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EMA (Education Maintenance Allowance)- The poll. watch

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    (Original post by veryjammy)
    Quit being so petty and begrudging the poorer families some much needed assistance.
    Showing an interest in where taxpayers money is going?

    when i go to university this year, and when my sister goes in 2 years time, my parents are not going to be able to fund the whole cost, and i've worked out that my shortfall is going to be around £3,000 p/year, thats right, SHORTFALL. Do "poorer" students go to university with a £3,000 shortfall? Of course not, the government dips into tax payers money to spoon feed them.

    THAT is why i am annoyed, when even more money is handed out to select groups of people, that serves no particular good. How do you know people aren't buying drugs with their educational maintenance handouts?
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    (Original post by beekeeper_)
    Showing an interest in where taxpayers money is going?

    when i go to university this year, and when my sister goes in 2 years time, my parents are not going to be able to fund the whole cost, and i've worked out that my shortfall is going to be around £3,000 p/year, thats right, SHORTFALL. Do "poorer" students go to university with a £3,000 shortfall? Of course not, the government dips into tax payers money to spoon feed them.

    THAT is why i am annoyed, when even more money is handed out to select groups of people, that serves no particular good. How do you know people aren't buying drugs with their educational maintenance handouts?
    Don't you get any help towards your tuition fees then?
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    (Original post by veryjammy)
    Oh blah blah blah, poor little me in my 35 grand a year family begrudging someone from a 12 grand a year family 30 quid a week so they don't have to leave and get a dead-end job in a corner shop somewhere. It's typical middle class outrage at the fact that someone else is getting something they're not. Quit being so petty and begrudging the poorer families some much needed assistance.
    before we get so snobby, lets just remember who pays the greatest majority of taxes in this country? i think the british tax payer, from whatever their background - middle class or whatever, is entitled to know why their money is being wasted.

    as we've said before, money specifically targeted to help students in the form of subsidised school trips, free bus passes etc etc. is a good thing. but in it's current form it's only being wasted.

    EMA would be unneccessary if school trips were subsidised. noone dies because they can't afford to own a car or buy beer every satuday night (one of the worthwhile causes some of my friends EMA goes towards). the truth is, we could ALL use more money, but do we actually need it? i don't think so.
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    (Original post by inequality)
    Don't you get any help towards your tuition fees then?
    £3,880, and i'll be a London student.

    A "poor" student will get free tuition, and a £5,175 loan.


    Do you think £3,880 is enough for accomodation, living costs, and tuition?
    It is a few thousand out, and even with my parents forking out a pretty substantial amount, i'll still have almost an annual £3,000 shotfall.

    A "poor" student, however, will quite easily be able to spread the cost of accomodation and living costs (don't have to pay tuition) with a healthy £5,175 handout.

    My point, is that there is enough cash incentives out there already, surely there is a better sollution than Tony Blairs method of chucking money at problems?
    Paying people to attend education is sending out all of the wrong messages.
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    For a start, this is about EMA at college, it's nothing to do with uni, don't mix up the two.

    Secondly, I really don't care what they do with their 30 pound a week. A lot of people in very poor families will probably use it for their bus fares or to contribute to their families general upkeep or whatever. However I do not begrudge people sometimes spending it on themselves,whether that be a night out, or new clothes or whatever. At the end of the day, if all someone's life is is education with nothing to look forward to outside the school environment and no money to spend on oneself, then it's not a particularly fulfilling life. If they received nothing, they would be less likely to continue because they would have no life outside the school gates, hence they would be more likely to quit and get a dead-end job just so they could afford to have some semblance of a social life or afford basic luxuries.

    People have a very narrow view of what the EMA is about, the usage of it on school books and bus fares isn't the only useful and productive way the student can use it.

    And if you're determined to bring uni into it, it's absolutely right poorer families get more help. If you have someone on 12 grand a year, and someone on 30-35 grand a year, you give the help to the poor family. There has to be a cut-off somewhere and it may be unfortunate for someone on the edge of that cut-off point but there are cut-off points for EVERYTHING.
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    (Original post by veryjammy)
    A lot of people in very poor families will probably use it for their bus fares or to contribute to their families general upkeep or whatever.
    This is not simply an issue of the "very poor families". There are students entitled to this that come from a family where income is a healthy £25-30k, these people are hardly needy individuals.
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    And they get less accordingly, it gets reduced to around 10 pound a week from what I remember. Like I said though, you have to have a cut-off point somewhere. If they cut off at 20 grand, people on 21 grand would be complaining. The fact that they've cut it off at 30 grand however, gets up the backs of the noisy affluent middle-classes and hence much more fuss is made and attention received.
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    (Original post by veryjammy)
    And they get less accordingly, it gets reduced to around 10 pound a week from what I remember. Like I said though, you have to have a cut-off point somewhere. If they cut off at 20 grand, people on 21 grand would be complaining. The fact that they've cut it off at 30 grand however, gets up the backs of the noisy affluent middle-classes and hence much more fuss is made and attention received.
    Look, the fact that ANYBODY from a household income between £25-30k is receiving handouts is unacceptable.

