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is it fair that america gets the blame for israels actions ?? watch

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    (Original post by ArthurOliver)
    What's a homeland for? Not to get blended out! To preserve your unique heritage.

    Why not White nations?

    You have no answer? You're racist then.
    Either you are just ignoring what I said, or are stupid.

    What is a "white nation"? Whites exist from Russia to the US. How do you define "white"?
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    (Original post by zaf1986)
    Either you are just ignoring what I said, or are stupid.

    What is a "white nation"? Whites exist from Russia to the US. How do you define "white"?
    Not difficult, if you were honest I would agree with your understanding of Whiteness defining people from Russia to the US, tho' would point out those same people, as defined and recognised by you also live outside those parameters.

    Are there any White Zulus or Bushmen, or Black Eskimos or Apaches. Why are White nations uniquely dismissed and their race and culture considered fungible? Are you racist?
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    (Original post by ArthurOliver)
    Not difficult, if you were honest I would agree with your understanding of Whiteness defining people from Russia to the US, tho' would point out those same people, as defined and recognised by you also live outside those parameters.

    Are there any White Zulus or Bushmen, or Black Eskimos or Apaches. Why are White nations uniquely dismissed and their race and culture considered fungible? Are you racist?
    If I say I am racist, will you stop repeating yourself?

    You still haven't defined "white". That is why I cannot, and will not, answer any question until you do so.
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    (Original post by zaf1986)
    If I say I am racist, will you stop repeating yourself?

    You still haven't defined "white". That is why I cannot, and will not, answer any question until you do so.
    Any term widely used and widely understood can be presumed to express a coherent idea. Such a presumption is defeasible but without a good reason Zaf for rejecting the word, I shall consider it appropriate and meaningful. Mutual understanding would be expected in most conversations. In fact I believe we do both understand - we both know who Whites are and that Trevor Macdonald, Osama bin Laden and Lenny Henry ain't them.

    To humour you, this can serve, "The widely-used and understood term 'White race' today generally refers to a caucasoid person of European descent, typically of an ethnic or national group which has a centuries long heritage in Europe." That's what I meant by 'White', I will not indulge your bu****it on this semantic point further. If you raise it again I shall assume you simply dodge my questions.

    Why shouldn't the White Nations of the world be entitled to maintain their traditional homelands as White homelands if Israelis and Palestinians have a right to create entirely new homelands to preserve their own unique heritages?

    Why the genocide of one and the preservation of another? Race as commonly understood is a part of most national identities, as I asked you before, are there any White Zulus or Bushmen, or Black Eskimos or Apaches?

    Why are White nations uniquely dismissed and their race and culture considered fungible? Are you racist?
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    This argument started with "For once I agree with you".

    :tsr: :rolleyes:
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    (Original post by bashment)
    is it fair that america gets the blame for israels actions ??
    Israel would not be capable of behaving as it does without American support.
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    (Original post by ArthurOliver)
    The fallout from the whole horrible fiasco affects the whole world but the blame probably belongs to very few.

    The ideal of Zionism is pretty irresistible. Few can begrudge the Jewish desire for a homeland, I can't condemn them for attaining it by whatever means. My primary gripe with Israel now, is not their treatment of Palestinians (that's a problem for Palestinians), what I most object to is that the rest of the world must pick up the tab for the failure of the Jewish Zionist ideal.

    At best the Zionist ideal hoped to lay to rest the ancient slander of parasitism that Jews have always been tagged with. Not only would Jews have their own homeland, but they would no longer be living off the labour of others, they'd be paying their own way, doing their own manual labour, toiling in their own fields and shovelling their own sh..ditches.

    Trouble is, I'm not convinced that the claims of Israel functioning only via 'economic apartheid' in which non-Jews do most of the ditchy jobs, maybe even with an ethnic stratification of Jewish groups, are unfair. I'm not convinced even that the 'economic' prefix for apartheid is necessary.

    I'm concerned also that the massive aid to Israel from the US requires a similar level of partisan subversion of the media, congress and parties. Israel's military power so overwhelms it's neighbours that I feel the continued willingness to take the US Dollar is blatant greed.

