Do you think we should abolish private schools? Watch

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ParetoOptimum
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#161
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#161
(Original post by Shruti Rustagi)
It's not about abolishing public schools but according to me it's more about the mindset that "the poor go to public schools and the education differs"
As soon as this mindset is changed the work is done..no need to argue on this topic anymore...as simple as it is..
on the other hand the fact is that 90% of childern {india} would prefer going to private school just for repo..
:devil3:.. horrible to hear but true..I myself have seen my friends make faces on the name of government schools...
Coming back to the point abolishing public schools will not do any wonders..one who doesnt wanna study in public school has many more alternatives.."abroad" probably.. so why taking so much effort to abolish them and also kicking off many stomachs.. and overcrouding public schools..
Just so you know, 'public schools' in the UK refers to the elite tier of private schools e.g. Eton, Harrow, Rugby, Westminster etc

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Public_...nited_Kingdom)
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Shruti Rustagi
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#162
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#162
I am not talking about any public school in particular..India too has many public schools like IIT which anyone would feel privilidged to visit.. the point is hat there is no need as such to abolish private schools coz its not of any harm.. ohk
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MindTheGaps
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#163
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#163
(Original post by Ripper-Roo)
I can buy a house in whatever area I like, providing I can afford it.
And someone can spend his money on his child's education all he likes, providing he can afford it.

Ignoring the moral aspect this would simply cease to be a debate.
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Tax Slave
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#164
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#164
Capitalism was invented by the elite to control the population by bribing successful companies to turn people into sheep. Private schools are at the heart of this and must be abolished as a result.
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Funtry
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#165
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#165
(Original post by Mackay)
This.

I live in Bedfordshire where there is quite a big private-school culture, but the state school I attended got better results than all of them for GCSE and A-Levels.
Which School did you go to? I went to one of the private school's (Harpur Trust) and we always got better results than the states.
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Ripper-Roo
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#166
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#166
(Original post by Rinsed)
And someone can spend his money on his child's education all he likes, providing he can afford it.
I never said they couldn't? Just that I wouldn't
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MindTheGaps
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#167
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#167
(Original post by Ripper-Roo)
I never said they couldn't? Just that I wouldn't
You seem to delight in ignoring the point.

Not just I have called you out on the idea that buying your way into a good catchment area is morally superior to paying for education directly, and you have conspicuously not responded to this point. I'm going to assume this is simply because you don't have any good response.
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Mackay
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#168
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#168
(Original post by Funtry)
Which School did you go to? I went to one of the private school's (Harpur Trust) and we always got better results than the states.
Sharnbrook about five years back now, it might have changed but when I was there we had the best results in the county.
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Funtry
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#169
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#169
(Original post by Mackay)
Sharnbrook about five years back now, it might have changed but when I was there we had the best results in the county.
I thought it may have been, and my Dad did give me the option to go there in year 8, but I didn't want to as all my mates were at the school I was at. I left last year, and I'm pretty sure that the 3 main HT schools have been above Sharnbrook recently, maybe not the Girls' school though.
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mxcs
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#170
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#170
Speaking from personal experience:

I went to a private school for most of my life and can say from experience that the private school system is incredibly outdated and really isn't worth the money you pay for it in most cases.

I found that bullying was much worse since especially at the secondary school level, students spend a large amount of time away from tutors and teachers, so there are lots of opportunities for some pretty awful verbal and physical bullying. Bullying was a huge problem at mine, as there was a divide between the 'rich' and 'poor' students - kids would get bullied for not having expensive phones/games consoles/clothes/etc. If you didn't live in the 'rich' part of town, you got bullied - some kids are raised with this idea that their privileged upbringing makes them superior to others and it was awful some of the old-fashioned, racist, sexist, generally terrible narrow-minded views they were brought up with - and still held when they left at 18.

