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Knife incident in Russell Square - One dead, five injured Watch

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    (Original post by Trapz99)
    I don't see why the race of the attacker is important...
    it isnt, but the ideology in his background may be
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    (Original post by oShahpo)
    Well it certainly is in France, but I don't know about the rest of Europe. Most of Al-Qaeda, and ISIS attacks are carried out by South/Mid Asians and Arabs, so I doubt we can just guess it.
    the cases i referred to were al in europe ie france germany etc - so they were all it seems either north africans or middle eastern of an islamic background. cant really point to ethnicity specifically as a link....
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    A 101 on how to spin a story as an Islamophobe

    1) He was Norwegian and Somalian but let's just focus on the latter cause Somalia is a muslim country and thus conforms to our agenda.
    2) Police said he was mentally ill and it is not terrorism, but if we follow (1) we can say it was terrorism because he's Somalian.
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    (Original post by lahorizon)
    A 101 on how to spin a story as an Islamophobe

    1) He was Norwegian and Somalian but let's just focus on the latter cause Somalia is a muslim country and thus conforms to our agenda.
    2) Police said he was mentally ill and it is not terrorism, but if we follow (1) we can say it was terrorism because he's Somalian.
    dont spin about the fact he was somalian and therefore a possible target for islamist radicalism - but spin the idea that arresting officers are medically qualfied to establish level of sanity ? seems contradictory.

    as with many of these cases the real background detail is not discovered till many days later but why are the met and certain elements of the media and tsr trying to push the idea each time that whenever a muslim happens to commit an attrocity - he must be assumed to be mental ? We must feel for the victim and her family, and also wonder if its a coincidence that the attacker went after americans british and an israeli?
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    (Original post by lahorizon)
    A 101 on how to spin a story as an Islamophobe

    1) He was Norwegian and Somalian but let's just focus on the latter cause Somalia is a muslim country and thus conforms to our agenda.
    2) Police said he was mentally ill and it is not terrorism, but if we follow (1) we can say it was terrorism because he's Somalian.
    If there was an issue in the UK with people from the Somali community in the UK committing similar attacks, it might be relevant to ask why many Somali people are involved in such acts. But there doesn't seem to be any evidence to support the idea that Somali people commit more attacks in the UK or even Europe than other groups.

    I'm not sure how influenced the attacker was by Norwegian culture, as he did leave the country when he was 5 years old. But assuming his family had lived a long time in Norway and assimilated and absorbed the Norwegian culture and came to the UK to live among a Norwegian community in the UK, and that many people from this Norwegian community were involved in attacks n the UK, then I think it would be relevant to ask why so many people from the Norwegian community in the UK are involved in such attacks.
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    (Original post by Reformed)
    dont spin about the fact he was somalian and therefore a possible target for islamist radicalism - but spin the idea that arresting officers are medically qualfied to establish level of sanity ? seems contradictory.

    as with many of these cases the real background detail is not discovered till many days later but why are the met and certain elements of the media and tsr trying to push the idea each time that whenever a muslim happens to commit an attrocity - he must be assumed to be mental ? We must feel for the victim and her family, and also wonder if its a coincidence that the attacker went after americans british and an israeli?
    How would the attacker know that his victims are from there? It's Russell Square which is a very affluent and white area so there is high chance that they were the only ones around.
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    (Original post by lahorizon)
    How would the attacker know that his victims are from there? It's Russell Square which is a very affluent and white area so there is high chance that they were the only ones around.
    actually its a very touristy area, and these most likely where tourists, just as they would be hundreds of arab. asian and european tourists in the vicinity. there were even eye witness videos posted by a number of people with muslims names, so i assume the area wasnt simply wall to wall white american non-muslims.

    i would ask the question was it mere coincidence that the victims were from the 3 most hated countries in the islamist world- ie USA, uk and israel?
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    Why does the killer's race and religion even matter? The Islamophobic rhetoric in this thread is gross and racist.
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    (Original post by Reformed)
    actually its a very touristy area, and these most likely where tourists, just as they would be hundreds of arab. asian and european tourists in the vicinity. there were even eye witness videos posted by a number of people with muslims names, so i assume the area wasnt simply wall to wall white american non-muslims.

