OCR GCSE Classical Greek

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    That was a hard paper imo It was all going well until the second paragraph in the translation That was so weird... any ideas on grade boundaries....?

    (Original post by meme259)
    What did people get for the bit just before 'therefore the assembly decided..'- the part about the barber saying he knew nothing about the foreigner, but they didn't believe him?
    I put " When having replied [which I think is wrong and should have been replying] he said that he knew nothing about the foreigner, they didn't believe the story".... it totally doesn't make sense in English and I'm so confused ahhhhh.....

    Also the first sentence about calling the assembly... I put "The magistrates having been called into the assembly immediately.." how many marks will I lose do you think?
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    (Original post by fuzz13)
    That was a hard paper imo It was all going well until the second paragraph in the translation That was so weird... any ideas on grade boundaries....?



    I put " When having replied [which I think is wrong and should have been replying] he said that he knew nothing about the foreigner, they didn't believe the story".... it totally doesn't make sense in English and I'm so confused ahhhhh.....

    Also the first sentence about calling the assembly... I put "The magistrates having been called into the assembly immediately.." how many marks will I lose do you think?
    Well you got the all of the vocab right and you got the plural of magistrates right-you just didnt get the overall sense (the participle bit) so I don't think you would lose more than 2 marks.
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    (Original post by meme259)
    Well you got the all of the vocab right and you got the plural of magistrates right-you just didnt get the overall sense (the participle bit) so I don't think you would lose more than 2 marks.
    Ah ok On a positive note, I thought the comprehension was pretty simple...
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    I thought that paper was relatively hard. Lots of participles and weirdly structured sentences in the translation. Made a couple of silly errors too.

    Would translating αλητθη as truthfully instead of true be a major or minor error?
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    (Original post by PlinyTheElder)
    I thought that paper was relatively hard. Lots of participles and weirdly structured sentences in the translation. Made a couple of silly errors too.

    Would translating αλητθη as truthfully instead of true be a major or minor error?
    I did that, hadn't even realised it was wrong. Think I'm going to be getting 0 on that whole sentence lol Let's hope the grade boundaries are adjusted accordingly....
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    (Original post by PlinyTheElder)
    I thought that paper was relatively hard. Lots of participles and weirdly structured sentences in the translation. Made a couple of silly errors too.

    Would translating αλητθη as truthfully instead of true be a major or minor error?
    I translated it as "truth"

    Also, what did you guys translate διαφθαρεντος as? Sentence-wise it made sense for it to be a passive, but I'm not sure it is one grammar-wise...

    It had some tricky bits, but it wasn't too hard overall & could have been a lot worse
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    I translated it as truthfully too, but I translated it as the truth first but then I second guessed myself (because I always fail to spot adverbs) and put truthfully instead. And as for the destroy, I translated it as a masculine genitive singular passive aorist participle

    And what was that 'outoi ta auta' thing too?
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    OCR GREEK GCSE Language 2 June 13th 2016 Unofficial Mark Scheme

    N.B - please note that each mark in section A is referenced inside a bracket. In this markscheme a slash is used to show different words which could have been used.
    Section A – Comprehension [20]
    Not sure if this is all correct, but I'm pretty sure these were the questions and answers. If I make errors with questions, answers mark allocation or question numbers, please do correct me.
    1)
    a)
    Q – What were the Athenians doing? [1]
    A – (They were fighting for 10 years).
    b)
    Q – What did they intend to do and why? [3]
    A – They intended (to capture) (the island of Sicily) because it was (very rich).

    2)
    Q – The Spartans were the enemy of the Athenians, but what were they doing now? [1]
    A – Now (they were helping) (the inhabitants of Sicily).

    3)
    a)
    Q – Where did the naval battle take place? [1]
    A – In a certain (harbour).

    b)
    Q - What was the outcome of the battle? [2]
    A - The (Athenians) (were conquered/beaten/lost).

    4)
    Q – Many Athenian ships were destroyed. Explain in detail what other losses the Athenians suffered. [4]
    A – (Very many) (Athenian sailors) (died in the sea) and (those who were captured) (became prisoners of war). [5 possible, 4 max]

    5)
    Q - What happened to the two Athenian generals? [2]
    A - The two Athenian generals (were killed) (by those who won) OR (those who won) (killed) the two Athenian generals.

