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Luxury flats rented to council tenants for only £75 a week watch

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    Caspiantiger- why are you so bothered about them getting benefits, nice houses etc. if you want those things so bad then why don't you go and sign on and get a free house and everything else and stay at home all day? no one is stopping you! stop being jealous
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    (Original post by mizfissy815)
    Yeah, council-estates...

    Oh so there is no definitive way to tell?
    So basically, the goodness knows how many pages of vilifying those 'undeserving poor' was based on experiences were all....assumptions? So those of you who b*tched about the people down the street because they're chavs or 'plebs' you assumed they were benefit cheats as they lived in what you assumed were council-estates? Or they got a good house but don't look like they deserve it so the only other explanation is council-house?

    Am I missing something here?
    No, people know where council estaes are. It's since Thatcher's government brought in the right to buy in the 80s many people don't know which houses are council and which have been bought.

    I've heard comments such as, "all people living in council houses are given flat screen tellies and sattelite TV". That's complete crap.

    What many people really mean is they look around their fairly affluent suburbs and semi-rural towns, look at the council estates, see that there are a few with satellite dishes and then assume that those people are council tennants when, in many cases, they own their homes.

    I can walk around the two council estates in my village and tell you which ones are private and which are council. Then we could go inside and actually, you know, talk to the people as human beings. Those of you who unfairly generalise might find your pre-conceptions challenged.
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    (Original post by Caspiantiger)
    mizfissy
    To be honest i don't think it is the duty of the state to help them off the streets. However if we are going to atleast do it in a respectful way. When you give a long term unemployed person a better house than the working man its a disgrace.
    As a welfare state, it kinda is.
    The working man rents/buys the house himself so the gov. can't control what he gets for himself.
    Whilst the unemployed man is being placed in the available council-estate, whether or not it's better than that of some other working person. If some working person chooses to live in a tiny studio apartment, does it make it unfair if an unemployed man gets an normal sized apartment?

    Yes luxury accomodation is rare, but do these people deserve decent accommodation when they are not willing to work for it? Then what do these people do with decent accommodation? they destroy it.
    How do you know they're not willing to work for it? How do you know that they don't actually have a choice but to rely on the council?
    You're just making assumptions and rubbish ones at that.

    I used to be a door to door salesman who worked on council estates i have been into the home of many of the benefactors.

    Mizfissy when i lived in Canada it was rated the best city to live in the world, there were thousands upon thousands of homeless people, they kept them in the same area's and the working man was happy. Its good to see a homeless person around it reminds you why you're getting up at 7am.
    Ah...of course so long as the working man is happy. That's all that matters. Let them homeless people rot.:rolleyes:

    If they commit illegal acts then they will got to jail, jail would be chaper than housing all these people and paying them benefits.

    I think you should only get JSA if you have worked in your life. The JSA is for the working man who has lost his job not a career choice. Benefits for single mothers is much more difficult, many get knocked up for a free house and thus make the problem worse by breeding another benefit cheat of their own.
    I personally feel that the mother should be made to work and the father should give more monetary assistance in raising the child rather than the state, if the mother is widowed and the father dead then they can get state benefits.
    Also depression and other 'illnesses' should not get disability benefit. How can sitting at home in poverty help depression.
    I don't what JSA is but anyway...

    Alright, and then what? They have a child and say they've got no where to go; whether or not it was deliberate (and I highly doubt it) what do you reckon the gov. Let the mother and child remain homeless?

    The doctor has spoken.
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    I do not have problems with giving council housing to those who cannot find a job. This comes from the Daily Mail and it is certainly an extreme case, (hopefully), giving unemployed luxury housing, one that is much better than a normal working-class can get definitely sends out the wrong message, it makes people think, that they can get better housing unemployed rather than working for their own house.
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    (Original post by River85)
    I've heard comments such as, "all people living in council houses are given flat screen tellies and sattelite TV". That's complete crap.

    how can people be so ignorant??? i really don't understand how some people can grow up in a country but have no idea about the basic structure of our society, it seems strange that people can have these backward views. i mean i've never been middle class but i have a good idea bout how they live their lives etc.
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    (Original post by rosemkate)
    how can people be so ignorant??? i really don't understand how some people can grow up in a country but have no idea about the basic structure of our society, it seems strange that people can have these backward views. i mean i've never been middle class but i have a good idea bout how they live their lives etc.
    You tell me. I recently came across such a view on TSR from someone who thought the removal of the 10p tax rate was a good thing as it benefited the (more affluent) majority of the country at the expense of the (less affluent) minority.

