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Labour's Exteme Left Shadow Cabinet, no women in top jobs & appoints John McDonnell! watch

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    Waaaaa its sexist to employee peoplebased on sex waaaaa unless it benefits women waaaa
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    (Original post by redferry)
    Well all well and good except he ran on a campaign of promoting women and gender equality, promising 50% women in the shadow cabinet, 'a different kind of politics' as all his promoional material said, only to relegate them to secondary positions.

    Man's a total hypocrite.
    Secondary positions? So, Shadow Defence Secretary, Shadow First Secretary of State, Shadow Business Secretary, Shadow Health Secretary and Shadow Education Secretary are secondary positions? When Corbyn isn't in Parliament, it's Angela Eagle who will be speaking.

    The majority of people he selected are actually women, so he delivered on his promise and exceeded it.

    The media propaganda campaign has begun: "Jeremy Corbyn said he would select, to be in his Shadow Cabinet, 50% women. It's actually 55%. That lying Communist!"
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    (Original post by L'Allegro)
    Your last sentence is just creating a straw man, nothing more. Obviously they do. But you seem to be suggesting that as long as a person has those things, their skills are irrelevant. I say that is equally nonsensical. Sure, a lot of George Osborne's legwork won't actually be done by him. But are you, in turn, suggesting that it is completely unnecessary for the person in charge of a country's economic affairs to have no formal economics training whatsoever? My argument - I can't speak for redferry's - is not that our Chancellor should be a Noble Prize economist. It's simply that nebulous notions like 'team management' are used by government officials as an excuse to just choose sycophants and friends.

    I'd also argue that those who can achieve strong academic results are also likely to have prioritization skills, management skills, as well as a strong understanding of the field they're working in. Just look at how much Michael Gove alienated teachers - a consequence, I would strongly argue, of his complete lack of experience of the education industry.

    Which ones are you thinking of?

    It's possible I'm too easily satisfied with what's been done. I think Eagle has been unfairly denied a role, but I also think that Corbyn has made a satisfactory start. I guess we're destined to disagree on that.
    Considering that Eagle previously worked with the CBI, I think her appointment could indicate that he's aiming to use her experience (and possible connections) to try and get businesses onside. This is especially important considering a key weakness of Corbyn is the way he's perceived as anti-business.

    Also, don't forget that Mcdonnell has significant experience in the duties that a Chancellor may carry out - he managed the £3billion budget of the Greater London Council for several years during the 80s.
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    (Original post by StevePownall)
    You will be fine...
    Really? They replaced a whole chunk of climate change funding with oil and gas funding last year, God knows what theylle do now the lib dems aren't around. Probably burn all the forests for no apparent reason.

    I don't want to have to move abroad :'(
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    (Original post by viddy9)
    Secondary positions? So, Shadow Defence Secretary, Shadow First Secretary of State, Shadow Business Secretary, Shadow Health Secretary and Shadow Education Secretary are secondary positions? When Corbyn isn't in Parliament, it's Angela Eagle who will be speaking.

    The majority of people he selected are actually women, so he delivered on his promise and exceeded it.
    Have you seen why they gave her that position? Simply because they were panicking at the backlash over no women in top positions. How moral.
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    (Original post by redferry)
    Have you seen why they gave her that position? Simply because they were panicking at the backlash over no women in top positions. How moral.
    There was no backlash: Angela Eagle as Business Secretary and First Secretary of State was one of their first announcements. She's also an excellent and passionate speaker.

    The so-called backlash has been created by the propaganda of the mainstream media. 'Top positions' is a useless concept in any case.

    It would also have helped, incidentally, if people hadn't ruled themselves out of serving in the Shadow Cabinet. Corbyn has to select the most talented people possible for each individual position. Notwithstanding this, 55% of the people that Jeremy Corbyn selected are female; 45% are male. I suppose now he's going to be called a radical, feminist tree-hugger because of this.
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    (Original post by xxvine)
    so basically you think its bleak for labour for ever now?
    Pretty much. I think their only true hope is through a coalition government and/or change in the system to PR. If Labour get in via a coalition government it is in their best interests to push for PR, as it'll give the left and centrist parties a very strong position in government. Peter Hitchens pretty much predicted the end for New Labour, was right about the moral decline since neoliberalism corrupted British politics and was right about a large proportion of people becoming disengaged with politics as the Tories and New Labour never really offered much different other than different brands of neoliberalism. Now, the left has seized control of Labour and many want small-c conservatives to do the same with the Tories, which would then give us an actual choice.

    Whilst many do believe Peter Hitchens is a detestable oaf, there is simply no denying that he has been pretty much spot on with regard to all of this, and credit must be given where its due. I disagree with him on many things but on neoliberalism he has been spot on.

    (Original post by StevePownall)
    I agree with most of your response.. apart from this. Trust me, in my time I have worked for Govt, large companies, corporates (some in Europe) and some of the 'process' managers I have worked with have absolutely zero inter-personal /leadership skills, even though they manage teams or departments! A lot of this is down to the leadership style and culture of those companies i.e. the Old Boy Network - and it still exists.. Corbyn Labour?
    I agree that there are managers out there but that does not make them great managers at all. The raw skills I outlined are what separates the best from the rest, quite frankly. As for leaders, which was my initial point, they need all of those skills. Managers are delegates themselves.

    (Original post by StevePownall)
    But Labour needs Middle England and the like, it will never recover from the SNP losses.. especially if Scottish independence comes through. I live near Nuneaton (key marginal) which Labour needs... going by local news, it isn't going to happen with Corbyn.
    True, but it will never get them. Middle England has lost complete faith in Labour. The reality is the best Labour can hope for is a coalition government with the Lib Dems, the SNP and PC. It may also pave the way for PR as a system, which would be long overdue in my opinion.

