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    (Original post by chazwomaq)
    Sounds like 2 sides of the same coin to me.

    The CPS says to interpret the law you ask 2 questions:

    1. Did the defendant believe the complainant consented?
    2. If so, did the defendant reasonably believe it? It will be for the jury to decide if his or her belief was reasonable
    The second part is what is known as an 'objective' test. It doesn't depend on the defendant's state of mind or his own subjective reasons for believing the consent was given, but solely on the circumstances surrounding the act. As point 2 says, it is a matter of fact for the jury to determine.
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    I find it stupid how two people can get drunk and have a one night stand that they both regret and then the women can use the fact that she was drunk to convict the man for rape, while the man can't do Jack ****. The fact that he was drunk works against him in these cases while the fact that the women was drunk works for her case.
    These rape cases are full of double standards like this
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    (Original post by Smash Bandicoot)
    Oh dear lord yes.

    No one deserves to be raped, but men already have little say in a relationship scenario anymore. OUTSIDE of this event of cozrse!

    I mean seriously there are people who would say it's only rape if he's ugly :lolwut:

    Equally there are wives who will file false rape accusations just to win a divorce case with a hubby they're bored of

    They should have thought this through.
    dawgg you just spoke my freaking mind !

    and these ARE the reasons i avoid marriages or things like that, like the plague man; its' like the law is castrating your balls
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    (Original post by Veggiechic6)
    How many people actually ask each other if they want to have sex before actually having it? Maybe people should be carrying around contracts that have to be signed before anything happens! They'll be no such thing as one night stands, they'll become 'too risky'.

    How is a guy supposed to know how drunk someone has to be before it would be considered rape? What if both parties are drunk? Men could easily argue that they were too drunk to consent also. Men who knowingly take advantage of women are pigs but if women choose to get themselves legless, surely they must realise they've also chosen to be more vulnerable and at risk of these things happening. I disagree with people who say women are entirely innocent and blameless when it comes to rape because of drunkenness.

    i entirely, absolutely, completely, second and repeat from my heart, every word, letter and punctuation in the above post.

    Respect.
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    (Original post by Inexorably)
    How moronic lol. What a terrible injustice done onto the justice system.
    I just would like to know what it is just women who are given this special protection, it seems thoroughly unfair. Rape is a hideous crime but women are not always and not the only victims. Men can rape men and women can rape men. Why are men not accorded the same protection?
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    (Original post by Smash Bandicoot)
    Respect. It is very hard for a guy to share these fears and not sound like hellspawn, so I appreciate it.
    No problem, I think owning up to the fact this is an issue is a great step forward
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    Why was Ched Evens even convicted? The woman slept with three blokes that night and boasted on twitter about extorting money

    http://www.chedevans.com/the-disputed-tweets

    Then the police arrested people who shared the tweets because 'it named the victim'.

    Something needs to be done about these Nazis.

    Also deleted facebook messages which would incriminate her

    http://www.chedevans.com/the-deleted-facebook-messages
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    (Original post by Snagprophet)
    Why was Ched Evens even convicted? The woman slept with three blokes that night and boasted on twitter about extorting money

    http://www.chedevans.com/the-disputed-tweets

    Then the police arrested people who shared the tweets because 'it named the victim'.

    Something needs to be done about these Nazis.
    Personally, I am ok with greater awareness about rape and protection for rape victims. However, I want to know why is it only women who are protected in these new guidelines? Women can rape men and men can rape men. So should not it cover both genders?
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    By this logic, just about every crime in law is "guilty until proven innocent". Why should rape be considered to have a vague or ambiguous middle-ground when other crimes don't?
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    (Original post by TurboCretin)
    I would say a lengthy prison sentence and permanent stigma of being a convicted rapist simply because you couldn't prove your innocence is pretty bad.
    then neither should be putting themselves in a position where they could be accused
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    (Original post by anarchism101)
    By this logic, just about every crime in law is "guilty until proven innocent".
    How so?

    I'm kind of naive in that I don't have that in depth knowledge of how our legal system works.
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    (Original post by clh_hilary)
    :
    Being raped - No STD, no bodily harm, feeling upset, feeling angry.
    But how you feel depends on how you approach the incident. You can change it.
    Because rape has zero psychological effects, right?
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    (Original post by Snagprophet)
    Why was Ched Evens even convicted?
    The one sentence version is 'because he stuck his penis in someone every independent witness described as "extremely drunk" without any reasonable belief in her consent.'

