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what do you think about bob geldof? watch

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    i think he genuinly cares, but i think he may be a bit to overbaring in his protests
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    Hes a saint. He is brilliant. Although, i do think hes very hotheaded. Sometimes goes around things int he wrong manner. However he is very passionate about the whole thing.
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    He is a complete idiot. Keeps telling us to send money to africa,only for it to be wasted by idiot politicians/racist dictators on stupid things. 6 times the amount of money it cost to rebuild europe after WW2 has been sent there.
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    he seems naive, no, stupid.
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    (Original post by LC01)
    He is a complete idiot. Keeps telling us to send money to africa,only for it to be wasted by idiot politicians/racist dictators on stupid things. 6 times the amount of money it cost to rebuild europe after WW2 has been sent there.
    How the hell does one make such a calculation?
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    (Original post by englishstudent)
    Well in theory that's true... but millions more people doing the wrong thing - good or bad? Hmmm...
    I found out today my college's student union was mandated to use fair trade products whenever it was economically possible (e.g. in the college's vending machines) in an open meeting last year, and so now we have to. I'm really angry that one society's ethics has been brought into an entire union's activities.
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    (Original post by homoterror)
    I found out today my college's student union was mandated to use fair trade products whenever it was economically possible (e.g. in the college's vending machines) in an open meeting last year, and so now we have to. I'm really angry that one society's ethics has been brought into an entire union's activities.
    I would agree that it shouldn't be something forced on people, but it should be a choice. Though, the greater demand there is for fair trade products, the sooner big business will take notice and change.
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    (Original post by bilb)
    I would agree that it shouldn't be something forced on people, but it should be a choice. Though, the greater demand there is for fair trade products, the sooner big business will take notice and change.
    Think about that though, you're suggesting that big businesses are going to be willing to price their products above the market price?

    Something that the fair trade lobby need to acknowledge about fair trade is it's either a small scale selective operation, or it's not going to happen, as soon as you talk about applying fairtrade to the entire market then the model collapses because competition takes over.
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    (Original post by bilb)
    I would agree that it shouldn't be something forced on people, but it should be a choice. Though, the greater demand there is for fair trade products, the sooner big business will take notice and change.
    Fair Trade is bad. It is going to cause damage to Africa and will make poverty permanent, not history. So no, it's not good that there's a greater demand for it at all.
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    (Original post by englishstudent)
    Fair Trade is bad. It is going to cause damage to Africa and will make poverty permanent, not history. So no, it's not good that there's a greater demand for it at all.
    Reasoning and proof?
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    At the end of the day, even if Fair Trade harms Africa (although i am not sure how it would....) it should still be done. I mean, its FAIR trade. at the end of the day anything that is fair is the best for the greater population (maybe a generalisation). also if Fair Trade does go ahead, the effect on poverty will not be too significant (whether it be positive or negative) as there are many other factors affecting poverty - you may be solving only one problem out of 100 (or adding another problem).

    And in response to the original thread, Bob Geldof is a passionate fellow who does an extreme amount for his cause. And all those who say he should give everything away - that is stupid. He has never preached that. He doesnt believe in living life with no luxuries. He does MORE than his fair share. He is an amazing guy and people should look at him for inspiration. BE MORE LIKE BOB. and btw, i dont mean go charity crazy, i mean be passionate and act on that passion, with no restraints.

    (note: englishstudent please tell me how Fair Trade will damage Africa and make poverty permanent. thanks)
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    (Original post by bilb)
    Reasoning and proof?
    Fair trade by definition elevates the price paid for some of the supply of say, cocoa. So some supplier of cocoa in a region receives a subsidy for his cocoa, this puts other local suppliers out of business because they can't compete with somebody exporting subsidised cocoa. So now the subsidised supplier has a monopoly too, this supplier becomes inefficient and the country doesn't develop. That is it doesn't enjoy the technological development and the capital it would have accrued in a competitive market. Fair trade just puts otherwise competitive suppliers out of business, whilst making a region inefficient at something it has a unique advantage in compared to the west. This was the country's chance to develop, sabotaged.
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    (Original post by Zuber)
    At the end of the day, even if Fair Trade harms Africa (although i am not sure how it would....) it should still be done. I mean, its FAIR trade.
    It's fair? FAIR? That's quite a judgement to make. Fairness is something philosophers have spent centuries thinking about. Economists would probably define fairness as when supply hits demand. Suppliers are selling at the price consumers are willing to pay for, consumers are buying at the price suppliers are willing to sell at, and this price becomes the 'value' of the product. I think it's fair that a product is bought at its value as defined here, not at some artificial value.
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    (Original post by homoterror)
    Fair trade by definition elevates the price paid for some of the supply of say, cocoa. So some supplier of cocoa in a region receives a subsidy for his cocoa, this puts other local suppliers out of business because they can't compete with somebody exporting subsidised cocoa. So now the subsidised supplier has a monopoly too, this supplier becomes inefficient and the country doesn't develop. That is it doesn't enjoy the technological development and the capital it would have accrued in a competitive market. Fair trade just puts otherwise competitive suppliers out of business, whilst making a region inefficient at something it has a unique advantage in compared to the west. This was the country's chance to develop, sabotaged.
    Is it only some suppliers in a region that get subsidies - i thought it was whole regions at a time (therefore eliminating the local competition problem)
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    (Original post by homoterror)
    It's fair? FAIR? That's quite a judgement to make. Fairness is something philosophers have spent centuries thinking about. Economists would probably define fairness as when supply hits demand. Suppliers are selling at the price consumers are willing to pay for, consumers are buying at the price suppliers are willing to sell at, and this price becomes the 'value' of the product. I think it's fair that a product is bought at its value as defined here, not at some artificial value.
    I know fairness is a tough thing to define, seeing as everyone's version of fair alters (as you have shown) but i think the overall majority would agree that fair trade is fairer than normal trade
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    (Original post by eXis)
    Hes a saint. He is brilliant. Although, i do think hes very hotheaded. Sometimes goes around things int he wrong manner. However he is very passionate about the whole thing.
    Well, he's an ill-informed zealot who does more harm than good, so I guess that actually does qualify him as a saint.
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    (Original post by bilb)
    Reasoning and proof?
    Reasoning and proof.
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    (Original post by Zuber)
    Is it only some suppliers in a region that get subsidies - i thought it was whole regions at a time (therefore eliminating the local competition problem)
    Earlier in this thread I referred to the contradiction present here. If you try to fairtrade everything, then you're just shifting your demand curve upwards. And competition will undermine the entire operation. Fair trade has to be a small scale selective operation, or nothing at all.
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    (Original post by Zuber)
    the overall majority would agree that fair trade is fairer than normal trade
    that's because the majority of people haven't thought about it. you're basically basing it on the fact that it's called fair trade.

    I'm going to start stealing mobile phones, and call it the fair justice campaign.
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    (Original post by homoterror)
    Earlier in this thread I referred to the contradiction present here. If you try to fairtrade everything, then you're just shifting your demand curve upwards. And competition will undermine the entire operation. Fair trade has to be a small scale selective operation, or nothing at all.
    I didnt mean fairtrade everything. I mean, regions aren't EVERYTHING. just select regions that have been identified as suffered from unfair trade (i.e. the worse affected by the abusing producers)
 
 
 
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