Turn on thread page Beta
    Offline

    1
    ReputationRep:
    umm...the test at lords was KPs first test - he held it together very well.
    If Bells was an element of immaturity in test cricket, he shouldn't have been there - considering it is such an important series. If we had lost the ashes I personally would have pointed the finger at him as being one of the major negatives in the series for England.
    Offline

    15
    ReputationRep:
    I agree tresco can score fast...but, then again, KP can score at a strike rate of over 100 - in the ODI's in SA it was up around 130 consistently - you cant argue with that sort of batting! :d
    But you don't want him facing the new ball - middle order players are best kept in the middle order.
    Offline

    14
    (Original post by bikerx23)
    I would not have done this had I been the ashes coach, but then we weren't in this position of chasing a high total in a short period of time.
    Personally Bell does not impress me - granted his performances on this tour have been worthy of a place in the team, but he was gash in the ashes - when we need to keep wickets in hand, he goes first ball to mcgrath.
    I agree tresco can score fast...but, then again, KP can score at a strike rate of over 100 - in the ODI's in SA it was up around 130 consistently - you cant argue with that sort of batting! :d
    How about that fact that Pietersen doesn't understand how to play Pakistan spinners, and it's day 5 on a dusty wicket which Afridi has scuffed up and the Butt/Inzy have run all over?

    How can Bell not impress you? I just bumped the ashes thread about Bell, as I was the only one defending him then, and I thought this had proven me right, but people still criticise him. :eek:

    He's young, and was facing the best team in the world. Give the guy a break, EVERYONE gets low totals. some people have 99 averages and get ducks in their last game.

    Bell and Tresco are our batsman on form, and to shove them right down the order in place of Pietersen (see first line), Jones (bye bye off stump) and Freddie... one decent innings out of 3.... well, what are you on? :p:
    Offline

    1
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by bikerx23)
    umm...the test at lords was KPs first test - he held it together very well.
    If Bells was an element of immaturity in test cricket, he shouldn't have been there - considering it is such an important series. If we had lost the ashes I personally would have pointed the finger at him as being one of the major negatives in the series for England.
    No one suggested immaturity !

    Experience of Test Cricket is critical for all players !

    Pointing the finger doesnt solve problems its always a team game there will always be people who dont perform whether its Bell or Giles !

    Some players have good starts KP for eg some greats have poor series starts before they are used to Test Cricket and capitalise !

    You need to stick with your team not chop and change unless absolutely necessary ! KP has had his failures !
    Offline

    14
    I'd also like to mention that a lot of people were critical of Flintoff when he started, he was fat, lazy, and not good enough basically.

    But I defended him then, saying he'll come good. Look at him now.

    I say the same about Bell in the ashes, look at this series.

    Some people just take a while to get into the swing of things, test matches aren't easy, Bell isn't used to facing Warne, Lee, Shoiab, Kaneria.... but he's already showing signs of coming good.

    When he gets more confident from this, and he will, he might think about scoring faster. Right now he's doing the right thing, because he needs good scores to stay in the team, no matter how slowly they come.

    I have seen him score quickly before... he just hasn't needed to yet. If he needs to tomorrow he might well do so.
    Offline

    14
    (Original post by bikerx23)
    show off.
    Replace him with Thorpe my ass.
    Offline

    1
    ReputationRep:
    I agree with you, but I think the selectors got it wrong in picking such inexperienced players - that counts for bell and pietersen - I believe thorpe, despite his age, has played in the ashes many times, and should have been one of the first names on the list.
    Looking at the importance and pressure of the ashes, would you really want to bring people in for it to be their first full test series?
    Giles did get some stick and deservedly so, the difference is though is that he reacted, and showed that the selectors faith in him was justified. Bell did not.
    Admittedly - KP did have his failures in the test, for example the goldie he got of mcgrath, although it wasn't at a crucial stage, still unacceptable. But, I recall bell having one decent innings out of ten?

    --------------

    I agree test players need to garner experience, but I just think it was very badly timed - The ashes are as big as the world cup, bigger I would say for the players involved, especially the downtrodden english team.
    Offline

    1
    ReputationRep:
    they should have at the time. Also, KP should have played against bangladesh.
    Offline

    14
    (Original post by bikerx23)
    I agree with you, but I think the selectors got it wrong in picking such inexperienced players - that counts for bell and pietersen - I believe thorpe, despite his age, has played in the ashes many times, and should have been one of the first names on the list.
    Looking at the importance and pressure of the ashes, would you really want to bring people in for it to be their first full test series?
    Giles did get some stick and deservedly so, the difference is though is that he reacted, and showed that the selectors faith in him was justified. Bell did not.
    Admittedly - KP did have his failures in the test, for example the goldie he got of mcgrath, although it wasn't at a crucial stage, still unacceptable. But, I recall bell having one decent innings out of ten?

    --------------

    I agree test players need to garner experience, but I just think it was very badly timed - The ashes are as big as the world cup, bigger I would say for the players involved, especially the downtrodden english team.
    You're forgetting that to be the best you need to play the best. You can't just say Thorpe you take Aussies on good bowling pitches, and Bell... you take Pakistan on a flat pitch.

