    (Original post by Tyrion_Lannister)
    What about when people react in a way that is unexpected and not even a recognised side effect? I'll list them, I hallucinated from a local anaestheic and it wasn't just a hallucination, it made me believe I'd been captured by the FBI..., had seizures on tranexamic acid, had a paradoxical reaction on benzos (this is the only doccumented one), has no effect at all from triptans no pain releif,

    I could go on. Why has this happened? No one has been able to explain it. So I'm skeptical when people claim a one size fits all approach to this
    I'm afraid you might want to step back and think about the amount of knowledge you actually have on these things, how much knowledge any doctors around had on these things and exactly how important/relevant it would have been to them to find a thorough explanation for what happened to you and why, once they had sorted out getting you through the reactions you experienced, noting anything relevant down and finding alternatives to treat you with. It is highly unlikely you are some kind of new, unique specimen of homo sapiens. It is extremely likely that the lack of doctor-patient communication endemic to at least the UK and selective memory means that your perception of these incidents is greatly flawed and/or misinformed.
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    (Original post by Tabzqt)
    The concentration is too low, it is negligible. It is water.
    If it isn't just water then why is it not possible to overdose?

    Yet it exists. In trace amounts. Tell me why someone can react in ways that are undocumented? If that's possible, why is this not possible? Some people are so close minded.




    Why is someone who believes in Homeopathy on it then?
    I have an IQ of 133 and go to a Russell Group Red Brick uni. Not something I shout about, but as you're implying I'm a retard just thought I'd chuck it out there. One of my student support workers is also an evid believer in homeopathy. She has a PHD. Guess we're both morons eh?
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    (Original post by Tabzqt)
    If it isn't just water then why is it not possible to overdose?
    Surely any risk must be in an underdose?

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homeopathic_dilutions
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    (Original post by Ronove)
    I'm afraid you might want to step back and think about the amount of knowledge you actually have on these things, how much knowledge any doctors around had on these things and exactly how important/relevant it would have been to them to find a thorough explanation for what happened to you and why, once they had sorted out getting you through the reactions you experienced, noting anything relevant down and finding alternatives to treat you with. It is highly unlikely you are some kind of new, unique specimen of homo sapiens. It is extremely likely that the lack of doctor-patient communication endemic to at least the UK and selective memory means that your perception of these incidents is greatly flawed and/or misinformed.
    I asked several times why this had happened from a regular doctor I saw, it wasn't as it it was a one off. He admitted he was genuinely stumped, and another one said she'd never seen it in all her years of working and had no idea why it had happened.

    My perception of the incidents isn't flawed, one was recent and all of them have witnesses.
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    (Original post by Tyrion_Lannister)
    Yet it exists. In trace amounts. Tell me why someone can react in ways that are undocumented? If that's possible, why is this not possible? Some people are so close minded.
    In negligible amounts, so it has no effect. It is still water.
    There could be a thousand and one reasons why you react. But it's not because it works in the way they say it does. Close minded because I don't want to believe in something that has completely no evidence? Ok. I'd rather be close minded.

    I have an IQ of 133 and go to a Russell Group Red Brick uni. Not something I shout about, but as you're implying I'm a retard just thought I'd chuck it out there. One of my student support workers is also an evid believer in homeopathy. She has a PHD. Guess we're both morons eh?
    officially confirmed for mad. It is indeed interesting how someone who is academically intelligent could fall for such an obvious hoax as Homeopathy. Perhaps it can be traced back to some kind of childhood trauma.
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    (Original post by Tabzqt)
    In negligible amounts, so it has no effect. It is still water.
    There could be a thousand and one reasons why you react. But it's not because it works in the way they say it does. Close minded because I don't want to believe in something that has completely no evidence? Ok. I'd rather be close minded.
    Good for you. You stay being close minded and I'll stay using what works for me. I really don't know why it offended you I wasn't telling everyone to ditch their meds and try it my way.


    officially confirmed for mad. It is indeed interesting how someone who is academically intelligent could fall for such an obvious hoax as Homeopathy. Perhaps it can be traced back to some kind of childhood trauma.
    You're entitled to that opinion. I hope it makes you feel better.
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    (Original post by Iron Lady)
    Does it work?

    Thanks.
    It most certainly does work.


    Spoiler:
    Show
    As a placebo.
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    (Original post by Tyrion_Lannister)
    Good for you. You stay being close minded and I'll stay using what works for me. I really don't know why it offended you I wasn't telling everyone to ditch their meds and try it my way.



    You're entitled to that opinion. I hope it makes you feel better.
    stay mad and drink your water
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    (Original post by Tyrion_Lannister)
    I asked several times why this had happened from a regular doctor I saw, it wasn't as it it was a one off. He admitted he was genuinely stumped, and another one said she'd never seen it in all her years of working and had no idea why it had happened.

