Warnings over Brexit from the big powers

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    (Original post by pairofjeans)
    1. At least now I know why you're so argumentative. You don't fully read posts you reply to.
    "Loads of arguments have been provided throughout the thread. I was simply speculating at the drivel that you posted. How can you say it's far too early to make claims? Should we never speculate about anything ever again?"

    Once you've read up, you can properly contribute to the conversation.

    http://lmgtfy.com/?q=economic+repercussions+of+brexit


    2. The argument cannot be flipped?
    . "We haven't left the EU. How do you know things will get better when the article is triggered? "

    Alternative flip

    "You are claiming leaving the EU isn't a mornoic economic decision? Where is your proof"

    If anything, the alternative should be whats asked. Because I've seen way too many studies from experts saying it was economically a hilarious decision. I genuinely want to read a study arguing the other point of view. But the fact that they're so hard to find doesn't really shock me.

    If you struggled to comprehend any of that then there's no point continuing.
    More ad hominem; not a single argument.

    Was it worth creating a second account for this dullness?
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    (Original post by pairofjeans)

    And you think HILLARY OR TRUMP will be any more lenient? Is this bait?
    Well why wouldn't they? Why would the USA stop trading with the UK, it's in their own best interest to make it happen
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    (Original post by Fullofsurprises)
    A second ref. would go differently if the economy has tipped downwards in the meantime. Also people are much better informed now, the Leave leaders having all admitted that they lied through their teeth during the first campaign.
    You don't know many Brexit voters, do you?*
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    (Original post by KimKallstrom)
    You don't know many Brexit voters, do you?*
    The polling analyses show that many people voted Leave "to give David Cameron a kicking" or "to get more money for the NHS", things like that, which have no relationship to reality.
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    (Original post by midnightice)
    You just described yourself.
    care to explain? or did you just throw your childish nonsense into the pit for no reason
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    (Original post by ChaoticButterfly)
    Unless Trump wins Hilary will continue as normal.
    Which is still irrelevant as trade deals are done by congress and the senate, where numerous members of each have said very publicly that they will continue to trade with the UK as a matter of importance.
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    (Original post by Drewski)
    Which is still irrelevant as trade deals are done by congress and the senate, where numerous members of each have said very publicly that they will continue to trade with the UK as a matter of importance.
    Alright then. But that isn't what I was replying to.
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    (Original post by ChaoticButterfly)
    Alright then. But that isn't what I was replying to.
    Well considering I alluded to that fact in my first post it begs the question what were you replying to?
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    (Original post by Drewski)
    Which is still irrelevant as trade deals are done by congress and the senate, where numerous members of each have said very publicly that they will continue to trade with the UK as a matter of importance.
    I should think so too. Much easier to strong arm and bully a small country like Britain into accepting your unequal trading terms and demands to accede to low US environmental and product standards than the EU.
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    (Original post by Fullofsurprises)
    The polling analyses show that many people voted Leave "to give David Cameron a kicking" or "to get more money for the NHS", things like that, which have no relationship to reality.
    Quod erat demonstrandum. You don't know many Brexit voters.

    In fact I put it to you that you don't actually know any of us in real life. Maybe an older relative or two, maybe? Am I right?

    A visceral, primal, inchoate rage caused Brexit. The like of which we haven't seen since, I don't know, the English Civil War?

    It hasn't dissipated, it still simmers, up and down the country and it has nothing to do with EU contributions being spent on the NHS. In fact it hasn't got all that much to do with the EU itself!

    No, that anger, bitterness, hatred, disgust towardsthe establishment and metropolitan elite has everything to do with the attitude (which you yourself exemplify if you don't mind my saying) that having completely [email protected] the country, Remainers still think they know best and that anyone who disagrees with their failed, discredited shibboleths is too stupid to be worthy of consideration and should be ignored.

    That is why if you, and the elite hold a second referendum you won't just get kicked in the head like last time. You will be told to kneel and shot.
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    (Original post by generallee)
    Quod erat demonstrandum. You don't know many Brexit voters.

    In fact I put it to you that you don't actually know any of us in real life. Maybe an older relative or two, maybe? Am I right?

    A visceral, primal, inchoate rage caused Brexit. The like of which we haven't seen since, I don't know, the English Civil War?

