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The Hezzlington Cooking Blog - A student that eats like a King Watch

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    (Original post by milliemogs)
    You are completely right, overworking is a thing and will make the meat tough and dense
    Have you ever 'overworked' meat before?

    (Original post by milliemogs)
    Also make sure you season well, as well as flavour salt helps to bind the proteins in the meat together.
    What do you mean 'bind the proteins'? Salt breaks down the proteins, not binds them

    (unless you're talking about formed/processed meat)
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    (Original post by milliemogs)
    Yes, which is how I know this. When working meat so much and compacting it together it becomes tough and almost rubber like.

    Yes, the salt breaks them down and the meat is then more able to bind together, this is what the butcher I did some training under taught me anyway.
    You've overworked mince meat...?

    In the context of curing/processed meat, yeah, that would be correct. However, adding salt to meatballs won't help it bind. (it does help keep dough more firm though - but I'm not that into baking)
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    (Original post by hezzlington)
    You've overworked mince meat...?

    In the context of curing/processed meat, yeah, that would be correct. However, adding salt to meatballs won't help it bind. (it does help keep dough more firm though - but I'm not that into baking)
    It's not so much the actual bits of meat that are overworked, it is the ball as a whole. The more you compact and compress, the more you push out any oxygen which creates dense texture.

    The chloride ions in the salt help to produce an almost sticky layer on the meat. Heat then coagulates this layer which keeps the meat bound together.
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    (Original post by milliemogs)
    It's not so much the actual bits of meat that are overworked, it is the ball as a whole. The more you compact and compress, the more you push out any oxygen which creates dense texture.

    The chloride ions in the salt help to produce an almost sticky layer on the meat. Heat then coagulates this layer which keeps the meat bound together.
    http://www.saltassociation.co.uk/edu...-salt-cooking/

    "As a binder, salt helps extract the myofibrillar proteins in processed and formed meats binding the meat together and reducing cooking losses. It also increases the solubility of muscle proteins.
    In sausage making, stable emulsions are formed when the salt soluble protein solutions coat finely formed globules of fat, providing a binding gel consisting of meat, fat and moisture".
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    (Original post by milliemogs)
    I've just checked my theory folder from my old exams which were CTH accredited, what I have said is correct in regards to making meatballs. Chefs I work with use the same method.
    My meatballs break up and I don't use anything but spices, salt and meat.

    If salt is a sufficient binding agent...why do people use eggs?
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    (Original post by milliemogs)
    I never said it was a sufficient agent, just that it aids the process.

    This is why I asked what other ingredients are used, and was going to suggest egg if they don't already use it.Salt helps with the binding, the amount of salt needed to bind it on its own would make the meat too salty to eat. This is why other things are used as well.
    You don't use egg AND salt in sausages/processed meats as a binding agent. You use salt, it works fine.

    In meatballs, salt doesn't bind it together.
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    hezzlington Wow! I have no idea about your age or ethnicity. But these look really nice! Make me feel bad for skipping breakfast and dinner today...

    Edit: You're 23...
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    I also judged you on the brands you used, and I have to say the majority are the same as what my mum uses!
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    (Original post by homeland.lsw)
    hezzlington Wow! I have no idea about your age or ethnicity. But these look really nice! Make me feel bad for skipping breakfast and dinner today...

    Edit: You're 23...
    I'm mixed race, is that important? :eek:

    Thanks!

    I had chocolate weetabix for breakfast. Like a boss.

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    (Original post by hezzlington)
    I'm mixed race, is that important? :eek:

    Thanks!

    I had chocolate weetabix for breakfast. Like a boss.

    Argh it's really hard to say this without seeming racist.
    Ok, well, you look Turkish or Israeli or Eastern European, so this is coming from my assumption
    My mother is Eastern European (Bulgarian) And food and drink is VERY IMPORTANT for us. Sometimes, we eat for two hours, it's part of our culture, y'know. We eat and we drink and we laugh and we enjoy ourselves amongst the food.
    But here in this country the ethnically white British people tend not to care too much about the beauty of food. So...it's just like...

    It's just good to see a young man caring so much about food and healthy living etc.
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    (Original post by homeland.lsw)
    Argh it's really hard to say this without seeming racist.
    Ok, well, you look Turkish or Israeli or Eastern European, so this is coming from my assumption
    My mother is Eastern European (Bulgarian) And food and drink is VERY IMPORTANT for us. Sometimes, we eat for two hours, it's part of our culture, y'know. We eat and we drink and we laugh and we enjoy ourselves amongst the food.
    But here in this country the ethnically white British people tend not to care too much about the beauty of food. So...it's just like...

    It's just good to see a young man caring so much about food and healthy living etc.
    I usually class myself as White or if filling out a form White - Asian, but I'm technically half White, half Pakistani.

    I agree with you Me and my family are the same when we reunite (my Pakistani family).

