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    (Original post by theonlymrsholmes)
    don't, one of my worst fears in life is i will fall in love with a gay man and well i won't ever have him :cry:

    It looks likely, my past (internet crushes) have all been gay such as tamal from gbbo, ugh that gorgeousness! And owen jones...gay! and the most recent one sam curry from the apprentice has been featured in the gay times continiously but i am praying on all my grapes he isn't gay! Because that will make me sad

    look at all this beautifulness, just absolute beautifulness...



    my heart melted a bit....
    muwahaha
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    (Original post by ivybridge)
    muwahaha
    Ugh I literally can't watch that gif because it's too beautiful
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    (Original post by iAre Teh Lejend)
    Yeah I agree with you entirely on what you intend to support, just not the way you support it. It's not a religious thing, or cultural, it's just a natural reaction. Like I said, I have gay friends, so I would be a bigot if I hated gay people

    It's just stupid and bigotry for people to class me as homophobic because I have a natural reaction to turn away when seeing homosexual activity, these are the same people who say homosexuality is a natural thing too. So in their logic, I'm naturally homophobic ? so It's okay to be homophobic ? They're not only bigots, but also contradicting themselves.

    Hope this makes sense, and thank you for sticking up for me, appreciate it.
    You sure it's natural man? I mean personally, any aversion felt by people is probably cultural and conditioned really. For example, I'm straight and have no problem seeing two men kiss, I just don't get turned on by it. When I was religious years ago, and felt the peer pressure of those around me, it's almost some weird compulsion to feel sickened by any expressions of gay affection. I'm assuming you don't feel sickened by two women kissing right? That's also gay, so it's not the 'gayness' as such, just the fact that all that surrounds men, be it not to be a sissy and be 'gay' because that's 'bad', and the fact that you're not used to it and have a learned response for when it does happen, means to you it almost feels like second nature.

    I bet if you just exposed yourself more to it (just affection, not porn) you'd be less bothered by it. Just my two cents.
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    (Original post by ivybridge)
    There's a fundamental difference between having an opinion and having an opinion you know to be harmful to others and still voicing it. If somebody ran around saying we should shoot black people, calling them ******* and so on, I firmly believe you would not be spouting the same crap you are now.

    People "running around saying we should shoot black people, calling them ******" are uncivil and disrespectful. However, someone who hold a personal belief that is biased against black people still have the right to that opinion [as long as their opinion does not manifest as harassment of any kind]. You cannot jerk it away because you don't like it or the majority don't like it. That's oppressive.

    Any opinion can harm anyone. Should we just stop talking then? Stating your opinion whilst being respectful of everyone around you is perfectly ok. If they take offensive, well, they can debate about it. Have a fight.Agree to disagree. Not talk to each other ever again. Whatever. As the saying goes: "offense is taken"
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    (Original post by Danz123)
    You sure it's natural man? I mean personally, any aversion felt by people is probably cultural and conditioned really. For example, I'm straight and have no problem seeing two men kiss, I just don't get turned on by it. When I was religious years ago, and felt the peer pressure of those around me, it's almost some weird compulsion to feel sickened by any expressions of gay affection. I'm assuming you don't feel sickened by two women kissing right? That's also gay, so it's not the 'gayness' as such, just the fact that all that surrounds men, be it not to be a sissy and be 'gay' because that's 'bad', and the fact that you're not used to it and have a learned response for when it does happen, means to you it almost feels like second nature.

    I bet if you just exposed yourself more to it (just affection, not porn) you'd be less bothered by it. Just my two cents.
    I don't feel sickened by two women kissing, you are right. But I do not need to expose myself more to it, I'm fine the way I am, there's nothing wrong with me
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    (Original post by Eigo-Jin)
    People "running around saying we should shoot black people, calling them ******" are uncivil and disrespectful. However, someone who hold a personal belief that is biased against black people still have the right to that opinion [as long as their opinion does not manifest as harassment of any kind]. You cannot jerk it away because you don't like it or the majority don't like it. That's oppressive.

