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    (Original post by alevelstresss)
    So are the terrorists also following the Quran when it quite clearly forbids aggressive warfare and forbids killing child/female prisoners of war, or when it prohibits terror for ideological purposes?

    If the problem is people cherry-picking what to follow, then the fault is with the people and not the ideology.
    The quoran quite clearly states the verse "All non believers must convert or die". Doesn't sound like a peaceful religion to me.
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    (Original post by KingBradly)
    Why would I acknowledge some baseless rubbish?



    So do you think having calls to prayer blasting over Muslim communities in the UK will make them more or less isolated, more or less integrated, and more or less radicalised? I won't bow down to terrorists and defend or refuse to criticise a belief system which I find utterly abhorrent.




    Yes thankfully many Muslims don't acknowledge the most violent parts. Those parts still exist though, and are worth criticising. Furthermore, while it's true that very few Muslims actually support terrorism, hundreds of millions of Muslims are homophobic, sexist, and antisemitic. Which is up to them, I completely believe they should be entitled to their views. However, I shall criticise them and their religion, as I am entitled to my own views too.
    Because I laid out a clear pathway of how the collective ignorance of people like you alienates Muslims, which makes them susceptible to isolation and therefore more likely to sympathise with radical beliefs. But logic is probably something you have long since thrown out the window.

    And I am against this petition, because it would be noisy and disruptive, not because I want to incriminate Islam with all of my petty life problems - most of which are the conservative government's fault.

    Go ahead and criticise, I encourage religious criticism, but you are hating on it - which is slightly different.
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    (Original post by Harold Godwinson)
    The quoran quite clearly states the verse "All non believers must convert or die". Doesn't sound like a peaceful religion to me.
    so are the 1.6 billion Muslims who have NEVER done this all bad Muslims? especially the ones living amongst us non-believers?

    your logic is flawed
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    (Original post by Harold Godwinson)
    I think church bells sound even better on a summers evening or a spring evening, or an Autumn evening, or a winters evening. This is after all a Christian country. God bless England
    Church bells seem so much better in the autumn/winter months
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    And I bet he won't acknowledge the "All non believers must convert or die" comment. Who's cherry picking now Karl Marx?
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    (Original post by Josb)
    Please don't pollute other threads with your absurd logic. You have your own thread.
    to me, all of your logic is toxic and is alienating young, malleable Muslims in the 21st century - making them more likely to attach themselves to ISIS

    if you think trying to encourage steps towards preventing this alienation and terrorist sympathy is 'absurd logic', then I dread to think what fascist world you would have us live in
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    (Original post by Harold Godwinson)
    And I bet he won't acknowledge the "All non believers must convert or die" comment. Who's cherry picking now Karl Marx?
    Please explain to me whether or not the 1.6 billion Muslims who have not killed a non-believer are true Muslims.
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    (Original post by umar39)
    Church bells seem so much better in the autumn/winter months
    Especially when the snow falls gently on the ground with the bells ringing in the distance.
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    (Original post by alevelstresss)
    Please explain to me whether or not the 1.6 billion Muslims who have not killed a non-believer are true Muslims.
    You don't have to be the one holding the knife or gun to support its meaning.
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    (Original post by alevelstresss)
    Both nationalism and patriotism are stupid.

    Its stupid to focus solely on your own country's affairs when the 21st century shows us that we need to look internationally.
    Its also stupid to unconditionally support your country on everything it does, regardless of its decisions.
    2 words: Saudia Arabia
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    (Original post by Harold Godwinson)
    I think church bells sound even better on a summers evening or a spring evening, or an Autumn evening, or a winters evening. This is after all a Christian country. God bless England
    Idk about you but church bells are incredibly calming/uplifting to listen to (apart from when I'm having a morning lie in). My house in Delhi isn't too far from a mosque and the call to prayer used to irritate the hell out of all of the non Muslims in the neighbourhood to the point the imam was told to get rid of it.

