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    (Original post by darkvibes)
    Don't be silly, the UK is 87% white. Even if we leave the EU, we will probably need to get back into the Schengen as a deal for getting into the EU trade bloc, which is vital for our economy.

    Staying in the EU means that we actually get a better deal as we have control of our borders and there will be less immigration.
    We aren't even in schengen


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    (Original post by paul514)
    We aren't even in schengen


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    yeah i misworded it there. But we probably would need to join it as part of the trading deal if we were to leave the EU
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    (Original post by Tamora)
    Politics won't trump free trade. What do you think German manufacturers will do if the EU hinders trade?
    German manufacturers will have to find other markets.
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    (Original post by darkvibes)
    yeah i misworded it there. But we probably would need to join it as part of the trading deal if we were to leave the EU
    And we would refuse as it one of the top issues the country would have voted to leave on if that scenario was to pass.

    The eu will get a budget contribution and probably visa free access for holiday makers.


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    (Original post by Maker)
    German manufacturers will have to find other markets.
    There's nothing to stop them finding other markets now, but they won't want to give up their British market. It would make no economic sense at all.
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    (Original post by paul514)
    And we would refuse as it one of the top issues the country would have voted to leave on if that scenario was to pass.

    The eu will get a budget contribution and probably visa free access for holiday makers.


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    What's your view, remain or leave?
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    (Original post by gladders)
    We can already do that.
    But not without reference to the European Commission as I said.



    (Original post by gladders)
    I disagree. For practical reasons, much of EU regulation would likely continue to apply here so that our goods can still sell competitively in the EU.
    That any country that wants to sell into another's market must comply with the regulations of that market is not in dispute. The same would apply to anyone selling into the British market in the event of Brexit.
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    (Original post by Tamora)
    There's nothing to stop them finding other markets now, but they won't want to give up their British market. It would make no economic sense at all.
    I don't think the Germans will lose their UK market entirely but may be reduced because it would be harder to trade with. But the UK exporters may also lose some of its EU markets and the Germans would be more than happy to grab a slice of that.

    In fact, I would think the Germans will be saying to its EU customers that they should switch from UK suppliers to German suppliers because it would be much easier to do business with a EU supplier than a suppler outside to EU and subject to a load of red tape and additional costs.
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    (Original post by Maker)
    I don't think the Germans will lose their UK market entirely but may be reduced because it would be harder to trade with. But the UK exporters may also lose some of its EU markets and the Germans would be more than happy to grab a slice of that.

    In fact, I would think the Germans will be saying to its EU customers that they should switch from UK suppliers to German suppliers because it would be much easier to do business with a EU supplier than a suppler outside to EU and subject to a load of red tape and additional costs.
    Why would German manufacturers lose any of their UK market? All parties would have to compete for their markets. Is that so surprising?
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    (Original post by Tamora)
    Why would German manufacturers lose any of their UK market? All parties would have to compete for their markets. Is that so surprising?
    Because it would be harder and more expensive to trade between EU and non EU countries.
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    (Original post by Maker)
    Because it would be harder and more expensive to trade between EU and non EU countries.
    But no so hard as to inhibit trade to any great degree.
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    (Original post by Tamora)
    But no so hard as to inhibit trade to any great degree.
    You wish. There is a reason why trade deals between countries take so long to trash out. Countries are simultaneously trying to protect their own producers while trying to export into another country's market. They will make things difficult to import things that affect their own producers and the other country will do the same. You can put in a load of red tape like having goods sitting in customs for weeks to be cleared or asking for loads of pointless paperwork.
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    (Original post by Maker)
    You wish. There is a reason why trade deals between countries take so long to trash out. Countries are simultaneously trying to protect their own producers while trying to export into another country's market. They will make things difficult to import things that affect their own producers and the other country will do the same. You can put in a load of red tape like having goods sitting in customs for weeks to be cleared or asking for loads of pointless paperwork.
    You don't think the EU and manufacturers active in its member states will want to protect their trade surplus with the UK? Do you seriously think they'll risk that by imposing excessive red tape?
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    (Original post by Tamora)
    You don't think the EU and manufacturers active in its member states will want to protect their trade surplus with the UK? Do you seriously think they'll risk that by imposing excessive red tape?
    Yes, I think they will impose more red tape because they have to treat a non EU Britain like any other non EU country. They have to set a start position for negotiating trade agreements and the more red tape each side imposes at the beginning, the more they could gain.
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    (Original post by Maker)
    I assume Britain don't want to jeopardise Chinese investments and exports by imposing tariffs.
    Weak leadership. China dumps millions of tons of steel on the market and imposes tariffs on British steel and in so doing hammers the last nail into the coffin of the British steel industry. Britain in return does nothing in the hope that China will invest in the UK.

    What a way to run a country.
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    (Original post by Maker)
    Yes, I think they will impose more red tape because they have to treat a non EU Britain like any other non EU country. They have to set a start position for negotiating trade agreements and the more red tape each side imposes at the beginning, the more they could gain.
    That's fine. They can treat us like any other non-EU country. Non EU countries have free trade deals with the EU.

    I know europhiles like to tell us they take years to negotiate, but with the amount of trade and jobs at stake it can be done in the leave negotiations quickly enough if both sides want it enough, and they will want it enough.
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    (Original post by darkvibes)
    yeah i misworded it there. But we probably would need to join it as part of the trading deal if we were to leave the EU
    :banghead:
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    (Original post by Tamora)
    But not without reference to the European Commission as I said.
    Whoopedy-do.

    That any country that wants to sell into another's market must comply with the regulations of that market is not in dispute. The same would apply to anyone selling into the British market in the event of Brexit.
    Seeing as a huge portion of our trade is with the EU, the obligation will be somewhat heavier upon us to adapt to them.
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    (Original post by Tamora)
    That's fine. They can treat us like any other non-EU country. Non EU countries have free trade deals with the EU.

    I know europhiles like to tell us they take years to negotiate, but with the amount of trade and jobs at stake it can be done in the leave negotiations quickly enough if both sides want it enough, and they will want it enough.
    I think you are being too optimistic. People want lots things but it does not mean they get it. If Britain do leave the EU, there is a good chance Cameron will resign and a eurosceptic leader will become prime minister, one that would be antagonistic to the EU making negotiations more difficult. It will also signal to the EU that Britain is more interested in politics than economics.

    While Britain has 45% of exports going to the EU, the EU has about 16% of its exports going to the UK even though the value of EU exports is higher. Any disruption to exports between the EU and the UK will hurt the UK more and the EU knows that. The EU also knows UK based companies that export a lot to the EU like car makers could be tempted to relocate to the EU if it gave them enough sweeteners and put up barriers to exports to the EU at the same time.
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    (Original post by Tamora)
    That's fine. They can treat us like any other non-EU country. Non EU countries have free trade deals with the EU.

    I know europhiles like to tell us they take years to negotiate, but with the amount of trade and jobs at stake it can be done in the leave negotiations quickly enough if both sides want it enough, and they will want it enough.
    Utterly fanciful wishful thinking.
 
 
 
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