MPhil in IR (part 2): Where to go?

claire,
i got a slim envelope from the department with the said contract, but i got a fat one from new college with all the stuff about enrolling in the college and uni (it's a LOT of stuff, around 70-100 pages in all, including packs etc..). I imagine that your college will get in touch with you as well before the end of the month. i think it depends on the efficiency of each college's admissions secretry etc.
hope that covers it!
M

Reply 22

newbie38

Hello All,

I've been reading all your posts and had a few questions to ask, which you guys/gals may be able to help me with. I have just finished a law degree from King's, London but want to apply for the MSc IR at LSE and the MPhil at Cambridge (I don't want to do the 2 yr degree at Oxford). The thing is I got a 2:1 overall but, it was quite high. But, the MPhil at Cambridge states they want a 1st or a high 2:1. So, I wanted to know if all the successful candidates on this board received 1sts in their degrees and whether I might still have a good chance with a 2;1 in law?

Thanks

Reply 23

OP

newbie38

Hello All,

I've been reading all your posts and had a few questions to ask, which you guys/gals may be able to help me with. I have just finished a law degree from King's, London but want to apply for the MSc IR at LSE and the MPhil at Cambridge (I don't want to do the 2 yr degree at Oxford). The thing is I got a 2:1 overall but, it was quite high. But, the MPhil at Cambridge states they want a 1st or a high 2:1. So, I wanted to know if all the successful candidates on this board received 1sts in their degrees and whether I might still have a good chance with a 2;1 in law?

Thanks

I graduated from a U.S. university with the equivalent of a 1st in my degree. Surprisingly, the academic requirements at Cambridge were much more rigorous than at Oxford - the former requires a minimum U.S. GPA of 3.85, while the latter requires only 3.8.

Reply 24

hey there,
i got a 1st, and unfortunately i can tell you that eventhough it says otherwise on their admissions sites and statements, neither oxford nor lse IR programs will taken you with a 2:1. I say that because one of my classmates was accepted provisionally at the LSE for IR, but subsequently had the offer rescinded when he failed to get a 1st (by a very narrow margin).
As for Cambridge IR, I don't know if you can, de facto, bag a place with a 2:1. I imagine if you did another masters and got a distinction prior to applying for IR that would definitely help (it says so on the LSE website at least). I do know that the Cambridge program, regardless of what it claims, is the least competitive out of the oxbridge + lse three. I think they accept aroud 80 out of 450 or so, so those are fairly good odds, certainly much better than the corresponding odds for oxford or the lse.
another factor to keep in mind is the work samples that cambridge IR ask for, as well as the references from your dons, your research proposal (CRUCIAL), and your CV in general. I think you should definitely put in a huge effort into your research proposal (it took me quite a while), and hopefully you got on well with your dons at Kings so they can wax lyrical about your capabilites when needed. A final factor is what your undergraduate degree was, I think EcPol and Law are most useful, as well as history and the rest of the soc. sci's.
hope that helps and best of luck, fingers crossed!
regards,
Madjdy

Reply 25

ClaireLeigh

Hi there,

To add my 2 pence worth to the discussion; I think it is worth giving Cambridge a go, as you get the feeling that the odds are much more in your favour (vis a vis Oxford, which takes 18-20 or so out of some 400 applicants). In terms of grades, i got a good first from Cambridge, which i think helps, but it certainly is not the be all and end all in my opinion. A solid research proposal, targetted at a specific supervisor's interests (you have to play the game with these applications) will get you a long way, as will killer references (so be nice to whoever you intend to nominate). The only problem you might encounter is if whoever does the initial sifting of applications uses degree classifications as a lazy first hurdle. They really shouldn't do this however, and if the masses of time it took Cambridge to send out offers is anything to go by, they do look at the applications more carefully than that.

Hope that helps, and good luck!

Claire

Ps- if you speak french you should consider Science Po in Paris too, and what about some of the US courses? There is more to life than the 'Golden Triangle' of London, Oxford and Cambridge..

Reply 26

claire your message brought a smile to my face...
glad to see i wasn't the only one who played the 'let's make up a research proposal that would interest the professors i am applying to' game. lol. i proposed something about nuclear proliferation in the middle east, which I am so genuinely interested in.....
great minds think alike :wink:

M
PS also regarding sciences-po, did anyone else notice how they nicked their prospectus for Ir and public administration almost VERBATIM from columbia's SIPA prospectus? classic.