    This eventually led into a discussion about people being homeless out of choice. There's tonnes of council housing around, people get sattelite TV paid for, there's also loads of homeless shelters and that have spacious accomodation for all. For those low paid workers who do live in social housing or low value private housing and are working then what's an extra couple of pound a week to them. "What, a couple of lottery tickets less?" :rolleyes:

    I mean, homeless out of choice, get real...

    (Original post by ~|Shock|~)
    I do not have problems with giving council housing to those who cannot find a job.
    OK, I appreciate that you aren't attacking those living in social housing. You are only replying to comments from people that assume all of those living in social housing are unemployed.

    But please remember, many people living in social housing are also working. Just not all in middle class (or even well paid working class) occupations.
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    Can I add also, the reason my mother raised me in a council house, was that she couldn't get a better paid job because my grandparents (grandad = engineer) couldnt afford it. She worked as a secretary and had to rely on my grandparents to babysit me when my Dad ****ed off and couldnt be bothered with his family anymore, whilst paying the minimum child support.

    Just because people come from poor backgrounds, doesnt mean their parents didn't work hard. To be middle class in my grandparents and even my mum's generation, you had to come from a middle-class family where your families status as middle class ran a long way back. Obviously it's easier now if parents encourage their children (as my mum has, hence Im at uni now) so there's not the same hardship, but if people back then found it hard then of course their kids are going to be born into the same lifestyle and if they seem to think their parents are ok living in council houses (as well they might be) then whats to say the kids will move on to own their own properties? However, with the right encouragement, and the suitable amount of peer pressure for people to go to uni, it seems more likely that only those in real need of help and council houses will get it.

    And on a side note - Mum and Dad were married at 18, had me a year later, divorced when I was 4, shortly after Mum gave birth to my sister, Dad disappeared off the face of the earth, only leaving his monthly childsupport in the bank as evidence of his existence. Not all single mums in council houses made up their minds that that was what they were going to do. She grew up in my grandparents council flat, which they have now bought from the council.

    People on here need to grow up and realise there's a reason things are the way they are sometimes, and just because you came from a cushy middle-class family, doesn't mean everyone did.
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    (Original post by Danielle89)
    Can I add also, the reason my mother raised me in a council house, was that she couldn't get a better paid job because my grandparents (grandad = engineer) couldnt afford it.
    Your grandfather was an engineer? I know not all of them are fantasically well paid (believe me, I'm the son of one) but it's still quite a well paid middle class profession.
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    I think people are missing the point here.

    It's not about stereotyping people on benefits but surely it's more about taxpayers' money being spent effectively. Using luxury apartments for this purpose reduces the amount of money that can be used to help unemployed people. It also does set a bad example for those who want to work hard and could discourage those who are unemployed from seeking work.
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    (Original post by River85)
    Your grandfather was an engineer? I know not all of them are fantasically well paid (believe me, I'm the son of one) but it's still quite a well paid middle class profession.
    He worked as a metal-turner and although at the time it was still an averagely paid job, his pay didn't go up until much more recently. When Mum was at uni age there was no way they could afford to send her.
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    (Original post by Danielle89)
    He worked as a metal-turner and although at the time it was still an averagely paid job, his pay didn't go up until much more recently. When Mum was at uni age there was no way they could afford to send her.
    Oh, well that's not an engineer then.

    It's still a skilled job and, yes, fairly decently paid don't get me wrong. I lived next door to a laithe operator who earned more than my father (an engineer).
    Please don't think I'm putting your grandfather's occupation down, I'm not at all.
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    (Original post by River85)
    Oh, well that's not an engineer then.

    It's still a skilled job and, yes, fairly decently paid don't get me wrong. I lived next door to a laithe operator who earned more than my father (an engineer).
    Please don't think I'm putting your grandfather's occupation down, I'm not at all.
    na its fine, I wasnt sure if he was an engineer or not. He had to calculate angles using trigonometry and things apparently. Got an apprenticeship and was always in that occupation.

    My point being it was harder back then to earn enough money for a house of your own unless you were born into some sort of wealth.
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    (Original post by CrazyDancingElf)
    I think people are missing the point here.