    I am not complaining because people on £31k do not get this extra cash, far from it!
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    So you'd be happy if the cut-off was 25k then? In which case, what are we arguing about?
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    Out of interest, how many people here actually receive, or are eligible to receive, EMA? And how many of you objecting to families on "a healthy 25k" receiving EMA actually live in that situation? It's not just about the child on EMA, it's also about the other children in that family - if one can be more financially independent of his parents, then more family money can go towards the upkeep of the others, or to uni expenses (which I too will have immense difficulty in meeting, especially with two siblings at university and my parents' single income), or even towards pensions for the parents.
    In my experience - living in an "inner-city" area up north, attending a multicutural state school with a huge proportion of its kids on free school meals - no one comes to sixth form just for the EMA, it's not worth it. It does help many poorer kids buy the materials they need and even get to school in the mornings. Schools simply cannot afford to supply all the textbooks, for example, that people need, so EMA often helps with that - especially (as can often be the case in poorer families) the parents can't or won't contribute much to their child's education. Free transport to school is certainly a good idea. Go tell your MP that.
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    ok i read half of this so im not entirely sure if what i said has been mentioned
    and i believe you are only able to get it untill you hit 19. then you don't least i don't think so. a few people who i knew who needed it couldn't get it

    for people in colelge who live away from home or who have parents who will not lend or give them the money for education but there parents are earning to much for them to get there ema go without alot.

    my college provides a library were we borrow out the text books we needs and have to check them in every term to make sure we still have them and hand them in at the end of the course. i spend my ema allowence half i give to my mum to help towards the house.. not tha £15 a week is much but i try. half of what is left for food through out the week and the other half for buying materials such as pads of paper folder ect.

    if i didn't have ema. my mum would have to pay out more to help me with buying paper ect.

    sure some people just use it to by an xbox. and crap but others really do need it.

    also now its not as easy to as just qualifying and being in college.
    for me to get it each week i have to attend every lesson on time. authorized absences cancel out ema for me which has basicaly left me with very little ema.

    the bonus's i really see no point for. i know i'm not going to recieve mine because i qualify for everything grades and work wise but not attendance. but if i did i would give it straight over to my mom. all it is is a random pay out of £100 if your doing good. you get four of these bonus's in a year.

    but a payout of £30 a week is essential to some people. i could get by with out it. but i know of people who can't and when they are of sick for one day have nothing to eat the next week in college ect.
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    (Original post by Madelyn)
    Out of interest, how many people here actually receive, or are eligible to receive, EMA? And how many of you objecting to families on "a healthy 25k" receiving EMA actually live in that situation?
    just because we're not in that situation doesn't mean we can't critiscise the system. our opinions are equally as valid.
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    When did I say you couldn't criticise the system? Firstly, I asked "out of interest", since the people here objecting to EMA appeared to be the ones not getting it. Secondly, many of your ideas about poorer (<30k p.a., to use the EMA definition) families seemed to be somewhat misguided.
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    (Original post by beekeeper_)
    £3,880, and i'll be a London student.

    A "poor" student will get free tuition, and a £5,175 loan.


    Do you think £3,880 is enough for accomodation, living costs, and tuition?
    It is a few thousand out, and even with my parents forking out a pretty substantial amount, i'll still have almost an annual £3,000 shotfall.

    A "poor" student, however, will quite easily be able to spread the cost of accomodation and living costs (don't have to pay tuition) with a healthy £5,175 handout.

    My point, is that there is enough cash incentives out there already, surely there is a better sollution than Tony Blairs method of chucking money at problems?
    Paying people to attend education is sending out all of the wrong messages.
    I agree with what you're saying. It is unfair that you get very little while someone on 25-30k gets everything.

    But there are some who need all the support. Like those on less than 15k. I think that instead of dividing it into bands, they should have a continous line, so support is proportional to income. That means that the people at the top of their band don't have taxpayers money when they don't particularly need it, and those at the bottom don't loose out.

    Bottom line, I think that those who are bright enough to do higher education should not be discouraged by the cost, but that those who won't benefit greatly from higher education should not be persuaded to do it because it's an easy £30 a week.
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    (Original post by Madelyn)
    When did I say you couldn't criticise the system? Firstly, I asked "out of interest", since the people here objecting to EMA appeared to be the ones not getting it. Secondly, many of your ideas about poorer (<30k p.a., to use the EMA definition) families seemed to be somewhat misguided.
    i never made any statements about people who's familes earned less than £30k a year. and your statement was irrelevant - it doesn't matter whether i get it or not. it's still wrong in principle.
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    (Original post by ant87)
    just because we're not in that situation doesn't mean we can't critiscise the system. our opinions are equally as valid.
    Of course they are. But your opinion would be likely to change if you were in that situation.
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    (Original post by Madelyn)
    Out of interest, how many people here actually receive, or are eligible to receive, EMA? And how many of you objecting to families on "a healthy 25k" receiving EMA actually live in that situation? It's not just about the child on EMA, it's also about the other children in that family - if one can be more financially independent of his parents, then more family money can go towards the upkeep of the others, or to uni expenses (which I too will have immense difficulty in meeting, especially with two siblings at university and my parents' single income), or even towards pensions for the parents.
    In my experience - living in an "inner-city" area up north, attending a multicutural state school with a huge proportion of its kids on free school meals - no one comes to sixth form just for the EMA, it's not worth it. It does help many poorer kids buy the materials they need and even get to school in the mornings. Schools simply cannot afford to supply all the textbooks, for example, that people need, so EMA often helps with that - especially (as can often be the case in poorer families) the parents can't or won't contribute much to their child's education. Free transport to school is certainly a good idea. Go tell your MP that.
    Regardless of how much your parents may earn, be it 10k or 50k, you would be in serious trouble if your parents won't contribute to your education.
    Not all middle class parents throw money at the educational needs of their children.
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    (Original post by inequality)
    Of course they are. But your opinion would be likely to change if you were in that situation.
    i will be honest that is very true.
    2 or 3 years ago if some one told about people randomly getting £30 a week i'd need some one to explain to me why cause alot of people just spend it on junk in my college.
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    (Original post by inequality)
    Of course they are. But your opinion would be likely to change if you were in that situation.

    Perhaps when you start paying taxes, your opinion will change?
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    (Original post by beekeeper_)
    Perhaps when you start paying taxes, your opinion will change?
    Do you pay taxes?
 
 
 
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