Reply 27

newbie38

Hi thanks for the info,

I thought that maybe because law is quite a hard degree (esp at my uni) they would view a 2:1 (a high one at that highly)...I also wanted to know whether a law degree would be a hinderance for these course because its not IR/Politics related. I did Government & Politics at A'level and got an A. I have also done alot of internships at Government orgs both in the UK & Overseas. I want to do a thesis which combines my legal education with IR. Any inside info on current IR issues or basic texts to read to get up-to-date? All your advice is appreciated :smile:

Reply 28

OP

newbie38

Any inside info on current IR issues or basic texts to read to get up-to-date? All your advice is appreciated :smile:

I recommend "International Relations Theory: Realism, Pluralism, Globalism, and Beyond" by Paul R. Viotti and Mark V. Kauppi (3rd ed.). It functions as both a textbook for upper-level undergraduates and postgraduate students and as a reader, with descriptions of competing theories and key articles written by leading IR scholars.

Reply 29

Hi all,

Thanks for your information about the contract from the department. I think I need to wait for another week or so until the package comes to Japan.
One minor problem is that I have already booked a flight that will arrive in London on the first day of October, since my college could not guarantee me a room prior to that date...there seem to be some discordance between the dep and my college. I just hope the dep is not expecting we international students to be there on September 28 for serious reasons...

Concerning the application, I quite much agree with Claire. There is no reason to give up Cambridge, Science Po or any other university as long as they meet your requirement. At the earlier stages of the selection process some universities might chose students simply on the basis of scores, but if you make a very impressive proposal, get a fancy reference I think you will have a chance. Also if you get a scholarship confirmed before the submission of the application it may help.

Good luck!

Shohei

Reply 30

ClaireLeigh

Actually, the irony is that my application was prepared by a series of trials and errors, as i knew very little about IR or Oxford's specialisms within it, so i ended up not focussing it at all on what the profs at Oxford actually seem to research (which is why i recommended that one should try to do this!), and have proposed to write about something that in retrospect sounds far too touchy-feely for the supervisors at Oxford (the proposal is on migration, and transnational influences on inter-state discourse..). I hope that whoever they have in mind to teach me can help me refine my ideas, as they really were the product of 2 days fairly random reading in the BL. What do you think?

Rob, thanks for the book recommendation. I get the feeling i need to start doing some basic reading before October...

Yours, panicking slightly,

Claire

Madjdy

claire your message brought a smile to my face...
glad to see i wasn't the only one who played the 'let's make up a research proposal that would interest the professors i am applying to' game. lol. i proposed something about nuclear proliferation in the middle east, which I am so genuinely interested in.....
great minds think alike :wink:

M
PS also regarding sciences-po, did anyone else notice how they nicked their prospectus for Ir and public administration almost VERBATIM from columbia's SIPA prospectus? classic.

Reply 31

to newbie: I don't think doing law would hold you back in the least. as you know IR is quite a vast subject with various branches within it: international law is quite a significant branch and as such having a LLM would put you in good stead , even more so seeing as you have considerable work experience in gov't etc (compared to me, who has worked a grand total of zero minutes my whole life).

as regards reading lists, well this site at oxford IR has all our reading lists, so browse at your pleasure:
http://www.politics.ox.ac.uk/teaching/grad_ir/readinglist/index.asp

to shohei: I don't think you'll be missing out on much by comign on the 1/10. international orientation has nothing to do with the deparment whose orientation starts on 3/10, it is more or less a welcome to england, telling you about life, and walking you around oxford, and gettin you settled in. often a police officer comes along and explains the dangers involved in staying out past 8 pm, or alternatively the international office at uni will throw a sumptuous bash for the freshers involving crisps and squash with olivia newton john playing in the background and fag smoke in the air. you get the picture. if, however, you've never been to the UK before, they can be useful, otherwise it's just a bit of a laugh. i've not yet decided whether or not to attend.

clarie: you can't be serious about doing some reading already. oh dear. because if everyone starts to read then i'll inevitably start to feel inadequate and do the same :frown:

actually, i won't, i'm gonna conserve my energy so that when it comes time to do reading for essays i won't already be sick and tired fo the subject material.
ta ta
M

Reply 32

ClaireLeigh

Madjdy- You are right, i was just experiencing a brief moment of panic, but i will also conserve my energy for October, and i promise not to read any relevant books between now and then, (except perhaps the one Rob mentioned).

