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    So what has New Labour done to address the problem?
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    (Original post by Northumbrian)
    So what has New Labour done to address the problem?
    Well for a start there's the free school fruit scheme. All state school primary kids can have free fruit at lunchtime. I think that's great, it's providing a type of food that some kids don't have access to.
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    (Original post by Blur303)
    Without a healthy child population the country's economy will one day stagnate. Someone has already pointed out there is a massive malnutrition problem in the children today, particularly with the poorer kids. These kids may not get milk at home, instead only cheaper soft drinks. Surely even you can't be opposed to giving some of these kids a healthy diet. Oh no I forgot, you couldn't care less about everyone else as long as the wealthy elite is prospering. I suppose you would like your own private road, keep the poor unruly masses away I suppose.
    Economic stagnation? People weren't getting free milk during the Industrial Revolution but that did not stop the UK from becoming the richest country in the world. In the 1960s economic growth was around 30%, while in the 80s it was around 31%. People were not collapsing of malnutrition just because they did not get a glass of milk once a day while they were 6 years old. Also its not as if lots of people do physical work today, its more the service sector. Your merely scaremongering, if you want to support free school milk give a real argument. I have not a problem with them receiving them a healthy diet as long as the money is not forced out of my pockets.
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    *With reference to the title of this thread*

    Mr. Blair is a very intelligent men and very good at his job, I don't see why some minor mistakes in the past that everybody can make can cause such debates about him.

    Be with him, not against him.
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    (Original post by Northumbrian)
    So you don't think that there is an issue of malnutrition amongst the poorest children in society?
    If there is, to be frank, i don't care.
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    (Original post by objectivism)
    If there is, to be frank, i don't care.
    And that sums you up completely. Someone who is clearly accustomed to a high standard of living and doesn't give a damn about the less fortunate. It may go against every fibre in your body but just for a moment can you think about others. Maybe if you had been less fortunate in life I'm sure you would have not taken kindly to the pathetic laissez-faire attitude you preach. And by the way, the health problem faced by today's younger generation supercedes anything ever seen before. Today's kids might not outlive their parents. If we have a shrinking younger workforce how is this not going to hurt our economy? I'm not saying free school milk is going to solve obesity or child malnutrition, of course not but it is something. Fortunately, today most schools are taking up the free school fruit policy. So, don't worry your money's not going on milk but fruit instead. Well done for being so charitable.
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    And that sums you up completely. Someone who is clearly accustomed to a high standard of living and doesn't give a damn about the less fortunate. It may go against every fibre in your body but just for a moment can you think about others. Maybe if you had been less fortunate in life I'm sure you would have not taken kindly to the pathetic laissez-faire attitude you preach.
    I believe what i believe because it is moral.

    And by the way, the health problem faced by today's younger generation supercedes anything ever seen before. Today's kids might not outlive their parents. If we have a shrinking younger workforce how is this not going to hurt our economy? I'm not saying free school milk is going to solve obesity or child malnutrition, of course not but it is something.
    Are you serious? Health is wrose for the young of today than in say the 1850s? All are living longer and it is expected to continue that way. Your views are absurd - shrinking workforce? - why is the bbc not reporting this collapse in the youth workforce because they never had milk while they were in school in the 1980s?

    Its something? What is it? Why not spend the money on more PE lessons and equipment if obesity is such a problem?

    Fortunately, today most schools are taking up the free school fruit policy. So, don't worry your money's not going on milk but fruit instead. Well done for being so charitable.
    Thats your problem, your obsessed with giving, the problem of course is that you want to give others people money to causes you see as good.
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    (Original post by objectivism)
    In the 1960s economic growth was around 30%, while in the 80s it was around 31%.
    That seems very high; are decimal points missing?

    EDIT: No PM is perfect obviously, TB has his good and bad points. On the whole though, he's done a fair bit for the economy, as well as for Gay Rights - although it's debatable how far he was responsible for these. He's undeniably a very charismatic leader, he's defended our interests in Europe... Areas where I dont support him would be the bovious ones to do with the "war on terror" as well as an alarming rise in the extent of the use of regressive taxation.
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    (Original post by objectivism)