    So Israel is not just keeping alive the parasite slander when it's all but dead in the rest of the world, it's endless grasping and the exploitation of Palestinians is actually justifying the claim. And because the US gives so much to Israel, the EU (me included) gives to the Palestinians.

    Somebody convince me I'm wrong, show me that;
    1) non-Jews don't do most of the ****** jobs in Israel
    2) Non-Jewish citizens aren't a second class
    3) there isn't bias in US media
    4) Jewish groups don't fund US politicians at obscene levels

    These are widespread beliefs and they appear to be backed up by quite a lot of evidence, if true they are also easily fixed.

    Israel can stand alone and start behaving like a modern democratic state, it just has to break with the politicians and policies which have brought it into so much worldwide disrepute.

    It has to rediscover the ideals of Zionism which most of us believe were once sincerely held, until then there will be no peace and Israel will remain a pariah.

    I look at Israel and see that the very ideals of Zionism, self sufficiency and overturning age-old prejudices are thwarted by the actions of their leaders. Am I wrong?
    :congrats: good answer.
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    (Original post by Phonicsdude)
    This argument started with "For once I agree with you".

    :tsr: :rolleyes:
    It did didn't it! :blush:

    Get back to the US/Israel question...
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    Any term widely used and widely understood can be presumed to express a coherent idea. Such a presumption is defeasible but without a good reason Zaf for rejecting the word, I shall consider it appropriate and meaningful. Mutual understanding would be expected in most conversations. In fact I believe we do both understand - we both know who Whites are and that Trevor Macdonald, Osama bin Laden and Lenny Henry ain't them.

    To humour you, this can serve, "The widely-used and understood term 'White race' today generally refers to a caucasoid person of European descent, typically of an ethnic or national group which has a centuries long heritage in Europe." That's what I meant by 'White', I will not indulge your bu****it on this semantic point further. If you raise it again I shall assume you simply dodge my questions.

    Why shouldn't the White Nations of the world be entitled to maintain their traditional homelands as White homelands if Israelis and Palestinians have a right to create entirely new homelands to preserve their own unique heritages?

    Why the genocide of one and the preservation of another? Race as commonly understood is a part of most national identities, as I asked you before, are there any White Zulus or Bushmen, or Black Eskimos or Apaches?

    Why are White nations uniquely dismissed and their race and culture considered fungible? Are you racist?
    Are you suggesting the whole of Europe should be made one, since they are all "white?" If so, I'm all for it.

    I did not suggest anywhere that people who are "white" should be wiped out. It was merely a hypothesis. If white or black or brown or yellow people were wiped out, it would not affect me in the slightest.

    As I reiterate, I do not believe the colour of skin = race. In my opinion, and obviously you disagree, there is only one race - the human race. All others are merely skin colours or pieces of land. Both of which I don't really care about.

    The only reason I have argued for a Palestinian state is because the conditions they are living in - neither here nor there - is not doing them or the rest of the world any good. A Palestinian state and an Israeli state is a step towards world peace.

    Again, I wonder why you keep repeating the same questions, when I have continually answered them? Maybe you don't like the answers? :rolleyes:
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    (Original post by kizdesai)
    I don't thin the answer is as black and white as yes and no. Have i heard correctly? Israel recieves more US aid than any other country?
    I just heard a few days ago from a person studying Development Studies in the US that Israel gets a huge majority of all foreign aid. That person is pretty informed so I think that's probably true.
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    yes israel is the largest receiver of US foreign aid and military aid !!

    this website is quite good for facts and figures http://www.ifamericansknew.org/
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    (Original post by bashment)
    yes israel is the largest receiver of US foreign aid and military aid !!

    this website is quite good for facts and figures http://www.ifamericansknew.org/
    This maybe true but where would you rather put your money, the pockets of terrorists or to a military?

    Does the fact that the G8 gave $3bn to Palestine go completely unnoticed?
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    (Original post by oilcan)
    This maybe true but where would you rather put your money, the pockets of terrorists or to a military?

    Does the fact that the G8 gave $3bn to Palestine go completely unnoticed?
    wow yeah i think it does.. i didnt know that anyway.

    and i see your point about the military/terrorist argument but the military i dont think can be said are any better than the terrorists. all they are is a more organised version.
 
 
 

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