Hey there! Sign in to join this conversationNew here? Join for free

Obese patients and smokers banned from routine surgery with the NHS Watch

    Offline

    22
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Vividly clear)
    No it doesn't.

    I actually prefer private healthcare, rather than the socialised crap we have here in the UK, sweden canada and cuba, where it would take me 8 months just to see a dentist just cause it's free
    That's exactly the problem though, dental IS private.

    Posted from TSR Mobile
    Offline

    21
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Observatory)
    Why would it be unlawful to ration NHS care preferentially to Manchester City supporters?
    As the bureaucratic state developed; the common law developed doctrines that bureaucratic powers could only be used for the purposes for which they were conferred and that decisions which no reasonable bureaucrat could have made were invalid.

    Although one can point to examples where these doctrines have been used to thwart decisions which should, in a democracy, belong to politicians, they are very much the exceptions. For the most part these doctrines keep bureaucrats under political control.

    In the case of the NHS the courts will invariably uphold (a) medical decisions to prioritise and (b) a queue; but the courts will see that there is no support in the legislation underpinning the NHS for rationing decisions to be made on any other basis. Neither money nor geography nor support for Manchester City will be permitted to get you priority for NHS treatment.

    On the other hand money will get you to the front of a Home Office queue to obtain a visa and indeed money will buy you a visa and a court will not say that a particular new charging arrangement is unlawful because legislation shows that Parliament tolerates such arrangements.

    Likewise geography will prioritise one child over another in the case of admission to an oversubscribed school because the use of geography is assumed in the legislation.

    Ultimately the decision whether to use the NHS to punish people for disapproves lifestyles and the sort of lifestyles disapproved of, should be a decision for politicians, not some unelected committee in one part of the country.

    Politicians have to have the confidence that bestowing a discretion on a bureaucrat does not give him licence to do as he pleases.

    Few people would disagree with this this. People may differ as to whether, for example, there should be charges for GP appointments, but people are very united that such decisions should be made by politicians not bureaucrats.
    Offline

    21
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Natalierm2707)
    This is difficult because the NHS was formed to treat everyone with no bias or discrimination...
    Of course we expect the NHS to treat people with bias and discrimination

    "I am sorry Mrs Jones, I realise your husband is having a heart attack but Mr Smith and his ingrowing toenail were next in the queue."

    The issue is what biases and what discrimination are acceptable.
    Offline

    1
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by nulli tertius)
    Neither money nor geography nor support for Manchester City will be permitted to get you priority for NHS treatment.
    What about all the NHS postcode lotteries?
    • TSR Group Staff
    Offline

    6
    ReputationRep:
    TSR Group Staff
    If this is the case, then should smokers and obese people be exempt from paying national insurance, and be able to pay less in other taxes?
    Offline

    21
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by dingleberry jam)
    What about all the NHS postcode lotteries?
    That is a media term and in most cases simply identifies more plentiful or better treatment available in some parts of the country.

    Occasionally it relates to some treatments not being routinely funded in particular areas though in all cases a patient can seek funding.

    However no NHS unit can geographically restrict to whom services are provided, and except in medical trials, all treatments are available to all of the population.
    Offline

    18
    ReputationRep:
    I think restrictions on who can access the NHS are inherently wrong, and just push more people towards the private sector. I'm sure there are exceptions, but with things like smoking and obesity it doesn't seem fair at all-
    Both of these are more prevalent in poorer populations,
    Delaying some routine surgeries can lead to worsening of conditions,
    Some conditions cause stress which triggers a person to smoke,
    Some conditions make it harder for a person to lose weight (I'm thinking back injuries),
    This type of policy is certain to lead to poorer quality of life, but not actually certain to have any impact upon these lifestyle factors. It's a very slippery slope to go down; what comes next- underweight, alcoholism?
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by JamesN88)
    Tbh it's particularly harsh on smokers, they pay their fair share in taxes on tobacco for the demand they create.
    Fair shair????
    I pay around £2200 on cigarettes per year...
    I pay around £3450 towards the NHS per year...

    The question people should REALLY be asking is....where are all our taxes going almost....all of a sudden!!???
    Never turn on eachother when the government is clearly always the enemy...and it doesnt even take much to realise that fact. Just a little maths.
    Offline

    1
    ReputationRep:
    Why should we pay for the thousands of idiots like this who destroy their bodies? Especially when it takes care away from those who need it most.

    If you ruin your body with obesity/smoking/drugs you have made your bed, lie in it.
    Offline

    22
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by remiremi)
    Why should we pay for the thousands of idiots like this who destroy their bodies? Especially when it takes care away from those who need it most.

    If you ruin your body with obesity/smoking/drugs you have made your bed, lie in it.
    What about people who are obese because of a medical condition, or addicted because they're on prescribed medication.

    Posted from TSR Mobile
    Offline

    2
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by That Bearded Man)
    What about people who are obese because of a medical condition, or addicted because they're on prescribed medication.

    Posted from TSR Mobile
    Since when was alcohol or tobacco prescribed?
    Offline

    22
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by MeYou2Night)
    Since when was alcohol or tobacco prescribed?
    Can you only get addicted to nicotine (not tobacco) and alcohol?
    Offline

    8
    ReputationRep:
    I never knew the NHS was so based. I applaud them.
 
 
 
  • See more of what you like on The Student Room

    You can personalise what you see on TSR. Tell us a little about yourself to get started.

  • Poll
    Have you ever participated in a Secret Santa?
    Useful resources
  • See more of what you like on The Student Room

    You can personalise what you see on TSR. Tell us a little about yourself to get started.

  • The Student Room, Get Revising and Marked by Teachers are trading names of The Student Room Group Ltd.

    Register Number: 04666380 (England and Wales), VAT No. 806 8067 22 Registered Office: International House, Queens Road, Brighton, BN1 3XE

    Quick reply
    Reputation gems: You get these gems as you gain rep from other members for making good contributions and giving helpful advice.