    i would ask the question was it mere coincidence that the victims were from the 3 most hated countries in the islamist world- ie USA, uk and israel?
    Are you actually serious? I personally can't differentiate an Israeli from another races. I am Iranian and I don't agree with the aforementioned governments but I know better than to take it out on the people who are from there, as do millions of other middle easterns. I say it is a coincidence. I think more tourists visit London from USA than they do from Somalia and their hotels are most likely in affluent areas such as Russell Square, so I think that is why they were attacked. As for British people: If you randomly pick 5 people walking the streets in Central London in of course- Britain, I would say there is almost a 100% chance that one of them will be British -_- ... As for Israeli, once again it is an affluent area and the only Asians that visit UK and go to affluent areas in my eyes are those from China, Saudi Arabia and Israel. So again, just a coincidence.
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    (Original post by NickLCFC)
    Why does the killer's race and religion even matter? The Islamophobic rhetoric in this thread is gross and racist.
    If a person is white and murders someone in the street, they are mentally ill. (See Jo Cox)
    If a person is brown and murders someone in the street, they are an Islamic terrorist.
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    (Original post by NickLCFC)
    Terrible news. R.I.P to the woman that died.

    It's too early to know what exactly the motive was but I think that it's safe to say that this attack had absolutely nothing to do with Islam. No true Muslim would carry out an act like this and I think it's important to remember that.
    no true scotsman. Ayyyylmao muh fallacies
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    (Original post by lahorizon)
    Are you actually serious? I personally can't differentiate an Israeli from another races. I am Iranian and I don't agree with the aforementioned governments but I know better than to take it out on the people who are from there, as do millions of other middle easterns. I say it is a coincidence. I think more tourists visit London from USA than they do from Somalia and their hotels are most likely in affluent areas such as Russell Square, so I think that is why they were attacked. As for British people: If you randomly pick 5 people walking the streets in Central London in of course- Britain, I would say there is almost a 100% chance that one of them will be British -_- ... As for Israeli, once again it is an affluent area and the only Asians that visit UK and go to affluent areas in my eyes are those from China, Saudi Arabia and Israel. So again, just a coincidence.
    of course all of this could be coincidence, im not denying thart - im saying it was all jsut odd. perhaps this was a guy who happened to be muslim, happened to go to a tourist area and happened to attack quite obviously non-muslims of western countries that islamist have a complex about. All possible. but then there have been plenty of islamist attacks in this manor that havent been 'just coincidence'
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    (Original post by lahorizon)
    A 101 on how to spin a story as an Islamophobe