Much of the syllabus is outdated as well - who needs to do 2 hours of sports every day, unless you're training for a PE A-level or being a professional athelete? Also there is little to no chance to study any art-based subjects. I currently study Fashion in uni and there was no chance to do subjects like textiles which would have given me a huge advantage - instead I had to take adult learning classes on this later on.

I got quite bad grades studying at private school because the bullying affected me so much and I couldn't keep up with the maths and science subjects that I struggled with but was forced to take anyway. I missed all of Year 10 because the bullying situation was so bad and instead did Year 11 at a state school - I made some lovely friends, got to spend much of my time doing Art and Photography and got As and Bs instead of Ds and Es, which I was originally predicted at the private school.

Conclusion: some kids suit private school, but good state schools offer many more opportunities in terms of subject choice and qualifications available, as well as a better presence of staff so bullying is less likely to take place.
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Ripper-Roo
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#171
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#171
(Original post by Rinsed)
You seem to delight in ignoring the point.

Not just I have called you out on the idea that buying your way into a good catchment area is morally superior to paying for education directly, and you have conspicuously not responded to this point. I'm going to assume this is simply because you don't have any good response.
Or because I have better things to do than debate something I don't care about?
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Cal97g
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#172
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#172
(Original post by Le Nombre)

That would presumably mean giving everyone legal aid for legal issues, I can't see any other potential source for this than taxation.

Given the cost of lawyers in fields such as employmeny, family, pensions, property and all the other fields which affect the general public this is going to get very expensive. If you say companies should all have the right to equal legal representation too it's going to get ridiculous.
I said nothing about legal representation, only legislation. Some lawyers are better than others, deal with it.
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Le Nombre
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#173
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#173
(Original post by Cal97g)
I said nothing about legal representation, only legislation. Some lawyers are better than others, deal with it.
Well then that's not real equality before the law is it. That's like me declaring I've given everyone access to world class healthcare by building hundreds of state of the art hospitals around the country, just you have to pay for your own doctors, nurses, radiographers etc. to allow you to make any real use of them.

I know, I am one, I hope I'm better than others, otherwise my clients will start getting uppity about my hourly rate, but I'm well aware that I contribute to inequality before the law.
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JamesTheCool
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#174
(Original post by Cal97g)
Lol'd
Presumably at me, not with me. It's not supposed to be funny, it's supposed to make you think, but obviously whenever a person actually speaks their mind these days they end up being locked away as some circus freak, so that happy, no-thinking consumers like you can laugh at us...
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Mackay
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#175
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#175
(Original post by Funtry)
I thought it may have been, and my Dad did give me the option to go there in year 8, but I didn't want to as all my mates were at the school I was at. I left last year, and I'm pretty sure that the 3 main HT schools have been above Sharnbrook recently, maybe not the Girls' school though.
Yeah I heard somewhere that Sharnbrook was marked 'good' by Ofsted rather than 'outstanding' for the first time last year. Seems to be going downhill!
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heshop
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#176
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#176
Even if you did abolish them I think you'll still have some degree of inequality because wealthy parents can still afford private tutors, extra materials etc. I went to a comprehensive and although I did very well, this was mostly due to the fact that I had private tutors for almost every subject that I was even slightly struggling with.

The whole system is completely flawed anyway in my opinion. Disruptive students need to be permanently removed from a classroom within a few lessons of misbehavior. Also, funds need to be reallocated desperately; how the hell did it get to the point where our music department was buying new macbooks when the maths department couldn't afford to print off revision materials for our GCSEs? This is from an "outstanding" rated school. Problems like this don't even need much money to fix, just common sense.

I also agree with the other poster about schools being more selective too, at least internally. The number of occassions that my time has been competely wasted by teachers have to teach other students basic numeracy or literacy instead of the higher end of the syllabus was staggering. I remember being told several times "if you want to get an A or B, you'll have to teach this topic to yourself". You simply can't ask people to send their children to comprehensives that are as dysfunctional as my "outstanding" one if they have the money to go private.
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JamesTheCool
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#177
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#177
(Original post by heshop)
Even if you did abolish them I think you'll still have some degree of inequality because wealthy parents can still afford private tutors, extra materials etc. I went to a comprehensive and although I did very well, this was mostly due to the fact that I had private tutors for almost every subject that I was even slightly struggling with.