    And I'd definitely agree with you on the white British people not really caring about food. The amount of times I get called a food snob by friends at uni is crazy.
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    (Original post by jenigma)
    x
    By the way, just curious if you eat Parmesan cheese?
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    (Original post by hezzlington)
    I like mine rough and imperfect because of what I cook mine with. I don't eat pasta that much, so I don't have spag + meatballs.

    My meatballs have lots of spices in them and I make a spicy tomato sauce and serve with eggs on top. It's a Moroccan style dish, so the crumbly, rough texture I prefer, so I don't put them in fridge myself.
    Yeah I make mine the Moroccan way too, I love my spices. No eggs though. I actually kind of like it when mine break up a bit (they don't actually break badly like in half or anything, I just wanted to get them perfect for aesthetic purposes).

    (Original post by milliemogs)
    You are completely right, overworking is a thing and will make the meat tough and dense. What ingredients do you use in them?
    Anything you add like onion needs to be very finely chopped, large bits stop the meat binding.
    Also make sure you season well, as well as flavour salt helps to bind the proteins in the meat together.
    What's the process that makes it tough?

    I think it's part due to the onions too because they're not as finely chopped as I would like! I fry the onion a bit with crushed ginger/garlic before I add it to the meat. I use a lot of spices too, although not much salt at all.

    (Original post by hezzlington)
    By the way, just curious if you eat Parmesan cheese?
    I don't choose it when I shop but I don't mind it when it's in my food which is only really when I'm eating out.
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    (Original post by jenigma)
    Yeah I make mine the Moroccan way too, I love my spices. No eggs though. I actually kind of like it when mine break up a bit (they don't actually break badly like in half or anything, I just wanted to get them perfect for aesthetic purposes).



    What's the process that makes it tough?

    I think it's part due to the onions too because they're not as finely chopped as I would like! I fry the onion a bit with crushed ginger/garlic before I add it to the meat. I use a lot of spices too, although not much salt at all.



    I don't choose it when I shop but I don't mind it when it's in my food which is only really when I'm eating out.
    Its full of msg. White crystals are pure msg. Occurs in some fruits too.
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    (Original post by hezzlington)
    Its full of msg. White crystals are pure msg. Occurs in some fruits too.
    Yep I know. It's in tomatoes, mushrooms, potatoes too. The only difference between naturally occurring and industrially made MSG is that there are contaminants in the latter which significantly affect some people including me. Those are what cause the symptoms and Chinese Restaurant Syndrome
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    (Original post by jenigma)
    Yep I know. It's in tomatoes, mushrooms, potatoes too. The only difference between naturally occurring and industrially made MSG is that there are contaminants in the latter which significantly affect some people including me. Those are what cause the symptoms and Chinese Restaurant Syndrome
    The research has shown that CRS has no connection to MSG, even in people that are convinced MSG affects them. (Paraphrased from wikipedia)

    :dontknow:

    I've used msg before in cooking and its okay, not that magic tbh.
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    MSG is perfectly safe
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    (Original post by hezzlington)
    The research has shown that CRS has no connection to MSG, even in people that are convinced MSG affects them. (Paraphrased from wikipedia)

    :dontknow:

    I've used msg before in cooking and its okay, not that magic tbh.
    Yeah but that's Wiki haha, it's sort of like saying certain allergies aren't real. I know other people who are affected by MSG especially when they feel numbness on their faces, they can't be making it up! Plus the syndrome is real too as my lecturer explained how it affects the human body - glutamate is an excitatory neurotransmitter.

    Exactly, you don't even need it if you can use spices well and know how to cook. It's just a lazy way to enhance crappy foods and make your food taste better.
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    (Original post by hezzlington)
    http://www.saltassociation.co.uk/edu...-salt-cooking/

    "As a binder, salt helps extract the myofibrillar proteins in processed and formed meats binding the meat together and reducing cooking losses. It also increases the solubility of muscle proteins.
    In sausage making, stable emulsions are formed when the salt soluble protein solutions coat finely formed globules of fat, providing a binding gel consisting of meat, fat and moisture".
    LOOOL there's a salt association
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    (Original post by Trapz99)
    LOOOL there's a salt association
    Yeah

    (Original post by jenigma)
    Yeah but that's Wiki haha, it's sort of like saying certain allergies aren't real. I know other people who are affected by MSG especially when they feel numbness on their faces, they can't be making it up! Plus the syndrome is real too as my lecturer explained how it affects the human body - glutamate is an excitatory neurotransmitter.

    Exactly, you don't even need it if you can use spices well and know how to cook. It's just a lazy way to enhance crappy foods and make your food taste better
    r
    The wikipedia article is referenced. MSG has been rigorously tested and no such effects have been found. That's what the science says. Can't really go by anecdotal evidence.

    I disagree. MSG has been used in cooking for over 100 years. It's not a simple case of just chucking it in (this doesn't apply to takeaways/KFC etc - I mean proper Asian cooking). I've never explored umami tastes so I can't really vouch for it. Umami rich ingredients can provide real depth to dishes, and I'd like to experiment with it at some point in the future once my palate is a bit more sensitive.
 
 
 
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