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How can we be alive when we are just atoms watch

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    (Original post by Ralfskini)
    honestly..................no
    Well, what is short for Richard
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    (Original post by Ralfskini)
    Race you to 1000

    your onnnn!!
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    (Original post by Blamps)
    Well, what is short for Richard

    ****, oh ok I see now.
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    (Original post by Blamps)
    Well, what is short for Richard
    I will give you a clue...it is a type of dessert which has the word 'spotted' then short for Richard, which is ****
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    (Original post by Anna)
    your onnnn!!

    Ahem, Im winning.
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    (Original post by Ralfskini)
    Ahem, Im winning.
    thats only because im doing some art work. Watch me post like crazy when you go offline...
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    (Original post by Ralfskini)
    ****, oh ok I see now.
    not funny...Maskall would not understand though :rolleyes:
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    how could anyone not know cells were made up of atoms, what they gonna be made of special juice strings?

    this isnt no chat room either btw
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    (Original post by AndrewJameson)
    how could anyone not know cells were made up of atoms,
    He's a recurrent troll.

    (Original post by AndrewJameson)
    this isnt no chat room either btw
    There's one around somewhere, though. But here works just as well.
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    Back to the point, though. The aim of this thread is to answer the question 'how can we be living when we are made up of atoms'. Considering we invented the word 'living' to describe the unique behaviour of people, animals plants, etc, then I don't quite see how we can not be living. However, the question 'how can a bundle of atoms show such unique properties which we have labelled 'living behaviour'', is a much more difficult question to answer. It is in essence to do with the competition between 'stable structures' and how they use these properties in an attempt to better their counterparts. This is how evolution began. From this point onwards, an evolutionary arms race developed. It was discovered that it was beneficial to move, respire, grow, and so on, and so these features became commonplace amongst these competing sytems.
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    yeah, the original question was good and we kinda lots the plot. It is very interesting to understand how a collection of atoms bonded and reacting with each other can function like the living things that exist. Especially humans. And the question, if we were copied atom for atom, would the clone be exactly the same as we are now, or is such a thing as spirit that take control of the collection of atoms...
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    (Original post by SasunD)
    yeah, the original question was good and we kinda lots the plot. It is very interesting to understand how a collection of atoms bonded and reacting with each other can function like the living things that exist. Especially humans. And the question, if we were copied atom for atom, would the clone be exactly the same as we are now, or is such a thing as spirit that take control of the collection of atoms...

    I think the term 'spirit' is used because people find it difficult to come to terms with the fact that complexity can be created from atoms. They feel that atoms can account for the intricate structure, but the spirit provides the life force.
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    (Original post by Blamps)
    Maskall, have you done ORGANIC chemistry, whicch wholly involves the study of carbon compounds
    BLAMPS

    HAve you heard about a Carbon ATOM ?

    A bit about Carbon:

    Atomic number: 6
    Most common isotope: Carbon 12 (6 protons and 6 neutrons)
    Electronic configuration: [He]2s2 2p2
    Period II of the periodic table of the elements.

    Carbon is an element compoused of Carbon ATOMS. All molecules, including the organic molecules, are composed of atoms. The organic molecules contain carbon atoms as well as other atoms, unorganic molecules contain no carbon atoms. Some exceptions include prussic acid HCN and carbon dioxide CO2.

    Human cells are compoused of mainly amino acids and a cellular membrane. These are in turn composed of molecules, which are composed of atoms...
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    The original question is interesting. As said before... humans are made of ions, compounds and molecules and very few isolated atoms.

    The question about whether if you recreated a human atom by atom, would they be the same? The answer would be no, unless you could transfer the electrons in their exact distributions as well. It would also be a good idea to match the velocities and directions of the new particles with the old ones or you could have a few problems. If that's done I don't see why you won't have succeeded in producing an instantaneously identical clone.
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    (Original post by SasunD)
    yeah, the original question was good and we kinda lots the plot. It is very interesting to understand how a collection of atoms bonded and reacting with each other can function like the living things that exist. Especially humans. And the question, if we were copied atom for atom, would the clone be exactly the same as we are now, or is such a thing as spirit that take control of the collection of atoms...
    It is impossible to copy something presisely, due to Heisenbergs uncertainty principle. If you could copy an object exactly, then one could overcome the uncertainty relation and measure the position and momentum of a particle with unlimited accuracy at the same time. This is in direct contradiction with quantum mechanics. This is not merely a limitation in our technology, it is physically impossible to measure the position and momentum of a particle with unlimeted accuracy at the same time. Thus, no perfect coppying on an atom by atom basis can ever occur...
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    (Original post by Jonatan)
    BLAMPS