    It hasn't dissipated, it still simmers, up and down the country and it has nothing to do with EU contributions being spent on the NHS. In fact it hasn't got all that much to do with the EU itself!

    No, that anger, bitterness, hatred, disgust towardsthe establishment and metropolitan elite has everything to do with the attitude (which you yourself exemplify if you don't mind my saying) that having completely [email protected] the country, Remainers still think they know best and that anyone who disagrees with their failed, discredited shibboleths is too stupid to be worthy of consideration and should be ignored.

    That is why if you, and the elite hold a second referendum you won't just get kicked in the head like last time. You will be told to kneel and shot.
    Both hardcore Remainers and Brexiters have individuals like you who think you're right and that the entire opposition are idiots.

    Its dumb to pretend that this issue is exclusive to the Remain campaign.
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    (Original post by generallee)
    Quod erat demonstrandum. You don't know many Brexit voters.

    In fact I put it to you that you don't actually know any of us in real life. Maybe an older relative or two, maybe? Am I right?

    A visceral, primal, inchoate rage caused Brexit. The like of which we haven't seen since, I don't know, the English Civil War?
    There have been other occasions since; the Gordon Riots, Chartism.

    But ultimately as a nation we put Charles II back on the throne.

    It hasn't dissipated, it still simmers, up and down the country and it has nothing to do with EU contributions being spent on the NHS. In fact it hasn't got all that much to do with the EU itself!

    No, that anger, bitterness, hatred, disgust towardsthe establishment and metropolitan elite has everything to do with the attitude (which you yourself exemplify if you don't mind my saying) that having completely [email protected] the country, Remainers still think they know best and that anyone who disagrees with their failed, discredited shibboleths is too stupid to be worthy of consideration and should be ignored.
    But the people you call the metropolitan elite do know best and the people like you are baying at the moon. The majority of the country, those who are on the sidelines of politics, who mow the lawn and go Meadowhall and walk the dog on Brighton Beach will simply see that people like you offer no solution, or no solution they, the ordinary folk are prepared to tolerate.

    They weren't willing to ban Christmas to propitiate a Calvanist God. They weren'twilling to see their capital burned to the ground to support the cry of "No Popery" and they are not willing to see their nation laid to waste to humour an alliance of racists, reactionary dreamers and economic loony tunes.
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    (Original post by nulli tertius)
    But the people you call the metropolitan elite do know best and the people like you are baying at the moon .... they are not willing to see their nation laid to waste to humour an alliance of racists, reactionary dreamers and economic loony tunes.
    A truly accurate view. :clap2:
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    (Original post by generallee)
    .... having completely [email protected] the country, Remainers still think they know best and that anyone who disagrees with their failed, discredited shibboleths is too stupid to be worthy of consideration and should be ignored.
    I have to query this bit. It's strange, because the UK remains high on nearly all global measures of wealth, income, education, well being, health, etc. To what exactly are you referring?

    I'm going to hazard a guess that it's immigration - the Kippers are very predictable.

    To listen to the people you are talking about, you'd think there was civil war in the streets between immigrants and the rest. What we actually have is (still) a remarkably accepting country in most of the places where immigrants actually live and work.

    The big majorities for Leave (eg, the most racist locations) were often in areas with very few actual immigrants or indeed ethnic minorities.

    I just wish that the people you are describing would come clean about their racism and stop pretending it's about something else all the time.
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    (Original post by nulli tertius)
    There have been other occasions since; the Gordon Riots, Chartism.

    But ultimately as a nation we put Charles II back on the throne.



    But the people you call the metropolitan elite do know best and the people like you are baying at the moon. The majority of the country, those who are on the sidelines of politics, who mow the lawn and go Meadowhall and walk the dog on Brighton Beach will simply see that people like you offer no solution, or no solution they, the ordinary folk are prepared to tolerate.

    They weren't willing to ban Christmas to propitiate a Calvanist God. They weren'twilling to see their capital burned to the ground to support the cry of "No Popery" and they are not willing to see their nation laid to waste to humour an alliance of racists, reactionary dreamers and economic loony tunes.
    Yeah, they restored the Stuarts, and Charles II went on to become one of the weakest kings in our whole history, turning a nation feared by the whole of Europe, under Cromwell into a laughing stock.

