Turn on thread page Beta
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    women are treated fair and in most cases will turn it around to look bad on them. What would you say if it was men only and women could not join then what?
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by brasil85)
    women are treated fair and in most cases will turn it around to look bad on them. What would you say if it was men only and women could not join then what?
    Well statistics clearly show that there is still and entrenched system here at Oxford which favours men. Just a look at the largely male-orientated teaching system will prove this. There is a male-only college, if men wish to enter a male-only environmen - its called St Benet's.

    x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x
    Offline

    1
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by hildabeast)
    Well statistics clearly show that there is still and entrenched system here at Oxford which favours men. Just a look at the largely male-orientated teaching system will prove this. There is a male-only college, if men wish to enter a male-only environmen - its called St Benet's.

    x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x
    The statistics aren't proof in themselves that there is any unfairness towards women however, although they might suggest it.
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    Women like go on about this all the time. I do understand about women's right but sometimes it goes over the time.
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Alexander)
    The statistics aren't proof in themselves that there is any unfairness towards women however, although they might suggest it.
    I agree, one-off statistics are not proof, but statistics over a long number of years generally are. Take a look at the tutorial system. Psychologists have shown that women benefit from a more consensual style of learning whereas Oxford tutorials can be quite confrontational. Generally, women perform better through continuous assessment whereas men tend to benefit from exam-based assessment, and al Oxford degrees are assessed almost entirely by examination. Also just being here I was shocked at how few women have professorships and haow few women, for example, become presidents of their JCR or MCR. It is not just a few random statistics - this trend is clear at all levels across the university.

    x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by brasil85)
    Women like go on about this all the time. I do understand about women's right but sometimes it goes over the time.
    How can you say that when the university is clearly so male-dominated? There is still a glass-ceiling at Oxford and until that disappears there is still a need for women's colleges in order to preserve the presence of women and to enable them to have an oxford education which is more appropriately tailored to their needs.

    x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x
    • Thread Starter
    Offline

    15
    ReputationRep:
    what about women tailoring themselves to the oxford education? :P
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by edders)
    what about women tailoring themselves to the oxford education? :P
    Are you saying that women should just accept the fact that the education they are receiving is not necessarily suited to them? Oxford describes itself as a university offering equal opportunity to everyone who is able. The fact that women are less successful than men shows that they are failing some very able people who they recruit. It is very hard to tailor yourself to a style of teaching which does not complement your methods of learning.

    x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x
    Offline

    1
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by hildabeast)
    I agree, one-off statistics are not proof, but statistics over a long number of years generally are. Take a look at the tutorial system. Psychologists have shown that women benefit from a more consensual style of learning whereas Oxford tutorials can be quite confrontational. Generally, women perform better through continuous assessment whereas men tend to benefit from exam-based assessment, and al Oxford degrees are assessed almost entirely by examination. Also just being here I was shocked at how few women have professorships and haow few women, for example, become presidents of their JCR or MCR. It is not just a few random statistics - this trend is clear at all levels across the university.

    x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x
    Perhaps women are just less ambitious about becoming JCR/MCR presidents and stuff like that -- it would probably be better to look at proportions of those who want it getting the position.

    Would you suggest that women and men should be given a choice as to how they are examined -- a wholesale change to the way women prefer would surely mean men would do worse.
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Alexander)
    Perhaps women are just less ambitious about becoming JCR/MCR presidents and stuff like that -- it would probably be better to look at proportions of those who want it getting the position.

    Would you suggest that women and men should be given a choice as to how they are examined -- a wholesale change to the way women prefer would surely mean men would do worse.
    No I'm just saying that the system should be reassessed. Other universities assess most of their course through a combination of examination and coursework and I see no reason why Oxford cannot be the same. Why is it that women outperform men in the newer universities but in the more traditional institutions men still dominate? Perhaps women are less ambitious in some ways but I personally know girls who have considered standing for JCR positions in their colleges but didn't because they knew the position would go to a man. It is sad that people feel this way, but many people wouldn't even consider standing for something which they felt they could never win. Hilda's, on the other hand, is well-known for breeding confident women; in the past four years, two OUSU Presidents have been Hilda's girls. I don't think this is a coincidence - these people have aimed haigh because they have not been psychologically held back.