    The longer version is in the replies to various other people who typically haven't read more than the 'He did do that, but that shouldn't make him a rapist' site in the Ched Evans should have his conviction overturned thread, but the fact that neither he or McDonald asked her if she wanted to have sex with the stranger who turned up uninvited, unexpected and unwanted in the hotel room she'd gone to with McDonald didn't help him.

    For the rest of it, it's not possible to sell a story which consists of 'I don't remember'. If she wanted to sell a story - and she hasn't, has she? - it would be about her experience of being on the end of a monstering campaign fuelled by that website.
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    (Original post by Stein1)
    Personally, I am ok with greater awareness about rape and protection for rape victims. However, I want to know why is it only women who are protected in these new guidelines?
    If you look at the story, both the Director of Public Prosecutions and the ACPO lead for sexual assault both use gender-neutral language.

    It's the newspaper that only talks about female victims.
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    (Original post by ChaoticButterfly)
    How so?

    I'm kind of naive in that I don't have that in depth knowledge of how our legal system works.
    Well, suppose I take something of yours, or burn your car, come up to you in the street and start violently attacking you, etc. Now, if, for whatever reason, you genuinely willingly consented to whatever it is I did, then I'd be fine (though there are some obvious exceptions to this, such as homicide, which would be illegal even if you did consent). But the law would not assume that you consented unless you can prove you didn't - it would assume you did not consent unless I can prove you did.
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    (Original post by dani t)
    then neither should be putting themselves in a position where they could be accused
    Otherwise known as 'justice a la witch trial'.
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    Pathetic. Only makes it tough on those who are falsely accused.

    Hate this country.
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    (Original post by anarchism101)
    Well, suppose I take something of yours, or burn your car, come up to you in the street and start violently attacking you, etc. Now, if, for whatever reason, you genuinely willingly consented to whatever it is I did, then I'd be fine (though there are some obvious exceptions to this, such as homicide, which would be illegal even if you did consent). But the law would not assume that you consented unless you can prove you didn't - it would assume you did not consent unless I can prove you did.
    There might be some kind of general distinction between having sex and being beaten/having your car burned/being a victim of theft. I'm darned if I can work out what it is though.

    Oh, as an aside, you might want to consider the case of R v Brown.
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    (Original post by TurboCretin)
    There might be some kind of general distinction between having sex and being beaten/having your car burned/being a victim of theft. I'm darned if I can work out what it is though.
    Well, I'd say the main distinction is reasonable belief; there's a more considerable scope in rape cases to say you had reasonable belief that the victim consented even if she didn't. But this isn't so much a difference in the nature of the crime as the likelihood of particular circumstances of it.

    Oh, as an aside, you might want to consider the case of R v Brown.
    Yeah, had heard about it before, just couldn't remember the case name, thanks. Is an interesting one. Indeed, there's quite a lot of debate among anarchists about the nature of BDSM and to what extent it's authoritarian or coercive.
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    (Original post by All_TheCyanide)
    You're looking at it in a very black and white way. You don't consider that pregnancy is an issue for women (and some women aren't allowed contraceptives/ would find it difficult to obtain them without telling someone, which they might not be ready to do).

    There's also blame culture. What was she wearing etc. and some religions shun raped women and deny that men can be raped at all
    I already have covered all of them except for pregnancy (simply because I cannot get pregnant). Having a child is still better than having no friends, no family, no jobs, and people threatening to kill should I be accused of rape.

    Also, that's the worst scenario. In a better scenario, I'd be a woman in a western country, meaning ever if the rapist is judged innocent, I could still ask for him to pay for my child.

    The blame culture doesn't just affect the victim. The society judges both sides - the victim brings it on themselves, but at the same time they wouldn't want to associate or hire the accused rapist. This is also ignoring the fact that if you're raped, it's less likely for your mother to disown you than if you've been accused of rape.

    This is especially true with my career as a teacher. I will never be able to find a teaching job anywhere if I've been accused of rape. And this would be the case whether I'm working in the UK, the US, Canada, the middle east, Africa, Hong Kong, Beijing, Japan, Australia, or Antarctica.

    I didn't look at it in a black or white way, I've considered a wide range of scenarios and come to the conclusion that it's better to be raped than be accused of being raped. But at the same time, you're very one-sided and considered only one side but not another.
 
 
 
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