    Good riddance. I have no problem with Muslims praying or whatever. It's just when they act all arrogant and feel like they need to get the special treatment with this kind of call to prayer nonsense in a non Muslim country when it just annoys me.
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    (Original post by Harold Godwinson)
    You don't have to be the one holding the knife or gun to support its meaning.
    Yes but the Quran is crystal clear that all non-believers must die

    Are the millions of Muslims living with, working with, existing with westerners all not true Muslims?

    The Muslim community isn't defined solely by the Quran, its defined by the community as well - and the community in some parts of rural India and Indonesia (to which I have been) did not come out with a hand-axe and try to behead us for our atheism, they welcomed us better than many people in the UK would.
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    (Original post by alevelstresss)
    Please explain to me whether or not the 1.6 billion Muslims who have not killed a non-believer are true Muslims.
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    (Original post by Harold Godwinson)
    Especially when the snow falls gently on the ground with the bells ringing in the distance.
    It's too early for Christmas! You're giving me Christmas vibes
    :claus:
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    (Original post by Josb)

    Or the people who have their families in al-Raqqah and are unable to leave, and have no militaristic leverage to stand up to an armed occupying force.
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    (Original post by alevelstresss)
    Because I laid out a clear pathway of how the collective ignorance of people like you alienates Muslims, which makes them susceptible to isolation and therefore more likely to sympathise with radical beliefs. But logic is probably something you have long since thrown out the window.

    And I am against this petition, because it would be noisy and disruptive, not because I want to incriminate Islam with all of my petty life problems - most of which are the conservative government's fault.

    Go ahead and criticise, I encourage religious criticism, but you are hating on it - which is slightly different.
    Yeh, if you're gonna completely ignore my points and fail to respond to my questions, I really don't see what the point is in discussing anything with you.
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    (Original post by alevelstresss)
    Yes but the Quran is crystal clear that all non-believers must die

    Are the millions of Muslims living with, working with, existing with westerners all not true Muslims?

    The Muslim community isn't defined solely by the Quran, its defined by the community as well - and the community in some parts of rural India and Indonesia (to which I have been) did not come out with a hand-axe and try to behead us for our atheism, they welcomed us better than many people in the UK would.
    I think "Jobs" latest picture post speaks words better then I ever could. And these are the people you try so hard to defend? Child murdering scum? You should be deeply ashamed of yourself.
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    (Original post by KingBradly)
    Yeh, if you're gonna completely ignore my points and fail to respond to my questions, I really don't see what the point is in discussing anything with you.
    hypocrite
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    (Original post by alevelstresss)
    Yes but the Quran is crystal clear that all non-believers must die

    Are the millions of Muslims living with, working with, existing with westerners all not true Muslims?

    The Muslim community isn't defined solely by the Quran, its defined by the community as well - and the community in some parts of rural India and Indonesia (to which I have been) did not come out with a hand-axe and try to behead us for our atheism, they welcomed us better than many people in the UK would.
    Genuine question, have you seen the way Hindus and Christians are treated in countries like Pakistan,Iran,Jordan,Egypt,Turke y and other countries which are heavily Muslim populated? Indonesia is heavily populated with Muslims but at least the government recognises 5 other religions. That's not the case in some of the other countries I've mentioned.

    So do you genuinely think a community of Muslims in Indonesia and rural India can represent ever single Muslim community in the world? That could be an exception for all you know.
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    (Original post by RobML)
    On the other hand, it's peculiar how those most against Islam are those most whose beliefs are most ideologically similar
    I'm not sure if this is true. It might be, but I'm not sure. While it is certainly true that the vast majority of far-right and ultra-conservative people are dead against Islam, I don't think those people make up the majority of people who are against Islam. I myself am pretty socially liberal on most subjects, and I think a lot of people against Islam are too. People like Sam Harris, Christopher Hitchens, Douglas Murray, Bill Maher, Salman Rushdie, Richard Dawkins, Ayaan Hirsi Ali... they're some of the most prominent voices to speak against Islam, and they're all pretty socially liberal, and I think part of the reason they're popular is because there are plenty of likeminded people who support them. I know you may pick out Murray for being a right-winger, which he is, and he writes for the Spectator, but socially he's pretty liberal, and he was very supportive of gay marriage (he is gay himself).
 
 
 
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