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JAPrufrock
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#141
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#141
(Original post by Anonymous)
I never ever thought id post a thread like this.
Last night, i got very drunk and was split up from my friends in a club. My memory went after that. The next thing I know I'm waking up with a guy who tells me we had sex, tells me i was sick in a taxi, sick on myself, he showered me and then put me to bed.. and then we had sex..
I can't wrap my head around this.. is this rape? I obviously wasn't in a fit state, I never would choose to have a one night stand,
I really don't know what to do.
I don't even know him at all.
I can't stop crying, I feel really odd, like I've never felt how I do right now.

Mod edit: Please note that this is not a debate thread, give helpful advice to the OP only. Unhelpful/unsupportive advice will be removed and you may receive a card
First, I want to say I am so very sorry you had to go through this. You should also know that you're not alone and that there are many resources out there to help survivors. I have been through something similar so feel free to PM me any time.

Yes you were raped. You have to be conscious and coherent to consent. You couldn't even shower yourself! Only a really sick man sees an inebriated woman and decides to take advantage of the situation.

No matter what you decide to do please do not let the cruel world of the internet make you doubt yourself. It was rape and it wasn't your fault.
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SophiaLDN
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#142
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#142
Yes, you were raped. Is there anyone close to you that you could confide in? Or maybe seek some advice through counselling/rape helplines? I really think you should go and get yourself tested to be on the safe side. Sorry this happened to you!

Edit: Wow, disgusted at some of the comments on here. Are you guys for real!?
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eskimo_rising
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#143
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#143
(Original post by anosmianAcrimony)
I consider that to be rape. However, my understanding of the current laws is that drunken consent is still consent, and since you don't remember anything, it would be difficult to prove anything at all.
Correct me if i'm wrong but didn't they very recently tighten this up with legislation to say if your that drunk you can't consent?

OK I found it...
http://tab.co.uk/2015/02/09/the-new-...nk-about-them/

"The new law makes clear behaviour such as staying silent or using contraception does not signify consent.

It specifies consent cannot be given when someone is incapacitated through drink or drugs or when a suspect held a position of power over the potential victim as a teacher, employer or doctor.

And the ability to consent to sex should be questioned when someone has mental health issues, learning difficulties or was asleep or unconscious when the alleged attack happened."

If my source is accurate sounds like this guy could be in a lot of trouble. I think it's been quite a grey area up until recently. Please get help from counsellors via GP's/school and uni and contact a charity that deals with rape. Good luck. x
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LutherVan
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#144
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#144
(Original post by greeneyedgirl)
Consent doesn't have to be a "do you want this?" "yes" although plenty of campaigns say that is a good thing to do. You need to be sure that the person is willingly consenting and enthusiastically wanting to have sex, while being in a fit mental state to do so (in terms of alcohol or age or mental disability etc.)
How are you going to be sure except she verbalises her "No", physically resists or is passed out?

If she is responding, how can you not assume it is consent?
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silverbolt
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#145
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#145
(Original post by theadvisor)
Drunken consent is not consent. If you are drunk you cannot be assumed to be consenting. But seriously trying to prove it in court would probably be a worse ordeal. Relatively few rape cases get to court and even then they are often, but not always, cleared. Hope you feel better soon!

There is loads of counselling/advice available, if you look around.
Sorry no i disagree, there is a difference between drunken consent and so plastered drunk i cant stand, puke down myself and black out drunk

(Original post by Cadherin)
No, it's not - if you're stupid enough to get so drunk that you don't know who you're screwing and cannot recall saying 'no', then it's your own fault.
No its ****ing not.

It is the person who decided to take advantage and rape an almost comatose person. It is NOT victims fault. Period. End of. You are bloody wrong full stop.

She was in a vulnerable situation yes but that does not make what happened her fault. He did not have to rape her, he could have put her to bed and slept on the couch or on the floor. He chose to have sex with her when she was completely and utterly inebriated to the point she couldnt stand or walk.
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silverbolt
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#146
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#146
(Original post by [email protected])
But he was drunk as well so why even though she is drunk and may have said yes does it not count but because he was drunk and like her not thinking straight is he automatically the blame
Yes he might have been drunk but he was clearly no where near as drunk as she was. He able to get her in the taxi, get her out of taxi, get her into the house, get her undressed, shower her, put her to bed and then have sex with her.

His thought process whilst intoxicated were still enough that he knew what he was doing. Not to mention if he had been in the same state as she was, chances are he wouldnt have been able to get or maintain an erection
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Josb
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#147
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#147
(Original post by [email protected])
But he was drunk as well so why even though she is drunk and may have said yes does it not count but because he was drunk and like her not thinking straight is he automatically the blame
She didn't say he was drunk. If he was able to wash her in the shower, he was probably not.
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silverbolt
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#148
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#148
(Original post by Cadherin)
My point is that if she is so stupid to get herself that drunk and consent to sex, then it is her own fault. End of.
Your point is wrong. End of.