    Any opinion can harm anyone. Should we just stop talking then? Stating your opinion whilst being respectful of everyone around you is perfectly ok. If they take offensive, well, they can debate about it. Have a fight.Agree to disagree. Not talk to each other ever again. Whatever. As the saying goes: "offense is taken"
    But they can't though? Saying I think blue is a beautiful colour isn't going to offend or harm anyone. Saying I think Action Men are amazing toys is not harmful.
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    (Original post by iAre Teh Lejend)
    I don't feel sickened by two women kissing, you are right. But I do not need to expose myself more to it, I'm fine the way I am, there's nothing wrong with me
    It is legitimate prejudice! How are you so blind.
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    (Original post by ivybridge)
    It is legitimate prejudice! How are you so blind.
    I'm finished talking to you mate.
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    (Original post by iAre Teh Lejend)
    I'm finished talking to you mate.
    I was talking at you, not to you and I'm not your 'mate', lololol. You're just a typical heterosexual bigoted male:

    "Oh lesbians, omg omg omg yum"
    "Gay men together - nah mate, ew"
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    (Original post by ivybridge)
    I was talking at you, not to you and I'm not your 'mate', lololol. You're just a typical heterosexual bigoted male:

    "Oh lesbians, omg omg omg yum"
    "Gay men together - nah mate, ew"
    Continue to display your immaturity, surely you are only embarrassing yourself
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    (Original post by Danz123)
    I'm not saying I can sway the entire world into my line of thinking, I'm saying it's perfectly rational to be intolerant of those who hold racist and homophobic views. There SHOULD be zero tolerance when it comes to that sort of thing. I mean schools talk about such policy all the time. They're intolerant of any such views. Even the law is intolerant of such views for Christ's sake, so when you say people should respect racism and homophobia, you're saying the law, as well as other institutions such as schools and hospitals, are all bigoted in this country. Now, do you really believe that?

    Also, if you want to compare problems of bigotry and who's really affected by such intolerance, look at gay bashing. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gay_bashing THESE are the people we need to help, as well as other minorities. They're the ones who suffer the most under such intolerance of who they are and their actions. If we're going to talk about bigotry then we need to include context and the history of how the gay community was and still is persecuted.

    I'm not saying that I/anyone should respect racism or homophobia. I just believe that we should respect that people have their opinions, whether it is popular or not. I do not condone racism or homophobia, especially when it is verbal or physical myself but I understand that everyone has their own opinion for whatever reason and they should not be persecuted for it.