    It's not about stereotyping people on benefits but surely it's more about taxpayers' money being spent effectively. Using luxury apartments for this purpose reduces the amount of money that can be used to help unemployedy people. It also does set a bad example for those who want to work hard and could discourage those who are unemployed from seeking work.
    Well, I think partly it is about stereotyping. The OP has done little in this thread. The couple of posts he has made have talked about some vague notion of being "anti-lazy" (therefore suggesting that all council tennants are lazy).

    I don't agree with that final sentence. Again, it's not a prerequisite of getting a council house that you don't have to have a job. I really don't think there'll be many people reading the article thinking, hang on I can't be arsed getting a job. I'll sit on the dole and get myself a luxury flat. If there are then they'll be very disappointed.

    Yes, I agree with you. I still don't really take this Daily Mail article as fact. I think they are just

    Even so, it's one scheme in one part of the country. In all of the other new build estates and housing projects I don't see set amounts of houses being reserved for council tennants.
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    (Original post by Danielle89)
    na its fine, I wasnt sure if he was an engineer or not. He had to calculate angles using trigonometry and things apparently. Got an apprenticeship and was always in that occupation.

    My point being it was harder back then to earn enough money for a house of your own unless you were born into some sort of wealth.
    Yes, sure. It's still very skilled jobs and one that has a mathematical side to it.

    You're right. There was little social mobility in those days. Whatever other peoples opinions of grammar schools I have got them to thank for the social mobility experienced in my family a couple of generations back.

    For those not fortunate enough to go to such schools they were often restricted in opportunities, career and lifestyle.

    Even though my grandfather did go to a grammar school and made that step up in life from his father (a miner), he was still by no means succesful in a career or particularly well off.
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    Her grandad was a machinist, i only class engineers as bachelor or above.... Ideally an engineer should have a masters.

    Trigonometry is simple maths.
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    To put it frankly some of the views expressed in this thread are absolutely disgusting, especially those who brand every council tenant as dirty layabouts.

    Why does it matter whether these people are getting placed in nice accommodation? With the housing markets as they are now I doubt they'd even be able to sell the apartments on the private market anyway, at least someone is getting some use out of them. If they were just being left vacant that's a bigger crime in my eyes.
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    (Original post by Caspiantiger)
    Her grandad was a machinist, i only class engineers as bachelor or above.... Ideally an engineer should have a masters.

    Trigonometry is simple maths.
    I know what an engineer is, thanks given my father was a mechanical design engineer. I just said that laithe operators/metal turners/machinist/CNC turners can be quite skilled job, that's all.

    Although my father doesn't have a degree. I acknowlodge that most people think an engineer requiresa degree (probably including my father) but years of work experience (in my father's case as a design draughtsman) plus previous qualifications (HNC, HND) may compensate.
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    The original article seems like nothing other than an exercise in snobbery. Regulations require a percentage of all new housing projects be made available as 'social housing' for the less well-off - a sensible enough idea.
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    (Original post by fire2burn)
    To put it frankly some of the views expressed in this thread are absolutely disgusting, especially those who brand every council tenant as dirty layabouts.

    Why does it matter whether these people are getting placed in nice accommodation? With the housing markets as they are now I doubt they'd even be able to sell the apartments on the private market anyway, at least someone is getting some use out of them. If they were just being left vacant that's a bigger crime in my eyes.
    Put it this way, you have just bought a lovely flat overlooking the Bristol Channel for nearly half a million then suddenly you find that your new neighbours are only paying £75 a week and also happen to be rather suspicious people. I wouldn't feel safe parking my car there, the damage to your property value would be huge!

    I don't like the state having a monopoly on the construction industry, its disgusting no wonder we are walking into an Orwellian world when you have people supporting such statist projects.
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    (Original post by Tory Dan)
    Put it this way, you have just bought a lovely flat overlooking the Bristol Channel for nearly half a million then suddenly you find that your new neighbours are only paying £75 a week and also happen to be rather suspicious people. I wouldn't feel safe parking my car there, the damage to your property value would be huge!.
    That's because you're an elitist snob. Why the hell should they be "suspicious characters" just because they are council tennants?

    Seriously man, get over yourself.

    But then, you are a Tory :rolleyes:

    Please, the case outlined by the Daily Mail isn't typical. They have picked the most extreme example I'm not even sure if it's even true.
 
 
 
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