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    (Original post by Lawz-)
    I didnt rep you.

    Don't worry I'm 99% sure who it was! lol
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    (Original post by thebucketwoman)
    Because you can't choose to have centralised (as it is now) with independent nations (as it is now). Its made to look as though pro-Europe people (like myself) want a nation of federal states, which isn't true.

    So if I voted for centralised federal (which I don't believe in) it would fuel the Tory argument that we're going to become federal, and if I voted for decentralised nations (which I don't believe in) it would look as though I want the EU to become less centralised!
    Not really, I would say that the choices are relative and inter-dependent.

    It is only "decentralised" when compared to a federal Europe...
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    (Original post by Lawz-)
    Not really, I would say that the choices are relative and inter-dependent.

    It is only "decentralised" when compared to a federal Europe...
    Well I disagree but ok.

    It was just fun winding up beekeeper...
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    This is interesting. It seems to me that you can see that a centralised Europe is a bad thing to have but if you admit that a decentralised Europe is a better option, you will appear to have conceded defeat. Thus you blame the poll of bias, completely undeservedly, as an excuse not to answer the question.

    Please, just answer the question. Which would you prefer?
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    (Original post by TheVlad)
    This is interesting. It seems to me that you can see that a centralised Europe is a bad thing to have but if you admit that a decentralised Europe is a better option, you will appear to have conceded defeat. Thus you blame the poll of bias, completely undeservedly, as an excuse not to answer the question.

    Please, just answer the question. Which would you prefer?

    I agree, he's just avoiding the issue - typical labour.
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    I want the EU to be as centralised as it currently is, and with independent nation states as we currently have.

    So which one do I vote for?
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    (Original post by thebucketwoman)
    I want the EU to be as centralised as it currently is, and with independent nation states as we currently have.

    So which one do I vote for?
    The latter one.
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    (Original post by Lawz-)
    The latter one.
    But that says decentralised. Who's to say what that means?

    If I agree with the European parliament or the Euro, can I still say I want a decentralised Europe?
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    (Original post by thebucketwoman)
    But that says decentralised. Who's to say what that means?

    If I agree with the European parliament or the Euro, can I still say I want a decentralised Europe?
    Decentralised as opposed to federal.
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    (Original post by Lawz-)
    Decentralised as opposed to federal.
    Beekeeper defined centralisation as economically and politically.
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    (Original post by thebucketwoman)
    Beekeeper defined centralisation as economically and politically.
    Yes. Federal. How much more centralised can you get - aside from a simple European country.
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    If decentralised is defined as just meaning sovereign nations i'll vote for the second one.
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    (Original post by Lawz-)
    Yes. Federal. How much more centralised can you get - aside from a simple European country.
    economic centralisation - the Euro
    political centralisation - European parliament/constitution

    Nothing to do with sovreignity.
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    (Original post by thebucketwoman)
    If decentralised is defined as just meaning sovereign nations i'll vote for the second one.
    its a poll with TWO options... of course they are fairly rough and ready - but the question is which would you prefer.

    Which would you prefer - Ebola or Dysentry? - You cant really answer neither...
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    (Original post by thebucketwoman)
    economic centralisation - the Euro
    political centralisation - European parliament/constitution

    Nothing to do with sovreignity.
    nothing to do with sovereignty?

    How on earth?

    Handing over fiscal policy to the ECB and legislative powers to another?

    The very definition of an issue of sovereignty.
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    (Original post by Lawz-)
    nothing to do with sovereignty?

    How on earth?

    Handing over fiscal policy to the ECB and legislative powers to another?

    The very definition of an issue of sovereignty.
    You've just demonstrated my point. I disagree with what you just said, and therefore the definition of centralisation is debatable. You can only answer the poll if you agree with what you just said - ie. the tory perspective.
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    (Original post by thebucketwoman)
    You've just demonstrated my point. I disagree with what you just said, and therefore the definition of centralisation is debatable. You can only answer the poll if you agree with what you just said - ie. the tory perspective.
    Is the ability of a state to define its own laws and economic policy not part of its sovereignty?
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    (Original post by thebucketwoman)
    You've just demonstrated my point. I disagree with what you just said, and therefore the definition of centralisation is debatable. You can only answer the poll if you agree with what you just said - ie. the tory perspective.
    Im sorry - but its not a matter of debate - its a simple fact.

    Hading over fiscal powers and legislative powers to another body other than Parliament IS - by definition - a transfer of sovereignty.

    Its not a matter for debate.
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    (Original post by Lawz-)
    Im sorry - but its not a matter of debate - its a simple fact.

    Hading over fiscal powers and legislative powers to another body other than Parliament IS - by definition - a transfer of sovereignty.

    Its not a matter for debate.
    I think it is, and there are others that would debate that very thing.

    I don't have time to do the research.
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    Surely since the labour and lib-dem approaches are pro-european constitution and pro-euro (although gordon's doing his best for britains tories stalling this one...) It is not a question only tories can answer - The party line would indicate that you are pro centralisation and federalisation of britain - whether that is your opinion is a different matter ofcourse, since your never going to agree with every policy of your party.
 
 
 
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