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Does it matter where you get your undergraduate degree? watch

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    (Original post by ppapanastasiou)
    Yes a plate glass university. But how many people do you find from ex-polys doing a PhD or studying at a Masters in Oxbridge.

    I am sorry but you are not convincing me. Surely common sense tells you that University choice as well as many other things are considered, EVERYTHING counts.

    Its like dating, height for men (and probably also for women) is important, denying this means denying the obvious. This does not mean that it is the only thing women look at (they would be very superficial if they did so) but it is one of the things as well as many others (like humor, personality etc.).
    Why do you think I would care? It's irrelevant. I know how it works. Obviously. Other posters know how it works. You have chosen not to believe that. So fine - that' s your choice.
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    (Original post by jneill)
    Ask her if she has rejected an otherwise good applicant because of their prior university.

    And I'm sorry to be the cause of your lack of sleep. That's not the intention...

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    OK I will ask her.

    It was more a figure of speech, but thanks for your concern....
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    (Original post by Reality Check)
    Why do you think I would care? It's irrelevant. I know how it works. Obviously. Other posters know how it works. You have chosen not to believe that. So fine - that' s your choice.
    You do not need to convince me.

    I am just saying that your arguments are not convincing, that is all.
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    (Original post by ppapanastasiou)
    You do not need to convince me.

    I am just saying that your arguments are not convincing, that is all.
    They're not arguments. They're facts. Anyway, I"m bored of it now.
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    (Original post by ppapanastasiou)
    Yes a plate glass university. But how many people do you find from ex-polys doing a PhD or studying at a Masters in Oxbridge.
    Oxford Brookes 17% Masters offer rate at Cambridge.
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    (Original post by Reality Check)
    Why do you think I would care? It's irrelevant. I know how it works. Obviously. Other posters know how it works. You have chosen not to believe that. So fine - that' s your choice.
    This is going to be hard if you continue re-editing your answers. I get confused as to what I am answering.

    How do you know how it works? Are you part of an admissions team? I actually took the effort to ask a professor that does this and she clearly told me it matters. I will also ask her if she has rejected someone because they went to an ex-poly, although I find this redundant as she clearly stated that it matters.

    I mean come on people if you were in charge for PhD or MSc. entry and you had someone with a 2.1 from Bolton and a 2.1 from Imperial you want to tell me that they would be equally weighted, other things being equal. Are you kidding me!!
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    (Original post by jneill)
    Oxford Brookes 17% Masters offer rate at Cambridge.
    Which course? If the course is vocational that might be the case. But if it is a serious science course like physics or mathematics I find this hard to believe, in Oxford Brookes they will have not done enough formal training.

    Also could you please tell me where you get this beautiful information? 17%. Which year, which course? 17% stated like that means nothing.
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    (Original post by ppapanastasiou)
    Which course? If the course is vocational that might be the case. But if it is a serious science course like physics or mathematics I find this hard to believe, in Oxford Brookes they will have not done enough formal training.

    Also could you please tell me where you get this beautiful information? 17%. Which year, which course? 17% stated like that means nothing.
    All courses, last 4 years. FOI request.

    Includes courses in Economics, Finance also Architecture (3 MPhils in Architecture and urban planning to be precise.)

    Oh so now only maths or physics or sciences are serious courses. And you call me arrogant?

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    (Original post by jneill)
    All courses, last 4 years. FOI request.

    Includes courses in Economics, Finance also Architecture (3 MPhils in Architecture and urban planning to be precise.)

    Oh so now only maths or physics or sciences are serious courses. And you call me arrogant?

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    Architecture I can understand as it is a quite practical degree. Finance and Economics I can partially understand as some of these degrees can be less quantitative (I studied Economics so I know). But in a hard core mathematical subject very few ex-poly graduates will make it since they do not usually have the formal training required, this is the sad truth.

    By serious science courses I meant very mathematical, since mathematics is considered by many a pure science degree. Sociology is classified usually as an arts course. So I would call Sociology a serious art course. You just misunderstood me there, but I acknowledge that the choice of words was not optimal. By no means was I trying to imply that math's and physics are more serious courses than other courses.

    Although, I think you can agree with me that Einstein did change considerably the way we view the world compared to the worlds best architect. Would you not agree with me on this?
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    (Original post by ppapanastasiou)
    Although, I think you can agree with me that Einstein did change considerably the way we view the world compared to the worlds best architect. Would you not agree with me on this?
    Stop digging.

    Einstein had a passion for the arts too you know, including architecture.
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    (Original post by ppapanastasiou)
    if you were in charge for PhD or MSc. entry and you had someone with a 2.1 from Bolton and a 2.1 from Imperial you want to tell me that they would be equally weighted, other things being equal.
    Yes, why not? If all other things are equal then why does the name of their university matter at all? Think about it.
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    (Original post by jneill)
    Stop digging.