    1) He was Norwegian and Somalian but let's just focus on the latter cause Somalia is a muslim country and thus conforms to our agenda.
    2) Police said he was mentally ill and it is not terrorism, but if we follow (1) we can say it was terrorism because he's Somalian.
    I agree that this attack doesn't appear to be religiously motivated, but "islamophobia" is not a real thing. It's a made-up word that is supposed to pathologise the opposition to a socio-political doctrine that glorifies the basest elements of the human condition and demands enforcement via the threat of eternal damnation. Islam - the texts, the history and the figures therein, not all individual Muslims - is an awful creed. Religion has always been a force for wickedness, but most have redeeming features to their mythology or have contributed goodness to the world in real terms. Islam's texts have no redeeming features. It is a terrible doctrine.
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    (Original post by jape)
    I agree that this attack doesn't appear to be religiously motivated, but "islamophobia" is not a real thing. It's a made-up word that is supposed to pathologise the opposition to a socio-political doctrine that glorifies the basest elements of the human condition and demands enforcement via the threat of eternal damnation. Islam - the texts, the history and the figures therein, not all individual Muslims - is an awful creed. Religion has always been a force for wickedness, but most have redeeming features to their mythology or have contributed goodness to the world in real terms. Islam's texts have no redeeming features. It is a terrible doctrine.
    It is okay to criticize Islam, I have plenty of my own as I saw first hand how it ruined where I am from, Iran. But Islamophobia does exist such that people automatically assume all Muslims are terrorists and ridicule them. That's what Islamophobia is- irrational phobia of Muslims. It is different from criticizing Islam -the religion itself.
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    (Original post by Reformed)
    of course all of this could be coincidence, im not denying thart - im saying it was all jsut odd. perhaps this was a guy who happened to be muslim, happened to go to a tourist area and happened to attack quite obviously non-muslims of western countries that islamist have a complex about. All possible. but then there have been plenty of islamist attacks in this manor that havent been 'just coincidence'
    All I think it that people shouldn't automatically assume that is terrorism and wait and listen to what the police and officials say.
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    (Original post by lahorizon)
    All I think it that people shouldn't automatically assume that is terrorism and wait and listen to what the police and officials say.
    it is inevitable and understandable that the suspicion would be of islamic terrorism, seeing as this is the sort of thing islamist do. youd have to question why the police attempted to deflect form the fact this guy was likely a muslim( and therefore could have islamist influence) and try to spin a suggesting of him being mental. i doubt any officer has the medical training to establish that.
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    (Original post by Chakede)
    it isnt, but the ideology in his background may be
    That's true
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    (Original post by QE2)
    Regarding the mental heath issue, there are a couple of points worth considering.

    1. By definition, anyone who stabs several people, mows them down with a truck, blows themselves up, etc, etc, is suffering from some sort of mental health issues. You couldn't do it if you weren't.

    2. There are thousands, if not millions of people with mental health problems, yet the vast majority of them do not carry out such attacks, therefore, you cannot blame mental illness. (Notice that this is exactly the same argument regularly used to claim that Islam is not involved - although I think it would be a step too far to accuse people who claim mental illness is to blame of racism).
    I disagree with you on 1. Humans can become desensitised to violence and depravity and also be convinced that such violence is for a greater cause or worthwhile. Our history up to this very day is littered with "inhumane" violence justified for the greater good.

    I sort of agree on 2 and think it boils down to exactly what severe mental illness was incumbering the person and how prevalent it was at the time and in relation to the motivation of the attack. We are seeing a lot of governments mixing these terrorist attacks in with mental illness, the Leytonstone knifeman had a psychotic episode in 2006 and they tried to push this as the narrative. The judge dismissed this and ruled he was motivated by ideology and gave him 8 years

    The statement that millions of mentally ill people dont commit such attacks therefore mental illness is not culpable is too simple, imo. There are so many variations in individuals circumstances, in mental illness. I think attacks and the individuals circumstances need evaluating before you can make a judgement on what was mental health and what was ideology. I am just extremely wary that governments and most media will want to push mental health (Or ANYTHING) over terrorism as hard as possible.

    Leytonstone knifeman was also Somalian i believe so lots of parallels already.
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    (Original post by lahorizon)
    Are you actually serious? I personally can't differentiate an Israeli from another races.
    The horns and forked tail, obvs.
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    (Original post by lahorizon)
    If a person is white and murders someone in the street, they are mentally ill. (See Jo Cox)
    If a person is brown and murders someone in the street, they are an Islamic terrorist.
    Jo Cox's murder was clearly ideologically motivated. Therefore, terrorism. Most of the news reports I saw referred to it as terrorism. Perhaps not the Mail or Sun but I don't read them. And the CPS seems to regard it as terrorism as well - "case will be dealt with as a terrorist trial".

    You are aware that there are many murders by "brown people" that are never referred to as Islamic terrorism (even by the Mail and Sun)? Just a quick Google of the last few weeks' news will show this.

    So, in short, you are talking rubbish. Just the same old, kneejerk "ooh, racism" institutionalised victimhood claim that is easily and simply disproved by, erm, just looking at some facts. Perhaps you should try it?
 
 
 
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