The whole system is completely flawed anyway in my opinion. Disruptive students need to be permanently removed from a classroom within a few lessons of misbehavior. Also, funds need to be reallocated desperately; how the hell did it get to the point where our music department was buying new macbooks when the maths department couldn't afford to print off revision materials for our GCSEs? This is from an "outstanding" rated school. Problems like this don't even need much money to fix, just common sense.

I also agree with the other poster about schools being more selective too, at least internally. The number of occassions that my time has been competely wasted by teachers have to teach other students basic numeracy or literacy instead of the higher end of the syllabus was staggering. I remember being told several times "if you want to get an A or B, you'll have to teach this topic to yourself". You simply can't ask people to send their children to comprehensives that are as dysfunctional as my "outstanding" one if they have the money to go private.
Hopefully if your kids are like you then they'll have the right attitude about their education anyway, in which case you won't need to shell out horrendous amounts of money towards them so they can mingle with kids named Rupert and Will.
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JamesTheCool
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#178
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#178
(Original post by mxcs)
Speaking from personal experience:

I went to a private school for most of my life and can say from experience that the private school system is incredibly outdated and really isn't worth the money you pay for it in most cases.

I found that bullying was much worse since especially at the secondary school level, students spend a large amount of time away from tutors and teachers, so there are lots of opportunities for some pretty awful verbal and physical bullying. Bullying was a huge problem at mine, as there was a divide between the 'rich' and 'poor' students - kids would get bullied for not having expensive phones/games consoles/clothes/etc. If you didn't live in the 'rich' part of town, you got bullied - some kids are raised with this idea that their privileged upbringing makes them superior to others and it was awful some of the old-fashioned, racist, sexist, generally terrible narrow-minded views they were brought up with - and still held when they left at 18.
That's interesting to note that you've found private school kids responsible for bullying kids who are poorer than them. I went to a state school where I was teased for apparently being too posh (I'm from an ordinary low-income household and I just happen to be posh-voiced). Still, I can also imagine being ostracised by posh kids too. Having been to an ordinary state school and a Russell Group university, I've found that both ends of the class spectrum tend to hate my guts for opposite reasons and completely shun me from ever daring to join their proud little cliques, lol.
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mojojojo101
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#179
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#179
(Original post by JamesTheCool)
That's interesting to note that you've found private school kids responsible for bullying kids who are poorer than them. I went to a state school where I was teased for apparently being too posh (I'm from an ordinary low-income household and I just happen to be posh-voiced). Still, I can also imagine being ostracised by posh kids too. Having been to an ordinary state school and a Russell Group university, I've found that both ends of the class spectrum tend to hate my guts for opposite reasons and completely shun me from ever daring to join their proud little cliques, lol.
I've been teased both for being too posh and too poor, although I will say that these days I tend to shy away from telling people I went to private school and live in rural Surrey because 9 times out of 10 I'm going to get judged for it, even going to the job centre a couple of years ago I got the distinct impression that some of the people who worked their thought I was too posh to be there.

On topic: Why would you decide to destroy the best schools in the country in an attempt to improve education? It's not going to happen, it will only make the education system in this country even worse. The answer is not to ban [private schools, the answer is to improve state schools so that they are operating at an acceptable level. To be honest though this kind of rank stupidity is so prevalent in this country I could see it happening.
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beckaroo7
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#180
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#180
I didn't go to a private school myself but if and when I have children I want to send them to a private school. It isn't fair but it never truly will be.
Some people are going to be brought up with advantages that others don't have.
I do think state schools should be better though. The one I went to was good but some are appalling from what I've heard and read about

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