    I'm a fan of Corbyn because he puts forward the anti-neoliberalism agenda. I am not a fan of Labour as a whole so I'm not living in this delusional fantasy that Labour, even under a Blairite, can go and obtain a majority. I think those days are long gone and its time some tribal Labour voters realised that.
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    (Original post by viddy9)
    There was no backlash: Angela Eagle as Business Secretary and First Secretary of State was one of their first announcements. She's also an excellent and passionate speaker.

    The so-called backlash has been created by the propaganda of the mainstream media. 'Top positions' is a useless concept in any case.

    It would also have helped, incidentally, if people hadn't ruled themselves out of serving in the Shadow Cabinet. Corbyn has to select the most talented people possible for each individual position. Notwithstanding this, 55% of the people that Jeremy Corbyn selected are female; 45% are male. I suppose now he's going to be called a radical, feminist tree-hugger because of this.
    And he failed, another crony in for climate change.

    Christ what a shambles.
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    I think the most qualified should get the job regardless of whether they are a man or a woman. If he only apointed men in senior roles bc they were men and the women were more qualified then imo that is wrong. However if the men were more qualified for the position then it is fair, just bc they are women they aren't automatically entilted to senior roles
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    hmmm, carbon capture, clean and efficient coal technology (power stations), smart grids, nuclear, renewables should all be in the global mix... as a way of responding to climate change. So, fear not, plenty of work around in the UK ......... now back to the topic in hand lol
    (Original post by redferry)
    Really? They replaced a whole chunk of climate change funding with oil and gas funding last year, God knows what theylle do now the lib dems aren't around. Probably burn all the forests for no apparent reason.

    I don't want to have to move abroad :'(
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    Extreme left? Don't know what you're talking about OP......
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    No idea if this has already been said because I can't be bothered to read through 150 posts to check.

    Corbyn's approach to the new shadow cabinet has been to end its hierarchical nature by rejecting the supremacy of any position over others. That means this stuff about him appointing only men in the 'top five positions' is wrong as, to him, there are no top positions. In fact, the changes over history to jobs such as Home and Foreign secretaries as well as Chancellor mean there is no position with any more real power than the others.

    It was Thatcher and Blair who led the way for the cabinet to become less democratic in modern times through small groups (mainly men) making decisions among themselves and forcing the rest of the cabinet to agree. More recently, in the coalition of 2010-15 the cabinet was effectively controlled by the 'quad' of Cameron, Osborne, Cable and Clegg.

    Corbyn has made a cabinet with a majority of women and is treating all cabinet positions in an equal way. It's ridiculous to say that Home Affairs are more important than the provision of education or healthcare. All cabinet jobs should be treated with the same amount of reverence as society is a holistic being which needs all components working properly to function at its best. Therefore we should not be reinforcing the out-dated hierarchy that the cabinet used to be but should instead hail Corbyn's moves as great steps towards democratisation and gender equality in government.

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    The right wing smears are beyond a joke. And people actually argue that our media isn't horrendously biased?
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    More women then men in the shadow cabinet...
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    (Original post by redferry)
    Have you seen why they gave her that position? Simply because they were panicking at the backlash over no women in top positions. How moral.
    I suspect your criticism comes more from a dislike of Corbyn than over a genuine aggrievement with the selection.
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    (Original post by Bornblue)
    The right wing smears are beyond a joke. And people actually argue that our media isn't horrendously biased?
    All they can do is scaremonger because they are yet to come up with an answer to his ideas. A bit like a pub team playing Barcelona and kung-fu kicking the starting XI.
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    I'll just leave this here.


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    'George Osborne has a degree in history. Omg he's not qualified for his position. Wah wah wah! What is even worse is, whilst he doesn't have a degree in economics, which would make him qualified for the role, he also has a penis and that is just disgusting and makes him even more unsuitable for the role. Its absolutely disgusting. We should bring Thatcher back to life and give her the role for equality purposes, its the right thing to do.'

    - A modern day feminist.
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    (Original post by Ace123)
    What are your thoughts on Corbyn appointing an extreme left shadow cabinet. The prime example being the shadow chancellor John McDonnell.

    The Shadow Chancellor has come out in support of the IRA & praised them for their bombings and shootings, “It’s about time we started honouring those people involved in the armed struggle. It was the bombs and bullets and sacrifice made by the likes of Bobby Sands that brought Britain to the negotiating table''

    The Chancellor also supports a 60% tax rate (which as we know was a great success when France did it NOT) & also wants to seize shares from people with no compensation

    http://www.cityam.com/224227/labour-s-lost-it

    When the announcement was made a Labour MP live on air couldn't even believe it was true McDonnell has been appointed

    http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2015...&utm_hp_ref=uk

    There is also the issue that all the top jobs went to white middle aged men
    Corbyn Is far left and what a surprise he appoints far left MP's I would back 60p tax rate it may make up for some of the tax the top 20 percent of the income band evade. If he is the one saying he wanted to go back to the 80's to assassinate Thatcher he is a legend
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    (Original post by StevePownall)
    But Labour needs Middle England and the like, it will never recover from the SNP losses.. especially if Scottish independence comes through. I live near Nuneaton (key marginal) which Labour needs... going by local news, it isn't going to happen with Corbyn.
    I come from Coventry which will vote Labour for all eternity but live in a part of Scotland which has only seen Liberal, SNP and Tory MPs. I can tell you that the SNP were praying for a Liz Kendall to continue to peddle the 'red Tory' label. There are 40-50 seats up for grabs in Scotland which will make the task in England a good deal easier.

    Not just by the numbers, but because if Labour is strong up here it eliminates Tory scaremongering over an SNP coalition, which swayed surprisingly large numbers this year. It would also strengthen the general state of the union, which can't be a bad thing.
 
 
 
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