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    (Original post by che guevara)
    Palestine is another example of the US and CIA terror.. well u ppl have lived all ur life in peaceful country so u dont know how someone feels when there is war and hunger.. i am not anti Jewesh or anything, but i am anti Israel.. Because Israel is a state of terror, But USA calls Hezbullah a terror group.. Its true, Hezbollah is a terror group and so is the Israelian army, which is supported by the USA.. DOWN with Israel..
    By what means would you prefer to destroy Israel?
    You dont believe in the existence of a Jewish homeland, but (surprise surprise) you arent anti-Jewish or "anything"?

    Seeing as im a little under the weather, perhaps you could amuse me by explaining how Israel is a terror regime?
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    (Original post by JonD)
    It would be. However, nobody at any point claimed it was from the BBC. Perhaps you would like to reveal your source, so it could go under scrutiny?
    There was the inference of bias and reference to the BBC - that is why I wanted to make it clear that the source was not the BBC.

    No, I would not like to reveal my source as it is irrelevant - it was a personal observation made during a visit that was not politically motivated - therefore any scrutiny would be invalid, unfair and diverting from the observations.
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    Listen here...., the Isralei state was created in 1948 the land was to the Arabs long before 1936, now look at what there doing? My Grandad was still around then when the Jewish State was formed..., their still fresh and not old, there all living it high coz theyve got their own state inside an arab land. I dont know alot about the isralei people but i may know why some people dont like the isralei state. israiel is being funded by the U.S providing them arms to use againts their neighbour which are the Arabs in Palestine. You give the Palestinan people Tanks, Guns the lot and i can assure you they wont be using bombs nor throwing stones.
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    (Original post by Vienna)
    By what means would you prefer to destroy Israel?
    You dont believe in the existence of a Jewish homeland, but (surprise surprise) you arent anti-Jewish or "anything"?

    Seeing as im a little under the weather, perhaps you could amuse me by explaining how Israel is a terror regime?
    I deliberately asked for original comments - not the same old same rehashing of argument. That does not add anything to the debate.
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    (Original post by Vienna)

    I support Palestinians who want a Palestinian state and peace with Israel.


    I dont support anyone that uses terrorism against people.
    Why dont you try and be fair.

    Most of the Palestinians want a livable Palestinian state

    and if you mean suicide bombing

    I condemn this in most cases

    but what about the massacars israelis do in Palestine
    when israel bomb the civilians with F-16
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    (Original post by yawn)
    I read the following report of a recent visit to Palestine by a reporter and his view of what he saw:

    "From the aggressive armed checkpoints to the hilltop forts and military spy posts - from the destruction and blockading of rural roads separating farmers from their land to the constant military overflights, it is clear the British and the Israelis have learned many tactics of oppression from each other over the years. (he had also visited Iraq)
    Last weekend's visit was a real eye-opener. It was obvious to me that the aim of the Israelis and those who back them is to make a Palestinian state unviable. Every effort is made to disrupt the lives of the Palestinian people - to prevent them farming - to prevent them bringing goods to market - to prevent them opening businesses - to prevent them from eking out an existence in their own land.
    This trip also brought home to me the reality of the spurious claims that Israel is removing its settlements from Palestine. While they claim to be dismantling some, other settlements continue to expand across the Palestinian territories. The 'Apartheid Wall' continues to be built deep inside Palestinian territory - divinding communities and in places cutting them off from vital natural resources, like water.
    This is about an aggressive, heavily militarised state, breaking international law after international law, brazenly flouting numerous UN resolutions without sanction, trying to break the will of Palestinian people.
    It cannot be allowed to continue unchallenged by the international community."

    Any original comments that breathe new life into the eternal debate?
    Can we look at this from the view of someone living in these conditions - regardless of what has happened to cause any perceived justification for it?
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    the father of modern terrorism
    :rolleyes:

    because they are fed ludicrous, anger ridden, biased articles like this one? Or is it because they are all jew-haiting maniacs?
    They are fed articles like this one? No, they are living through the experiences detailed in the article. And how is it biased? Having an opinion isn't being biased.

    They can mostly get away with it in the Israel/Palestine issue, because most viewers are ignorant of the background.
    All I've seen is reporters telling the truth. When they are out there in Palestine, they will tell the truth. The truth is pro-Palestinian. Newsreaders and every other non reporter are usually biased towards Israel.