    Einstein had a passion for the arts too you know, including architecture.
    You did not answer my question. The fact that Einstein had a passion for arts means nothing. The question is: Do you believe that Einstein changed the way we view the world more than the worlds best architect?

    Also you did not answer the question as to if in hard core mathematical sciences in Oxbridge they accept a lot of ex-poly graduates.

    I studied economics and my university had many MSc courses. Some were more qualitative such as Banking and Finance some were quite mathematical such as Finance and Econometrics. In the first course you did find some ex-poly graduates as the level of mathematics required was lower. In the second degree there was not a single ex-poly graduate when I studied. Coincidence I think not! Yes I have a one year sample only! But if you want I can ask my professor for more samples.

    It was also common knowledge that the first course was set up to get money for the university were as the second course was for people who wanted to do be more serious with their studies. I am exaggerating a bit here but you get my point.
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    (Original post by jneill)
    Yes, why not? If all other things are equal then why does the name of their university matter at all? Think about it.
    It would matter because a 2.1 at Bolton is easier to achieve than a 2.1 at Oxbridge. Think about it!

    I know this because I did it! I first went to an ex-poly and in the first year I got a first with almost no effort. When I changed to the respectable university I could barely sustain a 2.1 with double the effort! Coincidence I think not!

    And yes I know you will start arguing that you can not compare the first year from an ex-poly with that of a well established university because of the different level of students they attract. But still when I compare today what I learned in the end of my degree compared to my former classmates from the ex-poly, it is like night and day, especially when it comes reading and understanding highly academic papers, which is what research is all about.
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    (Original post by ppapanastasiou)
    You did not answer my question. The fact that Einstein had a passion for arts means nothing. The question is: Do you believe that Einstein changed the way we view the world more than the worlds best architect?
    What Einstein did is utterly irrelevant to this conversation.

    Except that he went to a poly.

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    If you walked into a shop and 2 shirts were the same price at lets say £15.
    A hugo boss one was heavily discounted to £15 and an ordinary debenhams one is the same price
    You would pick the Hugo Boss one, the same ideology applies to this
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    (Original post by jneill)
    What Einstein did is utterly irrelevant to this conversation.

    Except that he went to a poly.

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    Again you are not answering my question. Why? What are you afraid of ?

    I believe it is very relevant to this conversation. Just answer the question and you will see why it is so relevant.
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    (Original post by ppapanastasiou)
    It would matter because a 2.1 at Bolton is easier to achieve than a 2.1 at Oxbridge. Think about it!

    I know this because I did it! I first went to an ex-poly and in the first year I got a first with almost no effort. When I changed to the respectable university I could barely sustain a 2.1 with double the effort! Coincidence I think not!

    And yes I know you will start arguing that you can not compare the first year from an ex-poly with that of a well established university because of the different level of students they attract. But still when I compare today what I learned in the end of my degree compared to my former classmates from the ex-poly, it is like night and day, especially when it comes reading and understanding highly academic papers, which is what research is all about.
    Get off your high horse. First of all we have no ways of verifying your claims of experience.

    I also went to a ex poly, and i worked my little socks off, to achiece my 2.1.

    Does that mean that i would have failed to get this at a better uni, probably.

    But does it mean that this grade is somehow worse that a 2.1 from a uni higher up the ranks? Not at all.

    We don't all have the luxury of having attended top sixth forms, some of us find ourselves on the streets at nineteen, and have to work our ways up from there.

    i have already said that it is virtually impossible to read for a degree from the streets, this point remains.

    And you also find that two birds of a feather, ignorant and arrogant people stick together at these places. I actually shudder to think how far up your own heads most of the alumini and academics must be at the 'top' institutions, given that one of your people said i am a traitor to my race, having married a black woman.

    Well more fool him, for believing this. And more fool you for thinking that university is the critical factor in determining p_g applications!
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    (Original post by john2054)
    Get off your high horse. First of all we have no ways of verifying your claims of experience.

    I also went to a ex poly, and i worked my little socks off, to achiece my 2.1.

    Does that mean that i would have failed to get this at a better uni, probably.

    But does it mean that this grade is somehow worse that a 2.1 from a uni higher up the ranks? Not at all.

    We don't all have the luxury of having attended top sixth forms, some of us find ourselves on the streets at nineteen, and have to work our ways up from there.

    i have already said that it is virtually impossible to read for a degree from the streets, this point remains.

    And you also find that two birds of a feather, ignorant and arrogant people stick together at these places. I actually shudder to think how far up your own heads most of the alumini and academics must be at the 'top' institutions, given that one of your people said i am a traitor to my race, having married a black woman.

    Well more fool him, for believing this. And more fool you for thinking that university is the critical factor in determining p_g applications!

    Isn't this slightly contradictory?
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    (Original post by Jagwar Ma)
    Isn't this slightly contradictory?
    in what way?
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    (Original post by john2054)
    in what way?
    Why would you of failed achieve a 2:1 at a better university?
 
 
 
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