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    (Original post by j00ni)
    Use the arm vein engorgement trick

    Or shine a lamp on the neck

    Both work a treat for me, unless they are a total chubber
    Not the stamp on their liver trick?
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    (Original post by Renal)
    Not the stamp on their liver trick?
    yeah but everyone knows that, so it's no fun mentioning - plus you can't measure the JVP whist initiating the reflux
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    (Original post by j00ni)
    plus you can't measure the JVP whist initiating the reflux
    What are third years for?
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    (Original post by Renal)
    What are third years for?
    pass

    ??
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    (Original post by j00ni)
    pass
    You mean you can't use them to gut punch punters while you watch? :eek3:
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    (Original post by Renal)
    I really struggle, most of my patients seem to be missing them.
    Yeah, me too, man. I suppose if worst came to worst, I could use hepato-jugular reflex, but I never could see the point of it, except as a way to track the JVP down to its original level.

    :dontknow: More practice needed!
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    (Original post by j00ni)
    Use the arm vein engorgement trick

    Or shine a lamp on the neck

    Both work a treat for me, unless they are a total chubber
    Oooh, teach me this trick! :teeth:

    Arm-vein engorgement trick? As in, causing the surface veins in the arm to be more exposed, like when inserting a line into the medial cubital vein?
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    The arm veins become engorged at and below the level of the heart. Therefore, get the patient in a sitting position with their arm by their side until the arm veins engorge. Then raise the arm up, and the level that the veins are no longer engorged is the level of the JVP
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    (Original post by j00ni)
    The arm veins become engorged at and below the level of the heart. Therefore, get the patient in a sitting position with their arm by their side until the arm veins engorge. Then raise the arm up, and the level that the veins are no longer engorged is the level of the JVP
    Interesting... how does that work? Why do the arm veins become engorged below the level of the heart? And why is that an indication of where the JVP is? Last I checked, the jugular vein was completely separate to the basilar/cephalic veins?

    Sorry for the questions lol. But any answers would be appreciated!
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    (Original post by Demon_AS)
    Interesting... how does that work? Why do the arm veins become engorged below the level of the heart? And why is that an indication of where the JVP is? Last I checked, the jugular vein was completely separate to the basilar/cephalic veins?

    Sorry for the questions lol. But any answers would be appreciated!
    I don't know, but I'm guessing if you simplfy all of venous return into one loop then arm low = gravity =less return =engorged. At the level of the heart, more return, and therefore briefly shows elevated JVP?
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    (Original post by Wangers)
    I don't know, but I'm guessing if you simplfy all of venous return into one loop then arm low = gravity =less return =engorged. At the level of the heart, more return, and therefore briefly shows elevated JVP?
    Maybe... somehow I doubt it, though. The veins are built so that gravity won't impair the return of blood - hence valves and close relation to skeletal muscle.

    But then again, maybe you're right :dontknow:. I'll look it up in my physiology text book. :yes:
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    (Original post by Renal)
    Not the stamp on their liver trick?
    3 steps to seeing a perfecto JVP.

    Lie pt 45 degrees in a nice vulnerable position
    Tell them to look left (the other way)
    swiftly shove up under the costal margin on the liver side.
    and the JVP swells up.

    Of course, if you don't want to be **** on by the GMC, there are minor issues of consent and care/pain etc involved. :yep: :tongue:

    Incase there are any spanners who want to try this at home - DONT. Also, follow GMC guidelines.
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    Most of this stuff will go over of my head, but I'm subscribing for kicks, evening all.
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    You're a medic, aren't you? JVP was first year stuff :p:.
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    see here
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    (Original post by Wangers)
    3 steps to seeing a perfecto JVP.

    Lie pt flat in a nice vulnerable position
    Tell them to look left (the other way)
    swiftly shove up under the costal margin on the liver side.
    and the JVP swells up.

    Of course, if you don't want to be **** on by the GMC, there are minor issues of consent and care/pain etc involved. :yep: :tongue:

    Incase there are any spanners who want to try this at home - DONT. Also, follow GMC guidelines.
    Are you sure you aren't supposed to have them at 45 degrees?
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    (Original post by ThisLittlePiggy)
    Are you sure you aren't supposed to have them at 45 degrees?
    That too
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    (Original post by reems23)
    see here
    Ah, I see. Get to it!

    Piggy: Yes, indeed! 45 degrees, with the head turned away from you and a good light source directed at the neck. As I recall it, the JVP should be no higher than a point roughly 4cm in line with the sternal notch.
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    (Original post by Demon_AS)
    Ah, I see. Get to it!

    Piggy: Yes, indeed! 45 degrees, with the head turned away from you and a good light source directed at the neck. As I recall it, the JVP should be no higher than a point roughly 4cm in line with the sternal notch.
    Yes, that is what I was taught.
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    (Original post by ThisLittlePiggy)
    Yes, that is what I was taught.
    Hmm, thank you, that was pretty much the most important bit :redface: :redface:
 
 
 
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