    On June 9, the Correspondent series on BBC Television broadcast a report about the recent siege of the Church of the Nativity in Bethlehem. This was an exemplar of the problems identified in the Glasgow research. It was, in effect, an Israeli occupation propaganda film put out by the BBC. It was made as a co-production with an American channel, and the credits listed the producer as Israel Goldvicht, who runs an Israeli production company. That would have been fine had the filmmakers made any attempt to challenge the Israeli military with whom they had ingratiated themselves. "The Israelis were determined not to damage the buildings," began the narrator. "The international press were cleared from Manger Square, but we were allowed to stay and observe the Israeli operation..." With this "unique access" unexplained to the viewers, the film presented one Colonel Lior as the star good guy, guaranteeing "medical treatment to anyone wounded," saying a cheery hello on a mobile phone to a friend in Oxford Street and, like any colonial officer, speaking about and on behalf of the Palestinians.
    "Killers" were described by the colonel without challenge by the BBC/Israel Goldvicht team. They were "terrorists" and "gunmen," not those resisting the invasion of their homeland. Israel's right to "arrest" foreign peace protesters drew no query from the BBC. Not a single Palestinian was interviewed. As the sun set on his fine profile, the last word went to the good colonel. The issues between the Israelis and Palestinians, he said, "were personal points of view."
    Well, no. The brutal subjugation of the Palestinians is, under any interpretation of the law, an epic injustice, a crime in which the colonel plays a leading part. The BBC has always provided the best, most sophisticated propaganda service in the world, because matters of justice and injustice, right and wrong are simply usurped either by "balance" or by liberal sophistry; one is either "pro-Israeli" or "pro-Palestinian." Fiona Murch, the executive producer of Correspondent, told me that Israel Goldvicht Productions would not have won the "trust" of the Israeli army had the producer asked real journalistic questions. That was the way of "fly on the wall": a candid admission. "It was breaking a stereotype," she said. "It was about a good, decent man" (the colonel). She said I ought to have seen an earlier Correspondent series, which had Palestinians in it.
    I think she was trying to offer that as "balance" for "The Siege of Bethlehem"-a film that might be dismissed as cheap PR, were it not for its complicity with a regime that uses ethnic difference to deny human rights, imprisons people without charge or trial, and murders and tortures "systematically," says Amnesty.
    Goebbels would have approved.


    Please dont suggest that its the entire international community.
    It's has an apostrophe in it. I thought I'd chip in in regard to the pedantic stakes.
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    (Original post by Google)
    And they ask
    Why Palestinians bomb "israelis"
    Is that why Arab terrorism against Israel started from before Israel's creation through its first 20 years when its wasn't occupying Palestinian land, to right now?

    (Original post by Kayz)
    Listen here...., the Isralei state was created in 1948 the land was to the Arabs long before 1936, now look at what there doing? My Grandad was still around then when the Jewish State was formed..., their still fresh and not old, there all living it high coz theyve got their own state inside an arab land. I dont know alot about the isralei people but i may know why some people dont like the isralei state. israiel is being funded by the U.S providing them arms to use againts their neighbour which are the Arabs in Palestine. You give the Palestinan people Tanks, Guns the lot and i can assure you they wont be using bombs nor throwing stones.
    Is that why the Egyptians, Syrians, and Jordanians, all funded and armed to the teeth by the Soviet Union, were unable to take down Israel in 2 major wars, going as far as losing one of them in six days?

    (Original post by Google)
    Most of the Palestinians want a livable Palestinian state
    Most Palestinians don't recognize the existence of the state of Israel.

    but what about the massacars israelis do in Palestine
    when israel bomb the civilians with F-16
    When did that happen?
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    Is that why Arab terrorism against Israel started from before Israel's creation
    How does that one work

    Is that why the Egyptians, Syrians, and Jordanians, all funded and armed to the teeth by the Soviet Union, were unable to take down Israel in 2 major wars, going as far as losing one of them in six days?
    That says nothing about whether or not the Palestinians would still be using bombs and stones if they had their own army.
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    (Original post by Google)
    Most of the Palestinians want a livable Palestinian state
    and if you mean suicide bombing
    I condemn this in most cases
    Most cases?

    Does Hamas want a viable Palestinian state?

    How did Hamas do at the recent elections?

    but what about the massacars israelis do in Palestine
    when israel bomb the civilians with F-16
    Give me an example of a time when Israel indiscriminately bombed innocent Palestinian civilians.
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    (Original post by Kayz)
    Listen here...., the Isralei state was created in 1948 the land was to the Arabs long before 1936, now look at what there doing?
    The land belonged to the Ottomans, then the British. Israel was created on land where Jewish settlers had bought land from Arabs and made a living, becoming the prosperous majority.

    My Grandad was still around then when the Jewish State was formed..., their still fresh and not old, there all living it high coz theyve got their own state inside an arab land.
    Its not an arab land whatsoever. This is precisely the mentality of those who send their children to murder innocent Israelis, whether they be Arab or Jewish.

    I dont know alot about the isralei people but i may know why some people dont like the isralei state. israiel is being funded by the U.S providing them arms to use againts their neighbour which are the Arabs in Palestine.
    No, its against people like Jordan, Syria, Egypt, Lebanon who have declared war on Israel twice. They lost both times. If Israel didnt have these arms they would be dead, which is why the US gives them aid to survive. Its called 'belief in the right to exist'.