    Then his younger brother proved to be even worse and was kicked off the throne in a bloodless revolution.

    I wouldn't boast abut how wonderful the restoration was.
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    (Original post by Fullofsurprises)
    Longer term, the picture is much worse. Inflation will dig in, if the £ continues to stay weak or weakens further, it will accelerate. The responsiveness of exporters to a cheap £ is in doubt, because we simply don't make enough in-demand goods and services to sell a great deal more of them at any price and also because we are near full-employment, so we can't easily produce more. (Without a further surge in inward migration, at any rate, which is deprecated apparently.) In addition, loss of the Single Market will create a black hole in the trading accounts and tax receipts will plunge, both appear likely and are currently the cause of much alarm in government.

    An announcement that we are leaving the SM will trigger all of the above and more. Announcing that we have a trade deal with Australia will cut no ice.
    What are you blathering about? The inflation projections are practically unchanged and remain in the desirable zone, and a weaker pound will not "accelerate" this beyond a year on the basis of being a year on year measure. If our goods and services are so poor that nobody wants them pray tell how we are dominant in the service sector and continue to have strong manufacturing output, that has only strengthened with the weaker point. We are also far from truly full employment, and there are three ways to progress: increase productivity (you know, the thing that happens the majority of the time), increase the population (something else that tends to happen), or reduce underemployment (which there is massive scope for). I also think you're very confused WRT the single market, I'm slightly confused as to how you reach the conclusion that tax receipts will plunge with the increase in taxes, tariffs levied on EU imports would be enough to, say, knock over 25% off the deficit, or increase the personal allowance by over £2000, or bring the base national insurance threshold back in line with income tax, or allow the NHS to be lazy AND be "fully funded"
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    (Original post by Drewski)
    Well considering I alluded to that fact in my first post it begs the question what were you replying to?
    That swapping Obama out for Clinton would make a a hole heap of difference. But it would seem you think who the president is is irrelevant.

    My point is that even if the president was a super dictator Clinton is basically standing as the continue what Obama did candidate.
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    (Original post by Fullofsurprises)
    I just wish that the people you are describing would come clean about their racism and stop pretending it's about something else all the time.
    If more than 17 million people are "racist", what does that word even mean?

    (How do you want them all to "come clean" by the way?

    Maybe you could hold thousands of Brexit Anonymous meetings up and down the country?

    They could try and cure themselves of Brexitism one day at a time. The first thing is to admit that they have a problem.

    "My name is xxxxxx, I voted for Brexit and I am a racist.")
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    (Original post by nulli tertius)
    There have been other occasions since; the Gordon Riots, Chartism.

    But ultimately as a nation we put Charles II back on the throne.



    But the people you call the metropolitan elite do know best and the people like you are baying at the moon. The majority of the country, those who are on the sidelines of politics, who mow the lawn and go Meadowhall and walk the dog on Brighton Beach will simply see that people like you offer no solution, or no solution they, the ordinary folk are prepared to tolerate.

    They weren't willing to ban Christmas to propitiate a Calvanist God. They weren'twilling to see their capital burned to the ground to support the cry of "No Popery" and they are not willing to see their nation laid to waste to humour an alliance of racists, reactionary dreamers and economic loony tunes.
    The curious thing (IMO) is that the elite usually has a strong instinct for self preservation and will usually head off widespread discontent before anything unexpectedly drastic happened... are elites just not as competent as they used to be?
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    (Original post by Joinedup)
    The curious thing (IMO) is that the elite usually has a strong instinct for self preservation and will usually head off widespread discontent before anything unexpectedly drastic happened... are elites just not as competent as they used to be?
    Isn't that what they are doing now?

    The public have been promised "Brexit means Brexit". Something called Brexit will (and will have to be) delivered eventually.

    I think we can see the power of the Leave campaign diminish. The specific demand for a points based immigration system was swatted away like a fly and Farage was left as the only Brexiteer demanding a points based system regardless of whether it achieves its object or not and he gained no real support from the usual suspects in the Telegraph, Mail and Express which went to some length (although not altogether accurately) to explain why a points based system won't work.
 
 
 
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