From what the OP described she was clearly in no condition to consent. Her attacker should have acted like a real man and put her to bed where she was safe, not stripped her showered her and then raped her.
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TurboCretin
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#149
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#149
(Original post by Cadherin)
No, it's not - if you're stupid enough to get so drunk that you don't know who you're screwing and cannot recall saying 'no', then it's your own fault.
Please be trolling.
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silverbolt
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#150
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#150
(Original post by [email protected])
If not this guy but another guy was so drunk that he didnt know what he was doing and then a girl who wasnt drunk did this. would it be rape?
You mean if he too was at the point of unable to stand, walk, vomit down himself and almost comatose and is STILL able to have sex?
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TurboCretin
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#151
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#151
(Original post by [email protected])
If not this guy but another guy was so drunk that he didnt know what he was doing and then a girl who wasnt drunk did this. would it be rape?
Assuming it's rape in this case, it would still be rape then. Though it might be less morally reprehensible.

Also, fairly unusual that a guy in such a state would be able to have sex with someone, I'd think.
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greeneyedgirl
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#152
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#152
(Original post by LutherVan)
How are you going to be sure except she verbalises her "No", physically resists or is passed out?

If she is responding, how can you not assume it is consent?
Person who has puked down themselves, cannot even shower themselves clean and get themselves home...let's put it this way, if they said "yes" to going skydiving, you'd be sure that they weren't in any fit state to be making those kind of decisions then and there so you wouldn't fly them in a plane and push them out at altitude. Sex is no different to skydiving - if the person clearly isn't able to make the decision then you don't go ahead and do the deed.
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silverbolt
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#153
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#153
(Original post by [email protected])
Well he is drunk enough that is has no idea what he is doing and some girl has just come in wanting sex, and being drunk doesnt affect your ability to get an erection entirely different system
How on earth does a woman who is so drunk shes has vomited down herself, cant speak is barely conciouss and cant get herself into a bed want sex? On what planet is that going to happen?

Have you ever been so drunk that you cant stand, have puked down yourself, dont know where you are, can barely see, cant string a sentence together and yet your single over riding thought is "gotta get me some poon?"

And as for your being drunk doesnt affect erections ya might want to go and do some research on that one.

(Original post by greeneyedgirl)
Person who has puked down themselves, cannot even shower themselves clean and get themselves home...let's put it this way, if they said "yes" to going skydiving, you'd be sure that they weren't in any fit state to be making those kind of decisions then and there so you wouldn't fly them in a plane and push them out at altitude. Sex is no different to skydiving - if the person clearly isn't able to make the decision then you don't go ahead and do the deed.
I really cant fathom why this is such a hard concept for so many of the people on here to grasp?
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greeneyedgirl
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#154
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#154
(Original post by [email protected])
Well you dont know how fit a state she was in it doesnt say she didnt shower herself, and ive seen people throw up and ive talked to them after I they dont seem that drunk (both guys and girls) so if she didnt seem that drunk to him and was saying yes then he would take her skydiving as you put it
Actually she says "he showered me". He = actor in this sentence.

Throwing up in a toilet is very different to throwing up all over yourself and repeatedly throwing up.

Honestly, I would recommend you looking into what consent actually is, so you don't find yourself having raped someone one day.
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greeneyedgirl
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#155
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#155
(Original post by silverbolt)
I really cant fathom why this is such a hard concept for so many of the people on here to grasp?
I reckon it's confirmation bias. They cling onto people who agree with their view and ignore anything that goes against their view...including things like the law, and rape charities and organisations that have spent a lot of time and money making it clear who can and cannot give consent!
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LutherVan
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#156
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#156
(Original post by greeneyedgirl)
Person who has puked down themselves, cannot even shower themselves clean and get themselves home...let's put it this way, if they said "yes" to going skydiving, you'd be sure that they weren't in any fit state to be making those kind of decisions then and there so you wouldn't fly them in a plane and push them out at altitude. Sex is no different to skydiving - if the person clearly isn't able to make the decision then you don't go ahead and do the deed.
Very weak analogy.

Sex is very different from skydiving.

Many people and many couples have sex while drunk everywhere in the world. Some even say the sex is better when drunk. Never heard of any that skydived while drunk.
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greeneyedgirl
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#157
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#157
(Original post by [email protected])
All im saying is when alcohol is involved the term rape becomes more blurred
Oh don't do a Robin Thicke and say there are Blurred Lines or I might just cry.

There are no Blurred Lines - sex without consent is rape. If you're not sure that they can consent then don't do it...there will always be another time you can have sex etc.

This might help you: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/ukne...ape-rules.html
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greeneyedgirl
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#158
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#158
(Original post by LutherVan)
Very weak analogy.

Sex is very different from skydiving.

Many people and many couples have sex while drunk everywhere in the world. Some even say the sex is better when drunk. Never heard of any that skydived while drunk.
There is a difference between drunk and still in control and drunk and not in control. And in these circumstances, it's always better safe than sorry.
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Katalat
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#159
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#159
Hey, first of all don't panic okay? It wasn't your fault and it's nothing to be ashamed of and it should be him who feels ashamed. You need to talk to someone who loves you like a best friend or your mum or if you have a sister etc, just find someone to hug and someone who wants to be there for you. Everything is going to be okay, it's not the end of the world but you need to care for yourself and remember that you are strong because you can't let him win, if you doubt yourself or feel ashamed then he has won and he doesn't define you.
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LutherVan
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#160
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#160
(Original post by greeneyedgirl)
There is a difference between drunk and still in control and drunk and not in control. And in these circumstances, it's always better safe than sorry.
It is better safe than sorry for anyone not to drink so badly they don't know what they are doing and then hold others responsible for helping them decide.

Everyone should learn not to drink to the point they cannot even say "No".
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