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    (Original post by Gremlins)
    Well, no, Germany is half-list, half-constituency-based (and actually does suffer from the problem of party stooges in the Bundes- and Landstags) . Italy, of course, is a shining example of a corruption-free system (:rolleyes:) and is run the way the TSR Tory Party is.
    I understand the German political system very well, probably better than you do, so theres no need for the patronising tone.

    The organisation of the Tory party is very good, we dont need democratic elections for seats because there is no call for it, members know how our party works, we pick the most active members and people who are genuinely interested.

    How about you find something constructive to do e.g. write a bill and stop the ridiculous anti-Tory rhettoric because we've heard it all before for other socialist members.
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    (Original post by sohanshah)
    Nazism started in Germany so surely that can't be a terrible thing...
    .... so did Socialism
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    Dave, just so you know, I haven't forgotten your question, but I can't answer it now as I am at work.
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    (Original post by Metrobeans)
    Dave, just so you know, I haven't forgotten your question, but I can't answer it now as I am at work.
    No worries.
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    (Original post by davireland)
    Im asking, whats the ideological position of TSR Labour party? (sorry about the confusion)
    We are a party that would seek to reform capitalism, not remove it. I don't believe a command driven economy can succeed. A mixed economy, properly regulated is a more productive system which I believe can promote economic growth without increasing social injustice and inequality. This is what we want to work towards.

    Personally, I'd like to see much tighter regulations surrounding employment. I don't think the law does enough to protect workers, especially regarding redundancy and this something I'd like to address in the future. I would also agree with nationalising certain public utilities but I don't see this being achieved in the short run. TSR Labour has shown some commitment to this in passing a bill regulating bus services and when our economy stabilises, we could do some more work in this area.

    Overall, I think the newer version of Clause IV is a better match to our political views. It is a little ironic that this was the point New Labour was born, a party we seek to disassociate ourselves with, however, it is specific policies I object to rather than the ideology as a whole.
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    (Original post by Metrobeans)
    We are a party that would seek to reform capitalism, not remove it. I don't believe a command driven economy can succeed. A mixed economy, properly regulated is a more productive system which I believe can promote economic growth without increasing social injustice and inequality. This is what we want to work towards.
    You are aware that the "free market capitalism - Soviet-style state socialism" dichotomy is a false one, right? What do you think of alternative visions (libertarian socialist models, Market Socialism, Green economics, whatever?)
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    (Original post by 01kij114)
    I should hope we does have an IQ greater than a goldfish. But he certainly dosent come across as an eloquent member, he comes across as an arrogant and over opinioned prat. I only asked him a civil question and he kept trying to be funny.
    Speaking as an arrogant and opinionated prat, I will tell you now that Indie certainly isn't one of us.

    (Original post by Alasdair)
    We elect our MPs on a fully democratic basis. We believe MPs are the mouth of the party, not it's mind or the 'leaders' cronies.
    Whatever your selection process is, it's obviously flawed - after all, it led to the election of Grape to this House.
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    Lol
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    (Original post by Metrobeans)
    We are a party that would seek to reform capitalism, not remove it. I don't believe a command driven economy can succeed. A mixed economy, properly regulated is a more productive system which I believe can promote economic growth without increasing social injustice and inequality. This is what we want to work towards.

    Personally, I'd like to see much tighter regulations surrounding employment. I don't think the law does enough to protect workers, especially regarding redundancy and this something I'd like to address in the future. I would also agree with nationalising certain public utilities but I don't see this being achieved in the short run. TSR Labour has shown some commitment to this in passing a bill regulating bus services and when our economy stabilises, we could do some more work in this area.

    Overall, I think the newer version of Clause IV is a better match to our political views. It is a little ironic that this was the point New Labour was born, a party we seek to disassociate ourselves with, however, it is specific policies I object to rather than the ideology as a whole.
    So would you consider yourself a Blairite then?

    Do you not think that this ideological standpoint isnt prudent on TSR, and that pursuing the 'Third Way' has only aided TSR Socialists, which was demonstrated at the last election?
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    Shush, Dave! Shush!
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    (Original post by davireland)
    So would you consider yourself a Blairite then?