    6)
    Q – Explain why formerly many peoplefeared and were scared of the Athenians? [2]
    A – For the Athenians were (very strong) (by sea).

    7)
    Q – Explain why was the disaster was soterrible for the Athenians? [4]
    A – (From their) (greatest/biggest fleet), (nothing) (remained). Therefore they had less defence/had reason to fear.

    Section B – Translation [40]

    N.B - In section B there are 10 sections each worth 4 marks. I have put in brackets what I think to be each section. Slashes in this mark scheme reference different words which could have been used in translation.

    8) Translation [40]
    (But/and after a few days a/a certain stranger/foreigner arrived at Piraeus.)(Having sat in/at a barber’s shop, he spoke/said/told about the disaster/misfortune at Sicily, thinking/assuming that all the citizens already learnt of it/learnt/realised/ascertained/knew.)(But/and the Athenians did not yet know/understand/realise what had happened/occurred/become.)(Therefore the barber ran as quickly/fast/swiftly as possible into the city/state, in order to/to announce these things to/at the market-place/market.)(Therefore those having heard/those who had heard these things there feared very much.)
    (But/and the magistrates, having called the assembly/council immediately/at once, they asked the barber; “How did you learn/understand these things?”)(But when replying he said that he had seen nothing about the stranger, he did not trust the story.)(Therefore the magistrates decided to punish the barber as/because/since he was not speaking/telling/saying the truth and was providing/producing fear in the city/state.)(And indeed he would have suffered terrible things, if other messengers had not arrived then from/out of Sicily.)(These messengers announced the same things, and the Athenians, having neither a ship nor goods/property/money, feared the enemy.)

    Please note that the marks out of 4 for each section is determined as follows:

    4: Correct translation with one minor error allowed.
    3: Overall sense clear – one serious or two minor errors allowed.
    2: Part correct, overall sense lacking/not clear.
    1: Not coherent, isolated knowledge of vocabulary only.
    0: Totally wrong or left out.
    N.B - inconsequential errors should be ignored – minor errors are separate from them.
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    (Original post by metellaest)
    How did people find it?
    Really good thanks - went really well overall and I found it pretty easy. The first section was very easy, and I thought i got most the the translation, although there were many tricky bits - a couple of which I probably got wrong.

    (Original post by fuzz13)
    That was a hard paper imo It was all going well until the second paragraph in the translation That was so weird... any ideas on grade boundaries....?

    I put " When having replied [which I think is wrong and should have been replying] he said that he knew nothing about the foreigner, they didn't believe the story".... it totally doesn't make sense in English and I'm so confused ahhhhh.....

    Also the first sentence about calling the assembly... I put "The magistrates having been called into the assembly immediately.." how many marks will I lose do you think?
    Personally I thought it was a pretty easy paper, and I would guess 50 A*, 45 A, 40 B, 35 C, 28 D - mark scheme above.
    Yes it was replying = "when replying he said that he saw nothing about the stranger, they didn't believe the story." I cannot remember if it was him who didn't believe that the foreigner's story was true or if they did not believe his story - I can't remember the greek. It was either epistuesav or episteuse. The verb was also eiden meaning to see, not to know (which would be eidenai/oida).
    Well the answer was that "the magistrates, having called the assmebly at once" you will lose 1 or 2 marks.

    (Original post by fuzz13)
    Ah ok On a positive note, I thought the comprehension was pretty simple...
    Agreed.
    (Original post by PlinyTheElder)
    I thought that paper was relatively hard. Lots of participles and weirdly structured sentences in the translation. Made a couple of silly errors too.

    Would translating αλητθη as truthfully instead of true be a major or minor error?
    I believe you are allowed to do it and so it is likely not an error at all, but i did say the truth, rather than truthfully. I believe both are right.

    (Original post by F0X)
    I translated it as "truth"

    Also, what did you guys translate διαφθαρεντος as? Sentence-wise it made sense for it to be a passive, but I'm not sure it is one grammar-wise...