    My perception of the incidents isn't flawed, one was recent and all of them have witnesses.
    This is evidence enough for me that you're woefully misguided on how these things work. Apparently you have literally no idea about the depth and breadth of knowledge of individual doctors.
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    (Original post by Ronove)
    This is evidence enough for me that you're woefully misguided on how these things work. Apparently you have literally no idea about the depth and breadth of knowledge of individual doctors.
    What? I'm not suggesting they know everything, but I asked professionals and researched it and came back with nothing.
    • Welcome Squad
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    Welcome Squad
    (Original post by pjm600)
    If you're talking about some homeopathic sulphur 'remedy', which contains just water, it did nothing.
    It was pills, not water...
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    (Original post by Tabzqt)
    The concentration is too low, it is negligible. It is water.
    If it isn't just water then why is it not possible to overdose?
    Technically you can overdose on water:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Water_poisoning
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    Just because somebody tried homeopathy and then got better doesn't mean that them taking homeopathy caused them to get better; that's a correlation/causation fallacy.
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    (Original post by nulli tertius)
    There are two things about homeopathic medicine that conventional medicine tends to gloss over.

    The first comes from the repeated use of dismissives when referring to the placebo effect e.g "its only a placebo", "homoeopathy works no better than a placebo". An improvement in condition brought about by a placebo effect is seen as inherently less worthy than an improvement in condition brought about by a pharmacological process.

    Secondly, it is likely that much of the effect of homeopathic medicine is not due to the placebo effect but to the process of diagnosis. Homeopaths tend to spend far longer in appointments and gain a far more detailed understanding of the lifestyle and general physical and mental health of patients than most general practitioners. Conditions that have a psychological component or which are likely to be affected by lifestyle changes may be helped other than by the homeopathic "remedies" prescribed.
    So essentially, we have unlicensed, untrained therapists distributing fake medication wrapped up in archaic bull****.

    As to the great benefits of the placebo effect, you do realise that real drugs give these same benefits too. The test for drugs is that they work better than a similarly administered placebo. They must match and surpass the placebo effect (an by the same token be more useful than homeopathy) to be licensed. The placebo effect is dismissed as it is the 'zero point' from which the scale of drug efficacy is measured.
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    (Original post by Mazzini)
    It was pills, not water...
    Did they taste sugary?
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    Depends what you mean by "work"
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    (Original post by Tyrion_Lannister)
    Then why bother with double blind trials? If it doesn't make a difference? Sorry if that's a daft question, it justs seems logical



    I have had weird reactions to most medicine and no one has been able to explain why, it happens a lot. Would it not follow therefore thatif individuals are different, certain people may be more sensitive to certain things and therefore benefit from homeopathy?
    Sadly, no. If there was anything, even one molecule of substance, in a homeopathic remedy, your argument might hold some water (if you'll excuse the pun). However, at the standard C30 dilutions, the amount of water needed to ensure that you ingest a single molecule of the intended substance would be greater than the amount of atoms in our solar system. C60 would need rather a lot of extra universes worth of atoms to contain the single molecule of active substances. It gets stupider from there.

    Even if, by remarkable chance, you did get that molecule, if it were an active ingredient, it would be more efficacious in larger amounts anyway, as it would be able to affect more than one protein in one cell in the tens of trillions of cells in a human body.
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    (Original post by chrisawhitmore)
    The placebo effect is dismissed as it is the 'zero point' from which the scale of drug efficacy is measured.
    But of course that is entirely the wrong measure from the perspective of a patient. The patient doesn't care whether something is better than a hypothetical placebo. The patient cares whether it is better than the status quo, whether that is receiving no treatment or receiving a treatment with which he or she is dissatisfied in some way.
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    (Original post by Dalilsp)
    Years and years and years ago, "rigorous scientific study" proved that the world was flat. Are you so narrow-minded that the technology of the future may disprove us yet again like it has so many times about the other topics we thought to be true.

    Again, everything is a matter of opinion. Why are you angered by other people believing something that you don't? How does it affect you...?
    Wrong, lack of rigorous scientific study led people to believe the world was flat. Except it didn't, because we've known the Earth to be round since pretty much forever.
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    (Original post by nulli tertius)
    But of course that is entirely the wrong measure from the perspective of a patient. The patient doesn't care whether something is better than a hypothetical placebo. The patient cares whether it is better than the status quo, whether that is receiving no treatment or receiving a treatment with which he or she is dissatisfied in some way.
    The point is that as all drugs are measured for efficacy against a placebo, there can be no licensed drug which a placebo (homoeopathy) is better than and so placebos should only be used where no drug is possible or available. Ethically speaking, we should also avoid lying to patients about the efficacy of treatments. By the same token that we don't tell a cancer sufferer that they'll definitely be fine, we shouldn't pretend that homoeopathy actually has any effect arising from its ingredients.

    Furthermore, selling a product based to sick people on a lie about what it can do is the lowest sort of con.
 
 
 
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