    Atomic number: 6
    Most common isotope: Carbon 12 (6 protons and 6 neutrons)
    Electronic configuration: [He]2s2 2p2
    Period II of the periodic table of the elements.
    nope, he did not copy this out of a text book. he remembers them
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    (Original post by icy)
    nope, he did not copy this out of a text book. he remembers them
    I dont really remember them, everyone who studdies chemistry knows that a carbon atom forms four covalent bonds with hydrogen, thus it must have 4 electrons in it outermost shell. Now, since carbon only have two shells, this means that it has 6 electrons total (since it has two electrons in its inner shell. Knowing that all spherical shells can contain 2 electrons max (Due to the exclusion principle) it is then easy to find the electronic configuration of the carbon atom. Now, a neutral atom has equally many protons and electrons, thus carbon has the atomic number 6. Since the atomic mass unit , u , is defiend as 1/12 times the weight of a carbon atom, and since hydrogen has an aproximate weight of 1u, one can then conclude that carbon has an atomic weight of 12u. Now, since it only has 6 protons, this implies that it must also have 6 neutrons if the total atomic mass is to be 12. Since it has 6 electrons, it must have two electron shells and so it must be in the second period of the periodic table, and thus we do not have to find the electron configuration of the first shell as it must be the same as that for helium. Of course, these different properties are so interlinked that once you remember a few of them , it is easy to deduce the other, so this makes it really easy to remember...
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    (Original post by Jonatan)
    BLAMPS

    HAve you heard about a Carbon ATOM ?

    A bit about Carbon:

    Atomic number: 6
    Most common isotope: Carbon 12 (6 protons and 6 neutrons)
    Electronic configuration: [He]2s2 2p2
    Period II of the periodic table of the elements.

    Carbon is an element compoused of Carbon ATOMS. All molecules, including the organic molecules, are composed of atoms. The organic molecules contain carbon atoms as well as other atoms, unorganic molecules contain no carbon atoms. Some exceptions include prussic acid HCN and carbon dioxide CO2.

    Human cells are compoused of mainly amino acids and a cellular membrane. These are in turn composed of molecules, which are composed of atoms...

    No Blamps was right on this occasion. The term carbon compound is more appropriate than carbon atom. Amino acids are carbon compounds, proteins are carbon compounds, monosaccharides, dissacharides and polysaccharides are carbon compounds, lipids are carbon compounds, and so on.
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    (Original post by Ralfskini)
    No Blamps was right on this occasion. The term carbon compound is more appropriate than carbon atom. Amino acids are carbon compounds, proteins are carbon compounds, monosaccharides, dissacharides and polysaccharides are carbon compounds, lipids are carbon compounds, and so on.
    But those carbon compounds consist of carbon atoms...

    Any molecule / compound which is organic contain carbon atoms. Thats the very definition of an organic compound. As an example, the amino acid glycin: H3N - CH2 - COOH contain two carbon atoms.
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    (Original post by rIcHrD)
    The original question is interesting. As said before... humans are made of ions, compounds and molecules and very few isolated atoms.

    The question about whether if you recreated a human atom by atom, would they be the same? The answer would be no, unless you could transfer the electrons in their exact distributions as well. It would also be a good idea to match the velocities and directions of the new particles with the old ones or you could have a few problems. If that's done I don't see why you won't have succeeded in producing an instantaneously identical clone.

    True, but this also implies that I am different person when I type this to when I type this (which of course I am if you consider my structure). This is because the electrons in the atoms in my body are moving around and are constantly in different positions. We have to bear in mind that if you recreate somebody to the exact specification with all of the atoms in the right position, then you will not have necessarily created the person as before, i.e. with the electrons in the exact same positions, however you would have created a body such that there is a chance (be it very small) that the electrons could simultaneously occupy the positions as before, and we shall therefore assume the new body to be the same as the first.
 
 
 
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