    It had some tricky bits, but it wasn't too hard overall & could have been a lot worse
    Definitely was passive - the fleet which had been destroyed.
    (Original post by Panzamad)
    I translated it as truthfully too, but I translated it as the truth first but then I second guessed myself (because I always fail to spot adverbs) and put truthfully instead. And as for the destroy, I translated it as a masculine genitive singular passive aorist participle

    And what was that 'outoi ta auta' thing too?
    There are no advbs at Greek GCSE level, are there? But i think you can anyway
    The bit you are referring to I belive was translated thus: "Thse messengers announced these things."

    (Original post by meme259)
    What did people get for the bit just before 'therefore the assembly decided..'- the part about the barber saying he knew nothing about the foreigner, but they didn't believe him?
    "But when replying he said that he had seen nothing about the stranger, they did not trust the story." Mark scheme above


    Guys, for the bit about the Athenians did not yet know what had happened I put - "the Athenians did not yet know that these things had happened" - major or minor mistake?
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    (Original post by Martins1)
    OCR GREEK GCSE Language 2 June 13th 2016 Unofficial Mark Scheme

    N.B - please note that each mark in section A is referenced inside a bracket. In this markscheme a slash is used to show different words which could have been used.
    Section A – Comprehension [20]
    Not sure if this is all correct, but I'm pretty sure these were the questions and answers. If I make errors with questions, answers mark allocation or question numbers, please do correct me.
    1)
    a)
    Q – Where were the Athenians sailing to? [1]
    A – (Sicily).
    b)
    Q – What did they intend to do and why? [3]
    A – They intended (to capture) (the island of Sicily) because it was (very rich).

    2)
    Q – The Spartans were the enemy of the Athenians, but what were they doing now? [1]
    A – Now (they were helping) (the island of Sicily).

    3)
    a)
    Q – Where did the naval battle take place? [1]
    A – In a certain (harbour).

    b)
    Q - What was the outcome of the battle? [2]
    A - The (Athenians) (were conquered/beaten/lost).

    4)
    Q – Many Athenian ships were destroyed. Explain in detail what other losses the Athenians suffered. [4]
    A – (Very many) (Athenian sailors) (died in the sea) and (those who were captured) (became prisoners of war). [5 possible, 4 max]

    5)
    Q - What happened to the two Athenian generals? [2]
    A - The two Athenian generals (were killed) (by those who won) OR (those who won) (killed) the two Athenian generals.

    6)
    Q – Explain why formerly many peoplefeared and were scared of the Athenians? [2]
    A – For the Athenians were (very strong) (by sea).

    7)
    Q – Explain why was the disaster was soterrible for the Athenians? [4]
    A – (From their) (greatest/biggest fleet), (nothing) (remained). Therefore they had less defence/had reason to fear.

    Section B – Translation [40]

    N.B - In section B there are 10 sections each worth 4 marks. I have put in brackets what I think to be each section. Slashes in this mark scheme reference different words which could have been used in translation.

    8) Translation [40]
    (But/and after a few days a/a certain stranger/foreigner arrived at Piraeus.)(Having sat in/at a barber’s shop, he spoke/said/told about the disaster/misfortune at Sicily, thinking/assuming that the citizens already learnt of it/learnt/realised/ascertained/knew.)(But/and the Athenians did not yet know/understand/realise what had happened/occurred/become.)(Therefore the barber ran as quickly/fast/swiftly as possible into the city/state, in order to/to announce these things to/at the market-place/market.)(Therefore those having heard/those who had heard these things there feared very much.)
    (But/and the magistrates, having called the assembly/council immediately/at once, they asked the butcher; “How did you learn/understand these things?”)(But when replying he said that he had seen nothing about the stranger, he did not trust the story.)(Therefore the magistrates decided to punish the butcher as/because/since he was not speaking/telling/saying the truth and was providing/producing fear in the city/state.)(And indeed he would have suffered terrible things, if other messengers had not arrived then from/out of Sicily.)(These messengers announced the same things, and the Athenians, having neither a ship nor goods/property/money, feared the enemy.)