    x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x
    • Thread Starter
    Offline

    15
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by hildabeast)
    Are you saying that women should just accept the fact that the education they are receiving is not necessarily suited to them? Oxford describes itself as a university offering equal opportunity to everyone who is able. The fact that women are less successful than men shows that they are failing some very able people who they recruit. It is very hard to tailor yourself to a style of teaching which does not complement your methods of learning.

    x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x
    yer but surely its possible to change your methods of learning... i expect men have to change just as much; perhaps its just easier for them.
    Offline

    1
    ReputationRep:
    Hildabeast...would you agree then that GCSEs/A-levels are sexist in their way of examination because girls, on average, do better?

    I must get back to Latin and Greek vocab, Oxford unseens tomorrow :eek:
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by edders)
    yer but surely its possible to change your methods of learning... i expect men have to change just as much; perhaps its just easier for them.
    It puts men at an immediate unfair advantage - why should the system still be tailored towards them? Women have been members of this university for well over 100 years now and have continuously been in the minority. The higher up the academic ladder you go, the worse the situation. Educational psychologists have demonstrated many times that examintaion-based systems tend to benefit men. Why should women be expected to change when men can just continue in the way they have always done things? Obviously this is a huge generalisation but the trends are clearly evident. It is also a widely-known fact that certain tutors at certain of the male-dominated colleges have quite a misogynist attitutde. Why should women have to put up with this?

    x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Alexander)
    Hildabeast...would you agree then that GCSEs/A-levels are sexist in their way of examination because girls, on average, do better?

    I must get back to Latin and Greek vocab, Oxford unseens tomorrow :eek:
    Girls on average have higher IQs, so no.

    x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x
    Offline

    1
    ReputationRep:
    Just because men do better on examination-based assessment doesn't necessarily mean it's unfair.
    • Thread Starter
    Offline

    15
    ReputationRep:
    arguably gcses and alevels are biased in favour of girls nowadays tho... men have a hard enough time as it is without feminists coming along and screwing around with the oxford system which has produced so many successful academics/other public figures. it didnt stop maggie thatcher lol
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Alexander)
    Just because men do better on examination-based assessment doesn't necessarily mean it's unfair.
    Well it clearly indicates that something is wrong somewhere and that should be investigated. However, archaic institutions such as oxford tend to resist change as much as possible and don't believe they should review their systems like everyone else.

    x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by edders)
    arguably gcses and alevels are biased in favour of girls nowadays tho... men have a hard enough time as it is without feminists coming along and screwing around with the oxford system which has produced so many successful academics/other public figures. it didnt stop maggie thatcher lol
    Just because an institution has produced a lot of successful academics and other public figures does not mean we should avoid changing it.

    Maggie Thatcher went to a WOMEN'S COLLEGE :rolleyes:

    x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    J.S. Mill
    Karl Popper
    Isaac Newton
    Charles Darwin
    Jean Jaques Rousseau
    John Locke
    David Hume
    Immanuel Kant
    Albert Einstein
    Bertrand Russell

    vs

    Judy Finnigan?
    • Thread Starter
    Offline

    15
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by hildabeast)
    Just because an institution has produced a lot of successful academics and other public figures does not mean we should avoid changing it.

    Maggie Thatcher went to a WOMEN'S COLLEGE :rolleyes:

    x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x
    oh yeah she did didnt she. oops lol.
    ah well she was still successful in the conservative association etc. which goes to show that women can succeed in male dominated organisations if they try
 
 
 
Poll
How are you feeling in the run-up to Results Day 2018?
Useful resources
Uni match

Applying to uni?

Our tool will help you find the perfect course

Articles:

Debate and current affairs guidelinesDebate and current affairs wiki

Quick link:

Educational debate unanswered threads

Groups associated with this forum:

View associated groups

The Student Room, Get Revising and Marked by Teachers are trading names of The Student Room Group Ltd.

Register Number: 04666380 (England and Wales), VAT No. 806 8067 22 Registered Office: International House, Queens Road, Brighton, BN1 3XE

Write a reply...
Reply
Hide
Reputation gems: You get these gems as you gain rep from other members for making good contributions and giving helpful advice.