    What happens when Thorpe retires and Bell is the only person available and is forced to play Australia? He'd get out all the time. But now he can learn from his mistakes, and now hes regained confidence I think he'll be getting good totals next ashes.

    I'm a big believer in young over old, and am very happy with our prospects. We have a young spinenr who actually spins, shock horror, to replace Giles in a few years... our pace bowlers all young, and our batting is fine. Not having to rely on oldies like Thorpe, despite what you say.

    If you had it your way Gough and Caddick would be out there instead of Flintoff and Harmie because you'd have never let those two get underway in their careers because they started badly...
    Offline

    1
    ReputationRep:
    Slow Developer !

    Started Unlucky in 2 inninings !

    But the long term benefits much overweigh the slow start !

    Ashes was best experience possible !







    (Original post by bikerx23)
    I agree with you, but I think the selectors got it wrong in picking such inexperienced players - that counts for bell and pietersen - I believe thorpe, despite his age, has played in the ashes many times, and should have been one of the first names on the list.
    Looking at the importance and pressure of the ashes, would you really want to bring people in for it to be their first full test series?
    Giles did get some stick and deservedly so, the difference is though is that he reacted, and showed that the selectors faith in him was justified. Bell did not.
    Admittedly - KP did have his failures in the test, for example the goldie he got of mcgrath, although it wasn't at a crucial stage, still unacceptable. But, I recall bell having one decent innings out of ten?

    --------------

    I agree test players need to garner experience, but I just think it was very badly timed - The ashes are as big as the world cup, bigger I would say for the players involved, especially the downtrodden english team.
    Offline

    14
    (Original post by pete77)
    Ashes was best experience possible !
    Finally somebody who agrees with me on that!
    Offline

    1
    ReputationRep:
    Tis Me Lord - I can understand why you say that, but it is not true.
    I would have advocated thorpe play instead of bell for the ashes, and have brought bell in for this series - As I said, the ashes, in my opinion is too important to be blooding new players in.
    The bowling attack is fine as it is in my opinion - although I reckon anderson should have been reserve instead of tremlett.

    Also, yes - playing the ashes is the best possible experience, since it is amazingly tough - which is exactly why it shouldn't be your first series.
    Offline

    15
    ReputationRep:
    Thorpe shot himself in the foot when he said he wasn't going to tour Pakistan.

    Pietersen it had to be, you don't want people debuting overseas in somewhere like Pakistan - just ask Shaggy :p:

    --------------

    (Original post by bikerx23)
    The bowling attack is fine as it is in my opinion - although I reckon anderson should have been reserve instead of tremlett.
    Anderson is there...
    Offline

    1
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Socrates)
    Anderson is there...
    I was talking ashes...
    Offline

    15
    ReputationRep:
    Not to put too fine a point on it, Bell debuted against Bangladesh not the Aussies.
    Offline

    1
    ReputationRep:
    Thorpe would have been invaluable but Bell is a potential Thorpe !
    Offline

    15
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by tis_me_lord)
    We have a young spinenr who actually spins, shock horror, to replace Giles in a few years...
    Hope you're not talking about Shaggy? :eek: :p:
    Offline

    1
    ReputationRep:
    ok - admittedly he did have his debut test series against bangladesh, if you can really count that as a tes though - as boycott remarked.
    Admittedly bell is a potential thorpe, but, the fact that it was remarked that thorpe would retire after the ashes would mean that there would be no conflict as to whether to take bell or thorpe, therefore the perfect opportunity.
    These points do, ofcourse fit equally as well for KP, but its harder to stick them on him since he performed so well.

    The point made before that flintoff was at the same stage once is right - but, to blood a player against the best team in the world in the most important test series the world has is in my opinion ridiculous and just stupid.
    Offline

    1
    ReputationRep:
    A spinner who spins !

    That is big news send him off to tour now !

    We need turn on turning pitches !
    Offline

    14
    (Original post by pete77)
    A spinner who spins !

    That is big news send him off to tour now !

    We need turn on turning pitches !
    He's too young, it might sound like it from my last few posts but I don't exactly want toddlers on the pitch...

    As for the whole Pietersen did well, Bell didn't, so ger rid of Bell.

    A - can't predict that beforehand.
    B - Pietersen was lucky to get his 150, dropped a lot, would you be saying this if he'd been out earlier, his series wasn't that great really...
 
 
 
Turn on thread page Beta
TSR Support Team

We have a brilliant team of more than 60 Support Team members looking after discussions on The Student Room, helping to make it a fun, safe and useful place to hang out.

This forum is supported by:
Updated: March 28, 2006
The home of Results and Clearing

3,399

people online now

1,567,000

students helped last year
Poll
A-level students - how do you feel about your results?
Useful resources

Quick link:

Unanswered sport threads

Groups associated with this forum:

View associated groups

The Student Room, Get Revising and Marked by Teachers are trading names of The Student Room Group Ltd.

Register Number: 04666380 (England and Wales), VAT No. 806 8067 22 Registered Office: International House, Queens Road, Brighton, BN1 3XE

Write a reply...
Reply
Hide
Reputation gems: You get these gems as you gain rep from other members for making good contributions and giving helpful advice.