    Please note that the marks out of 4 for each section is determined as follows:

    4: Correct translation with one minor error allowed.
    3: Overall sense clear – one serious or two minor errors allowed.
    2: Part correct, overall sense lacking/not clear.
    1: Not coherent, isolated knowledge of vocabulary only.
    0: Totally wrong or left out.
    N.B - inconsequential errors should be ignored – minor errors are separate from them.
    Martins1 Ur an absolute god, thanks for this. One question, in the translation when the guy was talking about the disaster, you missed out 'pantes' - all/everything. Did you put 'thinking that the citizens knew everything already' or 'thinking that all the citizens knew it'? I put the first one, I'd be interested to hear what u said. Also for the last sentence, I put 'the messengers announced the same things to them' would that be a major or a minor error?
    Also for question 2, I put 'the Athenians were helping the inhabitants of Sicily' as I think 'enoikos' means inhabitants.Otherwise it seems to have gone pretty well.
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    (Original post by jamesj477)
    Martins1 Ur an absolute god, thanks for this. One question, in the translation when the guy was talking about the disaster, you missed out 'pantes' - all/everything. Did you put 'thinking that the citizens knew everything already' or 'thinking that all the citizens knew it'? I put the first one, I'd be interested to hear what u said. Also for the last sentence, I put 'the messengers announced the same things to them' would that be a major or a minor error?
    Also for question 2, I put 'the Athenians were helping the inhabitants of Sicily' as I think 'enoikos' means inhabitants.Otherwise it seems to have gone pretty well.
    I'm afraid it was the latter because the word for all was pantes (pi, alpha, nu, tau, epsilon, sigma) which is the nominative neuter plural, which agrees with the citizens, politai, thus "all the citizens already knew". And thanks for pointing out my error! Gonna go add in all now...

    Question 2 asked what the spartans were doing - because the spartans and Athenians were enemies, yet the Spartans were helping the island of Sicily. Honestly this was one of the questions I couldn't really remember so I can't exactly remember the text, but it was definitely something about the spartans helping the isand of sicily. If you said "Spartans" "helping" and "Sicily" I reckon you'll get both marks. If you put Athenians, you'll probably lose a mark.

    Glad it went well
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    (Original post by Martins1)
    I'm afraid it was the latter because the word for all was pantes (pi, alpha, nu, tau, epsilon, sigma) which is the nominative neuter plural, which agrees with the citizens, politai, thus "all the citizens already knew". And thanks for pointing out my error! Gonna go add in all now...

    Question 2 asked what the spartans were doing - because the spartans and Athenians were enemies, yet the Spartans were helping the island of Sicily. Honestly this was one of the questions I couldn't really remember so I can't exactly remember the text, but it was definitely something about the spartans helping the isand of sicily. If you said "Spartans" "helping" and "Sicily" I reckon you'll get both marks. If you put Athenians, you'll probably lose a mark.

    Glad it went well
    Ah damn thats annoying. Oh well. Thanks anyway ur markscheme made me a lot happier lol
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    (Original post by jamesj477)
    Ah damn thats annoying. Oh well. Thanks anyway ur markscheme made me a lot happier lol
    Yeah, sorry about that... But no problem about the mark scheme, its good for my memory to go over the exams in my head afterwards. I'm glad the mark scheme made you happier and was helpful!
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    Thank you so much for this! But I'm pretty sure the guy was a barber not a butcher... Or am I going crazy? 😂
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    The first question I swear was about how long they had been fighting also I believe the answer to another one was that they were helping the inhabitants of sicily
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    (Original post by helenh567)
    Thank you so much for this! But I'm pretty sure the guy was a barber not a butcher... Or am I going crazy? 😂
    Did I write butcher? I'm goind mad... not you!
    (Original post by Soph.ht)
    The first question I swear was about how long they had been fighting also I believe the answer to another one was that they were helping the inhabitants of sicily
    That was it! I couln't really remember the first question, can anyone remember the answer? (I think it was ten years...?)
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    I thought it was what were they doing (or something like that)? They were fighting for 10 years in paper 1
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    (Original post by helenh567)
    I thought it was what were they doing (or something like that)? They were fighting for 10 years in paper 1
    Hmmm - you are right. Can someone help us? I honestly cannot remember!
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    Yeah it was definitely fighting for 10 years
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    Wasn't it 'what were the Athenians doing' - fighting ?
 
 
 
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