    It's true that anyone suffering persecution should be helped but trying to solve it through harassment of the opposite group is not the way to go.
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    (Original post by iAre Teh Lejend)
    Continue to display your immaturity, surely you are only embarrassing yourself
    You're just branding everything against your points as immature like its effective. Understand that it is far from.
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    (Original post by iAre Teh Lejend)
    I don't feel sickened by two women kissing, you are right. But I do not need to expose myself more to it, I'm fine the way I am, there's nothing wrong with me
    Yeah but therein lies the hypocrisy. Two women kissing is just as gay as two guys kissing, but many men seem to be absolutely fine with the former, so obviously 'gayness' is not the problem here, it's being able to view such people as sexual objects. We do that with women as straight guys, not so much with men. This means we won't be turned on by them kissing, however to go a step further and find it sickening comes from something else entirely. It comes from the cultural norms surrounding men and us expected to be 'straight' and macho etc. Our self-worth is seemingly tied in with being a playaaa and attracting women, as well as being good in bed. How many times have you heard gay guys considered 'not real men' or 'pussies' or 'sissies' or 'nancy boys'? This is where such aversion comes from, where it's only designated toward two men and not two women. I mean, why not explore that? Why be fine with that conditioned feeling of aversion? Opening your mind to it all and finding the root causes would be beneficial I think. Just some advice.
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    (Original post by ivybridge)
    But they can't though? Saying I think blue is a beautiful colour isn't going to offend or harm anyone. Saying I think Action Men are amazing toys is not harmful.
    You obviously don't know how crazy the world can be. Actually, I was referring to social and political opinions especially.
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    (Original post by Eigo-Jin)
    You obviously don't know how crazy the world can be. Actually, I was referring to social and political opinions especially.
    How do you honestly conclude that about my knowledge of the world from what I just said? What even...
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    (Original post by Danz123)
    Yeah but therein lies the hypocrisy. Two women kissing is just as gay as two guys kissing, but many men seem to be absolutely fine with the former, so obviously 'gayness' is not the problem here, it's being able to view such people as sexual objects. We do that with women as straight guys, not so much with men. This means we won't be turned on by them kissing, however to go a step further and find it sickening comes from something else entirely. It comes from the cultural norms surrounding men and us expected to be 'straight' and macho etc. Our self-worth is seemingly tied in with being a playaaa and attracting women, as well as being good in bed. How many times have you heard gay guys considered 'not real men' or 'pussies' or 'sissies' or 'nancy boys'? This is where such aversion comes from, where it's only designated toward two men and not two women. I mean, why not explore that? Why be fine with that conditioned feeling of aversion? Opening your mind to it all and finding the root causes would be beneficial I think. Just some advice.
    I did not say it's fine to display pictures of females kissing to support homosexuality. If you read back on my post, I speaking from a neutral perspective. Your going off topic now. Read my OP again.
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    (Original post by Danz123)
    Yeah but therein lies the hypocrisy. Two women kissing is just as gay as two guys kissing, but many men seem to be absolutely fine with the former, so obviously 'gayness' is not the problem here, it's being able to view such people as sexual objects. We do that with women as straight guys, not so much with men. This means we won't be turned on by them kissing, however to go a step further and find it sickening comes from something else entirely. It comes from the cultural norms surrounding men and us expected to be 'straight' and macho etc. Our self-worth is seemingly tied in with being a playaaa and attracting women, as well as being good in bed. How many times have you heard gay guys considered 'not real men' or 'pussies' or 'sissies' or 'nancy boys'? This is where such aversion comes from, where it's only designated toward two men and not two women. I mean, why not explore that? Why be fine with that conditioned feeling of aversion? Opening your mind to it all and finding the root causes would be beneficial I think. Just some advice.
    Hm, never really thought about it quite like that. Good point.
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    (Original post by iAre Teh Lejend)
    I did not say it's fine to display pictures of females kissing to support homosexuality. If you read back on my post, I speaking from a neutral perspective. Your going off topic now. Read my OP again.
    How? You are not neutral at all.
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    (Original post by ivybridge)
    How do you honestly conclude that about my knowledge of the world from what I just said? What even...
    Believe me, there are people out there that will get offended if you state a preference on just about anything. There are 7.2 billion of us after all.
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    (Original post by Eigo-Jin)
    I'm not saying that I/anyone should respect racism or homophobia. I just believe that we should respect that people have their opinions, whether it is popular or not. I do not condone racism or homophobia, especially when it is verbal or physical myself but I understand that everyone has their own opinion for whatever reason and they should not be persecuted for it.

    It's true that anyone suffering persecution should be helped but trying to solve it through harassment of the opposite group is not the way to go.
    I respect that people can have opinions, and their right to hold them sure, but that does not mean I respect the opinions themselves. I find racism and homophobia as well as other types of discrimination absolutely deplorable. Persecution is the wrong word as it's systematic mistreatment of an individual/group by another individual/group. It's more akin to oppression tbh, so that would be hyperbole. I'm sorry but a racist or homophobe will be judged for expressing THEIR OWN persecution at others. What we judge and condemn here is the unjust persecution itself, and by extension the morals of the person, rather than just blindly attacking the person.

    Noone is advocating harrassment... I don't see where you got that from, the word was not even mentioned.
 
 
 
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