    You give the Palestinan people Tanks, Guns the lot and i can assure you they wont be using bombs nor throwing stones.
    Of course, they would be doing what the rest of there Arab brothers tried to do as a result of the nakhbar; ethnically cleansing the region of Jews.
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    (Original post by Vienna)
    Give me an example of a time when Israel indiscriminately bombed innocent Palestinian civilians.
    (Original post by Bismarck)
    When did that happen?
    Ok you people certianly are rubbing it in, your in this Debate and Discussion section speaking without even thinking..., or shall i say have never watched the news!! I'm getting bored of spoon feeding some of you's!

    read this article..., and before you say anything i went to CNN's website and got the first link they gave! http://www.adc.org/index.php?id=1933&type=100

    read along, and when you come to the last paragraph you will see what it says!

    "Israeli forces have used tanks and helicopter gunships against unarmed protesters and had bombed Palestinian cities under Israeli occupation with F-16 jets."


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    (Original post by Kayz)
    Ok you people certianly are rubbing it in, your in this Debate and Discussion section speaking without even thinking..., or shall i say have never watched the news!! I'm getting bored of spoon feeding some of you's!

    read this article..., and before you say anything i went to CNN's website and got the first link they gave! http://www.adc.org/index.php?id=1933&type=100

    read along, and when you come to the last paragraph you will see what it says!

    "Israeli forces have used tanks and helicopter gunships against unarmed protesters and had bombed Palestinian cities under Israeli occupation with F-16 jets."
    Funny, that isn't CNN at all. It's an ethnocentric organization whose first aim is "Empowering Arab Americans". We don't know it's repution, and it could very likely be prejudiced or even funded by terrorists, so I'm afriad it's about as risky as preferring the word of the IDF over Channel 4.
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    Thanks for providing such an unbiased source. :rolleyes:
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    (Original post by Kayz)
    Ok you people certianly are rubbing it in, your in this Debate and Discussion section speaking without even thinking..., or shall i say have never watched the news!! I'm getting bored of spoon feeding some of you's!

    read this article..., and before you say anything i went to CNN's website and got the first link they gave! http://www.adc.org/index.php?id=1933&type=100

    read along, and when you come to the last paragraph you will see what it says!

    "Israeli forces have used tanks and helicopter gunships against unarmed protesters and had bombed Palestinian cities under Israeli occupation with F-16 jets."
    Im quite aware that Israel has an airforce and that its airforce is used to carry out military operations in and around Israel.
    What im not aware of is an example of Israel indiscriminately bombing cities. I havent seen an example.
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    (Original post by Vienna)
    Im quite aware that Israel has an airforce and that its airforce is used to carry out military operations in and around Israel.
    What im not aware of is an example of Israel indiscriminately bombing cities. I havent seen an example.
    does it say indiscriminate in the article (or anywhere here - am confused).
    didnt they drop a one tonne bomb in a residential area killing loads of innocent civilians because intelligence reported a hamas leader may be in an nearby apartment building.
    then there was the gunships firing rockets at a car travelling through a busy marketplace...
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    (Original post by ToriB)
    does it say indiscriminate in the article (or anywhere here - am confused).
    didnt they drop a one tonne bomb in a residential area killing loads of innocent civilians because intelligence reported a hamas leader may be in an nearby apartment building.
    then there was the gunships firing rockets at a car travelling through a busy marketplace...
    Thats two examples of Israel carrying out targeted attacks on terrorists.
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    (Original post by JonD)
    Funny, that isn't CNN at all. It's an ethnocentric organization whose first aim is "Empowering Arab Americans". We don't know it's repution, and it could very likely be prejudiced or even funded by terrorists, so I'm afriad it's about as risky as preferring the word of the IDF over Channel 4.
    (Original post by Bismarck)
    Thanks for providing such an unbiased source. :rolleyes:
    lol you thought i wasnt prepared? i knew you'd say that. That is why i delibrately went to CNN's website and did my search, and guess what? it was thier first link! http://websearch.cnn.com/search/sear...ians+with+F-16 ohh my days, i'm taking a break now will be back later this afternoon,
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    (Original post by Kayz)
    lol you thought i wasnt prepared? i knew you'd say that. That is why i delibrately went to CNN's website and did my search, and guess what? it was thier first link! http://websearch.cnn.com/search/sear...ians+with+F-16 ohh my days, i'm taking a break now will be back later this afternoon,
    You did a search of the internet on the CNN website. None of those links are to CNN.
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    (Original post by Kayz)
    lol you thought i wasnt prepared? i knew you'd say that. That is why i delibrately went to CNN's website and did my search, and guess what? it was thier first link! http://websearch.cnn.com/search/sear...ians+with+F-16 ohh my days, i'm taking a break now will be back later this afternoon,
    The title of that page is 'Searched the WEB for "israel bomb the civilians with F-16"' - not "searched CNN for news articles". The resulting link is on the website of the "American-Arab Anti-Discrimination Committee" - not CNN. I'm sorry, but if that news article is automatically supported by CNN, because the CNN search engine found it, Google is a neo-Nazi organisation because "Evil Elders of Zion plot to conquer the world with sex change bagels" lists Aryan Nations and Stormfront.
 
 
 
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