Cant quite bring myself to look at the reading list anyway.

Yours, reading Harry Potter,

Claire

clarie: you can't be serious about doing some reading already. oh dear. because if everyone starts to read then i'll inevitably start to feel inadequate and do the same :frown:

actually, i won't, i'm gonna conserve my energy so that when it comes time to do reading for essays i won't already be sick and tired fo the subject material.
ta ta
M

Reply 33

Phil (ver 2)

newbie38

Hello All,

I've been reading all your posts and had a few questions to ask, which you guys/gals may be able to help me with. I have just finished a law degree from King's, London but want to apply for the MSc IR at LSE and the MPhil at Cambridge (I don't want to do the 2 yr degree at Oxford). The thing is I got a 2:1 overall but, it was quite high. But, the MPhil at Cambridge states they want a 1st or a high 2:1. So, I wanted to know if all the successful candidates on this board received 1sts in their degrees and whether I might still have a good chance with a 2;1 in law?

Thanks

Hi Newbie - I'm off to Cambs in October for the IR M.Phil. My limited view is that most applicants are going to have firsts and a 2:1 is probably going to stack odds against you. This really shouldn't stop you from applying though. I would suggest applying for both London and Cambridge and if you have a strong enough research proposal you might balance the odds back in your favour. I'm sure there will be a few people with 2:1s on the course in October and there's no reason you couldn't be one of them next year..

Reply 34

OP

Shohei, Madjdy, and Claire:

Out of curiosity, do any of you plan to stay and read for the DPhil after the completion of the MPhil? Do you know if Oxford (or the dept.) offers any teaching fellowships or tuition/fee waivers for DPhil students? American universities often waive tution AND provide a generous compensation package for PhD students.

Just wondering if staying for the DPhil will mean two more years of financial hardship.

Hope you all are enjoying your last two months of freedom!

Cheers,

Robert

Reply 35

Hello Robert, this is Shohei, still waiting for the contract :smile:

Yes, I am thinking to go on for the DPhil. According to my understanding, if you go directly to the DPhil after completing the MPhil, you have to pay the tuition fee to the univ for only three further terms (i.e. one year), and the total amount you pay (2 years for MPhil and 1 year for DPhil) is equal to the fee you will pay if you only go to the DPhil (3 years for DPhil). I am not sure about the College fee though....

Of course regarding the time you spend, a DPhil after the MPhil generally takes further 2 years of full-time study (four years in total), while if you start a DPhil as a PRS (i.e. not from the MPhil level) you may complete it in three years. But this is merely a techinical debate and I imagine that a lot of DPhil students, no matter whether they start as a PRS or as an MPhil, spend 4 years or more for their completion of their theses anyway.

For further details you can see p. 31:
http://www.politics.ox.ac.uk/teaching/grad_ir/notes/Notes-Final04.pdf

Cheers,
Shohei

Reply 36

Madjdy, thanks for your advice.
Indeed, if it's going to be an orientation only on general issues maybe I shouldn't worry about it too much :smile:

Reply 37

Rob,
Shohei's right, you only have to pay fees for one further year if you continue on to DPHIL. That applies to the college as well. Regarding financial aid you won't get any more than you will now that you have an ORS. You can extend the ORS but that'll be pretty much it.
However, it IS possible to do a DPhil in one year after the Mphil (though extremely demanding). We can take our Mphil thesis and expand it and submit it as a Dphil. Every year a few students do that, but If I'm gonna do a doctorate, I'd rather take my time and do it properly rather than rush it. That said, I've never written that much before, so I don't know what it entails. So I don't know if I'll go on and do a doctorate, I think I'll see how the MPhil goes first, and if I'm happy at the department/college etc..One step at a time!
M

Reply 38

OP

Shohei,

If you haven't received your contract, you should make sure that you have been cleared by your college (i.e., that all conditions of your admission have been satisfied). The dept. will not mail your contract until you have been fully cleared.

Robert

Reply 39