    Thats your problem, your obsessed with giving, the problem of course is that you want to give others people money to causes you see as good.
    Well go and crucify me! How dare I want to do things to help others! How naughty of me. What a terrible philosophy that is; actually helping others. If only I had gone to your private school, I could have been indoctrinated in how to be well and truly selfish and yet still manage to present "moral arguments". From now on, let's let the rich wallow in their wealth whilst everyone else fends for themselves and dies. That's what I call a moral argument alright.
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    (Original post by Blur303)
    Well go and crucify me! How dare I want to do things to help others! How naughty of me. What a terrible philosophy that is; actually helping others. If only I had gone to your private school, I could have been indoctrinated in how to be well and truly selfish and yet still manage to present "moral arguments". From now on, let's let the rich wallow in their wealth whilst everyone else fends for themselves and dies. That's what I call a moral argument alright.
    Can't you read? You want to be charitble with other's money. So is it ok to mug you as long as i give the money to a hospital etc.
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    (Original post by objectivism)
    Can't you read? You want to be charitble with other's money. So is it ok to mug you as long as i give the money to a hospital etc.
    Can't you understand?? Mugging and taxation are completely different. Now no, you don't believe so because you're in a position where taxation may hurt you a little. But taxation can also benefit you, you can use the country's hospitals, local services, transport etc. Everyone has to pay tax, even the poor. You could have gone to a state school, just becuase your parents chose not to send you there does not mean that they should be exempt from paying taxes.
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    (Original post by Blur303)
    Can't you understand?? Mugging and taxation are completely different. Now no, you don't believe so because you're in a position where taxation may hurt you a little. But taxation can also benefit you, you can use the country's hospitals, local services, transport etc. Everyone has to pay tax, even the poor. You could have gone to a state school, just becuase your parents chose not to send you there does not mean that they should be exempt from paying taxes.
    Your using the same logic though. Your argument was i'm right to help others, well so is the mugger if he's giving the wallet of a millionaire to a hospital. This is basic logic, i find it worrying you can't see this. May hurt a little? Try 40% of your income, that is not 'a little'. Also a principle is a principle, it does not matter if a mugger takes £10 or a theif hacks into a system an takes £10 million. Wrong is wrong. No i don't use the hospitals, transport etc. I think if you don't buy something you shouldn;t have to pay for it - i don't go into a shop, have a look around at all the nice clothes, but than expect to pay towards someone's jumper.
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    (Original post by objectivism)
    Your using the same logic though. Your argument was i'm right to help others, well so is the mugger if he's giving the wallet of a millionaire to a hospital. This is basic logic, i find it worrying you can't see this. May hurt a little? Try 40% of your income, that is not 'a little'. Also a principle is a principle, it does not matter if a mugger takes £10 or a theif hacks into a system an takes £10 million. Wrong is wrong. No i don't use the hospitals, transport etc. I think if you don't buy something you shouldn;t have to pay for it - i don't go into a shop, have a look around at all the nice clothes, but than expect to pay towards someone's jumper.
    If your family is paying 40% tax they must be extremely wealthy. You can therefore afford to pay a little more. I personally find it worrying that you appear to have no social conscience and the only thing you are concerned with is your own material worth. It is only simple logic if you look at it from your own blinkered view that taxation is theft. I repeat it isn't. Taxation is a means that government can provide services for ALL. If you wanted to use these services you could. The fact that you don't is your own problem and maybe if you want to take back some of your tax money you should.
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    If your family is paying 40% tax they must be extremely wealthy. You can therefore afford to pay a little more.

    Why should the hard woking and the succesful be punsihed for employing people and being par of economic growth? It seems perverse to punish the successful, its like punsihing those who get A's in school.

    I personally find it worrying that you appear to have no social conscience and the only thing you are concerned with is your own material worth.
    You've been taken in by altrustic propaganda.


    It is only simple logic if you look at it from your own blinkered view that taxation is theft. I repeat it isn't. Taxation is a means that government can provide services for ALL.
    But surely it should be about if you WANT them. If the government used taxes to provide free curtains for all, would that be ok? After all everyone is benefiting.
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    (Original post by objectivism)
    You've been taken in by altrustic propaganda.

    Yes you're so right, everyone else is so foolish we just can't see that your way is so right.


    But surely it should be about if you WANT them. If the government used taxes to provide free curtains for all, would that be ok? After all everyone is benefiting.[/QUOTE]

    Yes that would be fine, I could do with some new curtains.
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    (Original post by objectivism)
    Why should the hard woking and the succesful be punsihed for employing people and being par of economic growth? It seems perverse to punish the successful, its like punsihing those who get A's in school.
    Mrs Thatcher, is that you?! It may be a "perverse incentive" to you, by why equate it to punishment?
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    ]Yes you're so right, everyone else is so foolish we just can't see that your way is so right.
    Majority does not equal right.


    Yes that would be fine, I could do with some new curtains.

    I'm not sure if your joking or not but if your not you are in the wrong party, you should be in the communists.
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    (Original post by Rose64)
    Mrs Thatcher, is that you?! It may be a "perverse incentive" to you, by why equate it to punishment?
    Having my money taken is punsihement to me. Its worse when it gets spent on things i don't want it spent on. Its a punishment if i never use so many of the public services that my families taxes fund. If i went into a shop, looked around, kept warm, out of the rain etc (and so benefited) but was thanasked to pay a bit towards someone's jumper id consider this wrong. Would you?
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    I think Mr Blair has done a great number of good things for this country, especially for economy and health.
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    (Original post by objectivism)
    Having my money taken is punsihement to me. Its worse when it gets spent on things i don't want it spent on. Its a punishment if i never use so many of the public services that my families taxes fund. If i went into a shop, looked around, kept warm, out of the rain etc (and so benefited) but was thanasked to pay a bit towards someone's jumper id consider this wrong. Would you?
    Well aside from that irrelevance about someone's jumper, I don't think taxing people for a public service that will benefit society at large is wrong, no. We obviously have totally opposing ideologies, so I don't think this is going to go anywhere. I'm quite happy not to be a sovereign individual thanks.
 
 
 

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