    Do you not think that this ideological standpoint isnt prudent on TSR, and that pursuing the 'Third Way' has only aided TSR Socialists, which was demonstrated at the last election?
    I'm not particularly keen on the phrase. Tony Blair didn't 'invent' the Third Way, nor was he the first politician to implement it in government. I agree with having a mix or compromise between socialism and capitalism, but I'd support more regulation than Tony Blair would. I wouldn't be as keen on PFI's as he was.

    I'd agree with you, the Third Way doesn't seem very popular on this site, which is probably why TSR Labour and TSR Socialist both enjoyed seat increases in the last election.
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    I really doubt we have many Third Way-ers within our ranks, somehow.
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    (Original post by Metrobeans)
    I'm not particularly keen on the phrase. Tony Blair didn't 'invent' the Third Way, nor was he the first politician to implement it in government. I agree with having a mix or compromise between socialism and capitalism, but I'd support more regulation than Tony Blair would. I wouldn't be as keen on PFI's as he was.

    I'd agree with you, the Third Way doesn't seem very popular on this site, which is probably why TSR Labour and TSR Socialist both enjoyed seat increases in the last election.
    Brown believes in the 'Third Way' and encourage more regulation, so would you consider yourself TSR equivalent of Gordon Brown instead? (but obviously without being Prime Minister :tongue: )

    If you agree with me that the Third Way is unpopular then why do you stick to it? Wouldnt it be better to move left and compete with the Socialists?, a battle that you would win because of your name, preach the values of old Labour and label yourself a Socialist party and perhaps you may really compete with us at the next election. Until you do that, I see your party getting squeezed tighter and tighter between the Socialists and the Lib Dems and losing more seats.
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    (Original post by davireland)
    Brown believes in the 'Third Way' and encourage more regulation, so would you consider yourself TSR equivalent of Gordon Brown instead? (but obviously without being Prime Minister )
    No. I'm far more handsome and charming than him! :tongue:

    (Original post by davireland)
    If you agree with me that the Third Way is unpopular then why do you stick to it? Wouldnt it be better to move left and compete with the Socialists?, a battle that you would win because of your name, preach the values of old Labour and label yourself a Socialist party and perhaps you may really compete with us at the next election. Until you do that, I see your party getting squeezed tighter and tighter between the Socialists and the Lib Dems and losing more seats.
    People who are unhappy with New Labour can vote for us, but if they want a socialist party, it would make sense for them to vote for the Socialist Party.

    I'm not going to relaunch TSR Labour as a "pure socialist party" because that's not what we're about. It doesn't reflect the views of the members and we'd be doing an injustice to the people who voted for us. I am happy with the current position of the party and I believe we will continue to take a large number of seats in future elections.
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    You realise Clause IV Mark II begins "The Labour Party is a democratic socialist party", right?

    (Actually I prefer the modern clause IV aswell - it explicitly says they're a socialist party, without tying it down to one strand of socialism, and could be interpreted very radically, if you wanted)
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    Apart from the socialists, has anyone else got a question time thread ?
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    (Original post by 01kij114)
    Apart from the socialists, has anyone else got a question time thread ?
    We have.
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    (Original post by Gremlins)
    You realise Clause IV Mark II begins "The Labour Party is a democratic socialist party", right?

    (Actually I prefer the modern clause IV aswell - it explicitly says they're a socialist party, without tying it down to one strand of socialism, and could be interpreted very radically, if you wanted)
    Our manifesto began with those very words as well. I do wish you'd stop all phrasing sentences along the lines of: "You do realise.... right?"

    Arrogance is a trait I would expect from a Tory, but it is particularly irksome in a Socialist.
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    (Original post by 01kij114)
    Apart from the socialists, has anyone else got a question time thread ?
    At one time everyone expect for the Tories had one. They were very unwilling to have one for reasons which I still fail to understand. Now the PM QT thread is as good as "Ask a Tory".
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    (Original post by Metrobeans)
    Our manifesto began with those very words as well. I do wish you'd stop all phrasing sentences along the lines of: "You do realise.... right?"

    Arrogance is a trait I would expect from a Tory, but it is particularly irksome in a Socialist.

    Sorry, must have got a bit confused. I just guessed that since you said:

    (Original post by you)
    I'm not going to relaunch TSR Labour as a "socialist party" because that's not what we're about
    you may not have realised how clause four begins. My bad.
 
 
 
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